- 651
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This will be an improvement on these two blogs, in addition to improving the multiplier for Super Saiyan God(And therefore of the ssjb, ssjbe and uio)
First the Multipliers:
SSJG would go from x160,000 to 20 Million
SSJB would go from x8 million to x1 Billion
SSJBE would go from x160 Million to 20 Billion
UIO would go from x640 Million to 80 Billion
Ap + Speed Upgrade:
The new blog(Or change the values of the other two blogs)
Changes:
1. Gohan SSJ2 50% Superior to Super Perfect Cell, so his AP is: >2.106 Kilofoe(Gohan is superior to Cell, Cell could only damage him because Gohan had low Yuki (courage) and according to Akira Toriyama:
Yūki (勇気 lit. "Courage"): The value of a person. It is based on their emotional disposition at a given moment. If an individual is afraid of another individual, then they lose their Yūki, and consequently a considerable amount of their power.
In battle, the most important thing is the size of your ki, and your control over it. Ki as a concept of course includes such spiritual powers as energy [genki], courage [yūki], and right-mindedness [shōki]. No matter how much you train, there are limits to physical strength, and the only way to overcome that is through ki. I think Goku was able to approach the mightiest warriors in the universe through strengthening his ki.
Energy, Courage, and Right-Mindedness — The word “energy” [genki] is well-known, but if one asks if you do not have energy if you have even one sickness [byōki], it is difficult to come up with an answer. There are people who are healthy yet do not have any energy, and there are people who are sick, yet full of energy. Plus, even among people who have roughly the same power, for example, there were people who gritted their teeth and stood their ground when Demon King Piccolo attacked them, yet there were also people who trembled and fled. Thinking about it this way, perhaps you will understand that a variety of different “ki” are indispensable in battle. In the world of Chinese martial arts, exemplified by T’ai-chi Ch’uan, ki training and control is given great importance.
In Dragon Ball, the dark mage Bobbidi invented a machine that measures and absorbs ki, but current science cannot measure ki levels or store it anywhere. However, when someone cheers you on, you can “receive energy and courage [yūki]” from them. “Ki” is something that cannot be seen with the eyes, yet it is there.
The reason is obvious; when he faced Cell in Super Saiyan form, he was extremely restrained and didn't want to fight, and when Cell return, Gohan had lost his father.
He was also able to return Cell's Kamehameha, which he launched with all his power, without even charging his own, also he can damage cell 3rd grade like form, And he is declared the strongest in the universe.
Gohan SSJ is stronger than Perfect Cell
The guides say that Gohan used all his power, but they obviously mean all his remaining power, as Sparking Zero says.
a technique is one thing and battle damage is another, Goku lost against Tambourine because he was tired (meaning his energy from battle damage limited his power), Vegeta in the Saiyan saga comments that his power is pathetic after being beaten up, So when you lose energy due to damage, it limits your power
Furthermore, the scaling of the Buu saga is consistent with this:
Gohan SSJ (Cell Games) > Vegeta SSJ (7 Years Later)
Vegeta SSJ (7 Years Later) > Dabura
Dabura ≈ Super Perfect Cell
Therefore:
Gohan SSJ (Cell Games) > Super Perfect Cell
1. Direct Evidence
Vegeta explicitly states multiple times that he can defeat Dabura.
These statements are not mere boasting, since:
They are made in an analytical context (while discussing with Gohan).
He includes others as capable, not just himself.
Goku indirectly supports this and never contradicts him.
During Dabura vs Gohan, Goku tells Vegeta to let Gohan handle it, which implicitly acknowledges that Vegeta is capable as well.
Furthermore, even though Goku could have inferred Vegeta’s SSJ2 from his displayed power in SSJ, he does not do so. This reinforces that SSJ2 is not required for the claim that Vegeta can defeat Dabura.
Conclusion: These are consistent, narrative-supported statements.
2. Character Perspective
Goku, Gohan, and Shin all witness Vegeta’s power in SSJ.
