MichaelCalistro
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Yet it worked on Aizen because he is an Arrancar now?Not how that works at all but sure buddy
The girl never hit an arrancar with that armor
Why even bother call it anti-hierro armor then? Crazy logic.-
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BAN-KAI! Bleach General Discussion
- Thread starter Zoro21043
- Start date
Why even bother call it anti-hierro armor then? Crazy logic.
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Okay, i need to check something with you : Do you believe that an anti-tank mine only work on tanks ? That if a regular soldier trigger it, it won't kill him if it explode on him because it's the wrong "unit type" ? Your awnser will decide if i entertain you further or not.Yet it worked on Aizen because he is an Arrancar now?
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This didn’t happen in the manga lol it happened in the anime
You and a lot of people make it seem like because someone “clashes” with someone they scale to their highest LS strength
What more would cour 4 have in store for us? We have direct evidence of people of true shikai Ichigo levels going all out to support the weight of existence since cour 2. It sounds like you’re waiting for a reason to scale everyone to it tbh.
I have no idea what LS fear Yama has. Toshiro at least has one for freezing a falling city. This site is in shambles if they really accept Yama getting almost getting nuked to death means he can lift a certain amount of weight from that
BoastJr
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UNOFFICIAL VSBW AURA FARMING TOURNAMENT !
We’re introducing a tournament inspired by the UEFA Champions League — but instead of football, this is pure aura competition. Characters face off in matches where the only thing that matters is who delivers the better aura moments. No scaling. No shortcuts. Just arguments. At the end, only...
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My argument is more or less about the possibility of uryu doing more against Yhwach than about ichigo.
If ichigo struggles to overwhelm uryu shown consistently btw and they clash multiple times EVENLY. Then uryu could be relative to ichigo in that category. There is no single instance in the anime where ichigo physically overpowered uryu that didn't require sneak attacks or off guard attacks and the funny thing is ichigo did this in both fights mind you. Now I am not saying this alone would justify it, so that's why I am waiting for cour 4 to see his fight against jugram who seems to be weilding a similar dark reaistu of sk yhwach and whether he does more against Yhwach himself seeing as he has a personal vendetta against yhwach in fact more than any person in that arc. So yeah I want to wait obviously.
We don't even know the full context behind the izurasando, something that will be explained in Cour 4. So yeah waiting for cour 4 is the best approach and if Cour 4 shows otherwise then that will be the end of it. You think I don't have an argument, that is true but that applies to you too. Cour 4 will explain a lot of things you are arguing with me for now.
He contained the explosion from wonderweise with his physicals, his tensile strength would scale to the force of the explosion. Though I am still checking it out.
You don't fully understand how LS works and that's okay. Anything that is achieved with tensile strength is an LS feat. Yama dampened the force of the explosion with his body at the epicenter.... if he was far from the epicenter then yes, it wouldn't count but fortunately he was. Lifting weights isn't the only LS metric. Also what "nuked" him was the heat of the blast not the force of the explosion, if it was the force he wouldn't remain in the epicenter or even have a body to begin with.
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ShiftCtrlAltDeleteTabFn
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Why are so many people voting for Ulquiorra here?
PizzaDante67
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I just saw tha poll and voted for Barragan lol. Ig the „Ulquiorra is the strongest Espada“ idea is still a thing. I even saw someone say that Segunda Etapa Ulquiorra beats True Shikai Ichigo…..
Why are so many people voting for Ulquiorra here?
Apollonir.Scale
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Ulquiorra is already more powerful. Manga, Nestle to Night, and SAFWY prove it.
Many people don't know about SE Ulquiorra's scaling. If those who say they'll take True Shikai are taking Dangai=>Vasto Lord=>Ulquiorra, then yes, according to this scaling, he's stronger than True Shikai. Of course, if you ask me to show you the CRT of this, it would be very difficult to convince people, so I would either not do it or postpone it until summer. People have a lot of prejudices, and I would need to write a long article addressing numerous counter-arguments.
Hellscream
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What am i even reading
PizzaDante67
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saying that Vasto Lorde ichigo is somehow comparable to Dangai Ichigo is genuinely crazy.
And i also don’t see how SE Ulquiorra is =< to VL ichigo, when he got like low diffed at most.
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Incomprehensible.
Hellscream
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Good day to you as well Hellscream
BoastJr
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AURA FARMING LEAGUE ! MATCHDAY 6: AIZEN VS POCHITA (WEEK 1)
Sosuke Aizen vs Pochita! From the quiet depths of deception… emerges a man who rewrites reality with a single thought. The architect of illusions… the god of manipulation… Sosuke Aizen. And across from him… A revving engine of pure destruction… a devil born not from fear—but from chainsaws...