SSJ2 was not considered a factor, as shown by:
Shin allowing Goku and Vegeta to fight, believing they would not generate enough energy.
When both transform into SSJ2, Shin admits his calculations were wrong, proving he did not account for that level.
Additionally:
No one knew Vegeta had SSJ2.
Although Goku had it, he kept it restrained and did not reveal its full power.
Gohan, Shin, and even Goku show surprise at Vegeta’s SSJ2, reinforcing that this level was not part of prior evaluations.
The same applies to Gohan and Shin, who had access to the same (or even more) information than Goku, yet are still surprised upon seeing SSJ2 from both Goku and Vegeta. This further confirms it was not included in their scaling.
Conclusion:
Statements like Vegeta > Dabura are based on SSJ, not SSJ2.
3. Main Implication
If:
Vegeta SSJ (7 Years Later) > Dabura
Dabura ≈ Super Perfect Cell
Then:
Vegeta SSJ (7 Years Later) > Super Perfect Cell
4. Saiyan Scaling
Vegeta acknowledges that he is inferior to Goku during the Yakon fight.
However, he is later surprised that Goku has surpassed Gohan, implying he did not expect someone above him to also surpass Gohan.
This establishes that, in Vegeta’s perspective:
Gohan (Cell Games) > Vegeta (7 Years Later)
Meaning Gohan remains a superior benchmark within Vegeta’s scaling.
5. Main Conclusion
If:
Gohan (Cell Games) > Vegeta (7 Years Later)
And
Vegeta SSJ (7 Years Later) > Super Perfect Cell
Then:
Gohan SSJ (Cell Games) > Vegeta SSJ (7 Years Later) > Super Perfect Cell
6. Final Conclusion
Gohan SSJ (Cell Games) > Super Perfect Cell)
2. Classic and Saiyan saga Goku backscaling(22nd Tournament Goku is Large Planet Level, Saiyan Saga Goku is Brown Dwarf level, Goku Kaioken x10 > Frieza First Form, This was discarded because it contradicted lunar scaling, but now the planetary level is accepted, In addition, Goku is listed as superior in speed, and is even comparable to his second form And we know that in Dragon Ball, power and speed They increase at the same rate. )
3. With the new scaling, anyone equal to or stronger than Goku in the battle with Raditz is FTL(Because of the increases, 22nd tournament >0.1, King Piccolo Saga >0.3c, 23rd tournament >0.9c, raditz fight >1.8c)
4. Vegetto Base ≥ Buuhan (Vegito is stronger than gokhan who is stronger than buutenks and likely stronger to buuhan, Furthermore, vegito is declared to be the strongest and even invincible by the manga, all this just in his base form
5. Imperfect Cell >x3 Piccolo and 17(Piccolo's charged attacks should be superior to Goku's Kamehameha from the Vegeta saga(>x2.2) and stronger than his own charged attacks back in his fight with raditz, because It is at a more advanced point in history)
(The justification for the changes are in the notes, If you don't understand something, let me know and I'll explain it in more detail.)
Also in the blog, the oozaru increases its speed; this is because
The Oozaru increases speed; the drawback is maneuverability, not velocity
The claim that the Oozaru form does not increase speed is based on a misinterpretation of statements that clearly refer to mobility limitations, not to a lack of speed scaling.
Paragus’ line about “using the power of the Oozaru without the slow movements” is describing a biomechanical issue inherent to large bodies: when a character undergoes a massive increase in size, their rotational inertia increases, which directly affects how easily they can turn, adjust direction, and perform precise movements. This results in reduced agility and maneuverability, but it does not imply any reduction in raw speed or movement output. The statement is therefore addressing how the Oozaru body handles movement, not how fast it can move in a straight line or in bursts. Broly avoids this drawback simply because he retains a humanoid form, eliminating the handling issues associated with gigantism.
This interpretation is directly supported by explicit canonical evidence in Dragon Ball. During the Saiyan Saga, Goku states that Vegeta in Oozaru form is “too fast,” to the point that not even a Kaioken x5 is sufficient to catch him. Since Kaioken is a multiplier that enhances all combat-relevant stats, including speed, this establishes a direct comparison where Oozaru Vegeta exceeds an already amplified speed state. If the Oozaru transformation did not increase speed—or worse, reduced it—there would be no reason for Goku to be unable to keep up. This is not indirect scaling; it is a clear in-universe statement confirming that Oozaru amplifies speed alongside power.
Furthermore, the internal logic of the series reinforces this. In Dragon Ball, transformations and multipliers consistently scale all primary physical attributes: strength, durability, speed, and reaction time. There is no established precedent for a form that multiplies power but excludes speed unless explicitly stated otherwise, which is not the case here. With Oozaru’s ×10 increase, both force generation and kinetic output rise proportionally. While the body’s mass is significantly greater, the increase in strength compensates for it, allowing the character to maintain high-speed movement. What changes is not how fast the character can move, but how efficiently they can control that movement.
Official descriptions further support this distinction. Broly is stated to use the power of the Oozaru "without the limited mobility of the Oozaru form."
The wording is precise: “limited mobility” refers to difficulty in maneuvering, not to reduced speed. If the form actually decreased velocity, that would be a critical attribute and would be explicitly mentioned. Instead, all sources consistently isolate the drawback to maneuverability.
The confusion ultimately comes from conflating “slow movements” with “low speed,” when in context it refers to the clumsiness of a giant body—wide turns, slower directional changes, and reduced precision. These are classic traits of decreased agility, not decreased velocity. A large entity can still move extremely fast in a straight line while being poor at changing direction quickly.
In conclusion, the Oozaru transformation provides a full ×10 amplification that includes physical speed, as directly supported by Goku’s statement and consistent scaling mechanics. The only drawback ever identified is reduced maneuverability due to increased size, not any reduction in speed.
I think that would be all, In the next blog post, I'll try to upgrade the Buu saga to at least Multi-Solar System.
Agree with all:
Agree with Ap + Speed:
Agree with Mutipliers: @Overvoid69
First the Multipliers:
SSJG would go from x160,000 to 20 Million
SSJB would go from x8 million to x1 Billion
SSJBE would go from x160 Million to 20 Billion
UIO would go from x640 Million to 80 Billion
Ap + Speed Upgrade:
The new blog(Or change the values of the other two blogs)
Changes:
1. Gohan SSJ2 50% Superior to Super Perfect Cell, so his AP is: >2.106 Kilofoe(Gohan is superior to Cell, Cell could only damage him because Gohan had low Yuki (courage) and according to Akira Toriyama:
Yūki (勇気 lit. "Courage"): The value of a person. It is based on their emotional disposition at a given moment. If an individual is afraid of another individual, then they lose their Yūki, and consequently a considerable amount of their power.
In battle, the most important thing is the size of your ki, and your control over it. Ki as a concept of course includes such spiritual powers as energy [genki], courage [yūki], and right-mindedness [shōki]. No matter how much you train, there are limits to physical strength, and the only way to overcome that is through ki. I think Goku was able to approach the mightiest warriors in the universe through strengthening his ki.
Energy, Courage, and Right-Mindedness — The word “energy” [genki] is well-known, but if one asks if you do not have energy if you have even one sickness [byōki], it is difficult to come up with an answer. There are people who are healthy yet do not have any energy, and there are people who are sick, yet full of energy. Plus, even among people who have roughly the same power, for example, there were people who gritted their teeth and stood their ground when Demon King Piccolo attacked them, yet there were also people who trembled and fled. Thinking about it this way, perhaps you will understand that a variety of different “ki” are indispensable in battle. In the world of Chinese martial arts, exemplified by T’ai-chi Ch’uan, ki training and control is given great importance.
In Dragon Ball, the dark mage Bobbidi invented a machine that measures and absorbs ki, but current science cannot measure ki levels or store it anywhere. However, when someone cheers you on, you can “receive energy and courage [yūki]” from them. “Ki” is something that cannot be seen with the eyes, yet it is there.