AIZEN VS POCHITA !
Apollonir.Scale
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It's directly stated in the episodes where he obtains the Dangai form.
OMZ: That's right, you haven't seen this form, of course. This is the form you used to defeat Ulquiorra.
Then you use evidence that the amount of power White gave him is greater than the amount of Quincy power OMZ gave him. From there, you say that a large part of Dangai's power comes from Vasto Lord. He obtains both Dangai and Vasto Lord on the same day.
His survival from exposure to Cero
Their ability to perform Cero Clash
Ulquiorra, with one arm and one leg, being able to cut off the Vasto Lord's horn with his Lanza Del Relampago
The Vasto Lord needing to use Partial Resurrection to destroy the Lanza Del Relampago. Otherwise, he wouldn't be able to destroy it. Most people don't know about Partial Resurrection and think he can destroy it with pure power.
The film version of the fight is also canon, and if you use it, Ulquiorra is more scaled up to VL.
To consider the film version of the fight as canon, I'm using a quote from Kubo in an interview and one of his answers in a Q&A. Of course, I'm not considering the whole film as canon, just the Ulquiorra vs. Vasto Lord part.
Excellence616
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Proof of this?
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Wouldn't that mean Segunda makes Ulquiorra unholy amounts of times stronger than his Resurrection form? Going from weaker than Starrk to no diffing fourth fusion Aizen lol. Same for Ichigo. It's just crazy
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I always thoughts the Kenpachi scaling from CFYOW is bs. 0 explanations about his leap in power, yet his supposed power up is MUCH bigger than the amp he got from Unohana's fight, dying dozens of times to regain his old power. No way there wouldn't be an explanation if there was a legit crazy power up.
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CFYOW is borderline fanfic, we all know that
Apollonir.Scale
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The proof is here. The first is the interview about the film, the second is the conversation in the Q&A you asked about. When Kubo was asked about his favorite Bleach film, instead of saying the 4th film/Hell-Verse, he specifically said Ulquiorra vs. Vasto Lord. We know he didn't like the rest of the film. In the first scan, he says "Omission to the main story." That's why I argue that this is the original Ulquiorra vs. Vasto Lord he had in mind. For example, when TYBW was writing the manga for the Arc, he edited parts in the TYBW Anime version to finish the part he couldn't write as he wanted, and we on this wiki consider the edited Anime version more canon than the manga version, it's the same logic.
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What I am hearing is that either Ulquiorra is stronger than Base Aizen, or that Base Aizen, by being consistently stated and demonstrably depicted as stronger than Ulquiorra, is more comparable to Dangai Ichigo, to a point of the Hogyoku providing less powerful enhancements than initially assumed. In either scenario, I disagree wholeheartedly.
ItsMeat
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Exactly lol
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@Apollonir.Scale is the new @Reio35
Apollonir.Scale
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There's nothing to prove that Base Aizen is stronger than Segunda Etapa Ulquiorra. We know Aizen doesn't know Segunda Etapa.
ItsMeat
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That's only by Ulquiorra's words and I would really really doubt them, considering how op Aizen's Info Analysis is and how the feats match the statement + the fact segunda etapa is on this page
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Apollonir.Scale
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I've encountered people using this scan as an argument before, and it's very easy to answer. The fact that SE Ulquiorra's image is in the background while Aizen is speaking doesn't mean he saw him. In Bleach, showing another character on screen while a character is speaking is never used to mean he saw them. For example, in the panel where Ichigo is thinking about the events of his fight with Ulquiorra, a flashback of the Vasto Lord is shown. But we know that Ichigo learned about the Vasto Lord's form in the episodes where he's practicing jinzen in Dangai.
OMZ: Of course you didn't see this form. This is the form you used to kill Ulquiorra.
So no, showing Ulquiorra's final form in the background while Aizen is speaking doesn't mean he saw him.
Besides, the evidence that he didn't see him is stronger.
-Ulquiorra states that he didn't even show it to Aizen.
-The databook states that even Aizen didn't see the Segunda Etap.
-In Arrunerio's conversation with Rukia, it was stated that Aizen rules wherever the light shines. Ulquiorra, on the other hand, revealed his SE form in Las Noches.
"Aizen created a blue sky within the dome that covers Las Noches. Aizen rules wherever the light shines."
Also, how could he get information about Ulquiorra and Ichigo's battle while surrounded by Yamamoto's flames?
ItsMeat
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?
Not saying he did it then? Ulquiorra was around him for some months. Long enough for aizen to easily figure he achieved a second ressurecion, especially given his op info analysis.
Shunsui didn't show aizen he had the muken keys in his heart, nor did he show the scratch. Aizen knew regardless
Apollonir.Scale
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I added the link later.