The reason is obvious; when he faced Cell in Super Saiyan form, he was extremely restrained and didn't want to fight, and when Cell return, Gohan had lost his father.
He was also able to return Cell's Kamehameha, which he launched with all his power, without even charging his own, also he can damage cell 3rd grade like form, And he is declared the strongest in the universe.
Gohan SSJ is stronger than Perfect Cell
The guides say that Gohan used all his power, but they obviously mean all his remaining power, as Sparking Zero says.
a technique is one thing and battle damage is another, Goku lost against Tambourine because he was tired (meaning his energy from battle damage limited his power), Vegeta in the Saiyan saga comments that his power is pathetic after being beaten up, So when you lose energy due to damage, it limits your power
Furthermore, the scaling of the Buu saga is consistent with this:
Gohan SSJ (Cell Games) > Vegeta SSJ (7 Years Later)
Vegeta SSJ (7 Years Later) > Dabura
Dabura ≈ Super Perfect Cell
Therefore:
Gohan SSJ (Cell Games) > Super Perfect Cell
1. Direct Evidence
Vegeta explicitly states multiple times that he can defeat Dabura.
These statements are not mere boasting, since:
They are made in an analytical context (while discussing with Gohan).
He includes others as capable, not just himself.
Goku indirectly supports this and never contradicts him.
During Dabura vs Gohan, Goku tells Vegeta to let Gohan handle it, which implicitly acknowledges that Vegeta is capable as well.
Furthermore, even though Goku could have inferred Vegeta’s SSJ2 from his displayed power in SSJ, he does not do so. This reinforces that SSJ2 is not required for the claim that Vegeta can defeat Dabura.
Conclusion: These are consistent, narrative-supported statements.
2. Character Perspective
Goku, Gohan, and Shin all witness Vegeta’s power in SSJ.
SSJ2 was not considered a factor, as shown by:
Shin allowing Goku and Vegeta to fight, believing they would not generate enough energy.
When both transform into SSJ2, Shin admits his calculations were wrong, proving he did not account for that level.
Additionally:
No one knew Vegeta had SSJ2.
Although Goku had it, he kept it restrained and did not reveal its full power.
Gohan, Shin, and even Goku show surprise at Vegeta’s SSJ2, reinforcing that this level was not part of prior evaluations.
The same applies to Gohan and Shin, who had access to the same (or even more) information than Goku, yet are still surprised upon seeing SSJ2 from both Goku and Vegeta. This further confirms it was not included in their scaling.
Conclusion:
Statements like Vegeta > Dabura are based on SSJ, not SSJ2.
3. Main Implication
If:
Vegeta SSJ (7 Years Later) > Dabura
Dabura ≈ Super Perfect Cell
Then:
Vegeta SSJ (7 Years Later) > Super Perfect Cell
4. Saiyan Scaling
Vegeta acknowledges that he is inferior to Goku during the Yakon fight.
However, he is later surprised that Goku has surpassed Gohan, implying he did not expect someone above him to also surpass Gohan.
This establishes that, in Vegeta’s perspective:
Gohan (Cell Games) > Vegeta (7 Years Later)
Meaning Gohan remains a superior benchmark within Vegeta’s scaling.