However, there's no proof that Aizen knew SE. Similarly, we don't know when Ulquiorra obtained this form.
Besides, even if Aizen knew SE Ulquiorra, what difference would it make? There's no reason for him not to have someone stronger than himself in his army. And if you ask, "What if he betrays him?", we know how loyal Ulquiorra is to Aizen. It's even been stated that Ulquiorra is the person Aizen trusts most. I think that was just a statement applicable only to the Espada.
Excellence616
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Apollonir.Scale
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This view is also an omission to the main story.''
It is stated here.
In addition, Ulquiorra says that after using Lanza del Relampago, it wasn't as easy as he thought. This indicates that he hadn't used this ability before. Indirectly, you might assume he had never used this form before.
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There is evidence. A nice piece of evidence is that Aizen himself indicates the Espada follow him, not because of his charisma or intelligence; I would agree both are contributing factors but aren't significant ones. It is because of his superior strength. That is confirmed and then furthered by Gin, in his inner monologue, talking with nobody else except himself--so there is no reason to believe he is trying to convince anyone with his statement--that Aizen is without parallels, and his strength is the main contributing reason to why the Espada follow him.
Ulquiorra doesn't follow the will of Aizen because of his ability to comprehend and act accordingly to new or future information; he wasn't convinced, rhetorically, into the position. It was because Aizen is so strong that even Ulquiorra believes himself weaker, which is why he follows him. Ulquiorra respects strength and that which is perceivable. His entire character is centered around discovering invisible qualities like emotions are real and do have influence over others like power does; he doesn't initially believe these things are important. It makes less sense with his character if you assume he is stronger than Aizen, as he wouldn't respect or follow him if he was weaker. It does make sense if Aizen is stronger though.
This would fit squarely with other information, which supports Aizen being significantly stronger than anyone in the Espada, including Ulquiorra in all facets. We've been over this so many different times, in different threads, proposing different arguments. In all cases, it has been demonstrably proven Aizen is superior to all Espada without exception.
Apollonir.Scale
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No need to do D.A. either.
Vasto Lord>>>>FKT Black-Eyed Hollow Mask Ichigo~~Pre-Hogyoku Aizen
Unfortunately, his black-eyed and normal-eyed forms aren't separated into two distinct forms in the profile.
And VL being so powerful aligns with Aizen's narrative. Aizen stated that Ichigo would come with a new power and that he wanted to further perfect it. Since Dangai wasn't in Aizen's plans, this statement includes Vasto Lord. And Aizen was in his Hogyoku form when he said these words, the one where he destroyed Kotetsu. This further supports my Dangai=>Vasto Lord scaling because Dangai Ichigo defeated an Aizen form that was one level superior to the one Aizen said these words to.
Apollonir.Scale
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I haven't seen such a good argument in a long time.
I don't think the idea of the Espada following him for his power applies to everyone. For example, Baraggan was forced into the Espada.
Also, Kubo said something like, "Aizen rescued him from the darkness and emptiness he had fallen into, giving him a purpose," in response to the question of why Ulquiorra served Aizen. I don't have a scan of that, but I remember something like that. Unless I'm experiencing the Mandela effect.
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Because he couldn't beat Aizen, once again proving the statement that he follows because he's strong.
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Wouldn't Ulq=Vasto Lorde=Dangai mean Ulq and Vasto Lorde>2nd/3rd/4th Fusion Aizen and Full Power Squad Zero, as well as make them relative to Final Fusion Aizen?
Aizen's stupid, why did he get the Hogyoku when he could just asked Ulquiorra to obliterate Squad Zero once he created the Oken using Ulquiorra's SP instead of using his own?
Aizen's stupid, why did he get the Hogyoku when he could just asked Ulquiorra to obliterate Squad Zero once he created the Oken using Ulquiorra's SP instead of using his own?
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If vl has whole potential of his hollow power yes its comparable to dangai or true shikai but I dont think vl is whole potential of ichigo hollow power its just stronger type of others ichigo hollow form. Ichigo had turn nearly hollow at mask training so thats hollow also comparable to dangai or vl?
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If Aizen didn't know about Segunda he wouldn't ask Ulquiorra to do it cause Resurrection Ulq is below the top 3 Espada and nowhere near base Aizen.
Either way I don't think Segunda Ulquiorra is close to even base Aizen. Segunda Ulq needs overwhelming proof for being anywhere near 2nd/3rd/4th Fusion Aizen.
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I'm actually surprised you guys are even debating this, isn't this common sense? Additionally Uryu compared full Hollow Ichigo reiatsu to Zaraki and Cien as well...So he is definitely nowhere near shinigami Aizen, let alone Dangai Ichigo.
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