5. Main Conclusion
If:
Gohan (Cell Games) > Vegeta (7 Years Later)
And
Vegeta SSJ (7 Years Later) > Super Perfect Cell
Then:
Gohan SSJ (Cell Games) > Vegeta SSJ (7 Years Later) > Super Perfect Cell
6. Final Conclusion
Gohan SSJ (Cell Games) > Super Perfect Cell)
2. Classic and Saiyan saga Goku backscaling(22nd Tournament Goku is Large Planet Level, Saiyan Saga Goku is Brown Dwarf level, Goku Kaioken x10 > Frieza First Form, This was discarded because it contradicted lunar scaling, but now the planetary level is accepted, In addition, Goku is listed as superior in speed, and is even comparable to his second form And we know that in Dragon Ball, power and speed They increase at the same rate. )
3. With the new scaling, anyone equal to or stronger than Goku in the battle with Raditz is FTL(Because of the increases, 22nd tournament >0.1, King Piccolo Saga >0.3c, 23rd tournament >0.9c, raditz fight >1.8c)
4. Vegetto Base ≥ Buuhan (Vegito is stronger than gokhan who is stronger than buutenks and likely stronger to buuhan, Furthermore, vegito is declared to be the strongest and even invincible by the manga, all this just in his base form
5. Imperfect Cell >x3 Piccolo and 17(Piccolo's charged attacks should be superior to Goku's Kamehameha from the Vegeta saga(>x2.2) and stronger than his own charged attacks back in his fight with raditz, because It is at a more advanced point in history)
(The justification for the changes are in the notes, If you don't understand something, let me know and I'll explain it in more detail.)
Also in the blog, the oozaru increases its speed; this is because
The Oozaru increases speed; the drawback is maneuverability, not velocity
The claim that the Oozaru form does not increase speed is based on a misinterpretation of statements that clearly refer to mobility limitations, not to a lack of speed scaling.
Paragus’ line about “using the power of the Oozaru without the slow movements” is describing a biomechanical issue inherent to large bodies: when a character undergoes a massive increase in size, their rotational inertia increases, which directly affects how easily they can turn, adjust direction, and perform precise movements. This results in reduced agility and maneuverability, but it does not imply any reduction in raw speed or movement output. The statement is therefore addressing how the Oozaru body handles movement, not how fast it can move in a straight line or in bursts. Broly avoids this drawback simply because he retains a humanoid form, eliminating the handling issues associated with gigantism.
This interpretation is directly supported by explicit canonical evidence in Dragon Ball. During the Saiyan Saga, Goku states that Vegeta in Oozaru form is “too fast,” to the point that not even a Kaioken x5 is sufficient to catch him. Since Kaioken is a multiplier that enhances all combat-relevant stats, including speed, this establishes a direct comparison where Oozaru Vegeta exceeds an already amplified speed state. If the Oozaru transformation did not increase speed—or worse, reduced it—there would be no reason for Goku to be unable to keep up. This is not indirect scaling; it is a clear in-universe statement confirming that Oozaru amplifies speed alongside power.
Furthermore, the internal logic of the series reinforces this. In Dragon Ball, transformations and multipliers consistently scale all primary physical attributes: strength, durability, speed, and reaction time. There is no established precedent for a form that multiplies power but excludes speed unless explicitly stated otherwise, which is not the case here. With Oozaru’s ×10 increase, both force generation and kinetic output rise proportionally. While the body’s mass is significantly greater, the increase in strength compensates for it, allowing the character to maintain high-speed movement. What changes is not how fast the character can move, but how efficiently they can control that movement.
Official descriptions further support this distinction. Broly is stated to use the power of the Oozaru "without the limited mobility of the Oozaru form."
The wording is precise: “limited mobility” refers to difficulty in maneuvering, not to reduced speed. If the form actually decreased velocity, that would be a critical attribute and would be explicitly mentioned. Instead, all sources consistently isolate the drawback to maneuverability.
The confusion ultimately comes from conflating “slow movements” with “low speed,” when in context it refers to the clumsiness of a giant body—wide turns, slower directional changes, and reduced precision. These are classic traits of decreased agility, not decreased velocity. A large entity can still move extremely fast in a straight line while being poor at changing direction quickly.
In conclusion, the Oozaru transformation provides a full ×10 amplification that includes physical speed, as directly supported by Goku’s statement and consistent scaling mechanics. The only drawback ever identified is reduced maneuverability due to increased size, not any reduction in speed.
I think that would be all, In the next blog post, I'll try to upgrade the Buu saga to at least Multi-Solar System.
Agree with all:
Agree with Ap + Speed:
Agree with Mutipliers: @Overvoid69
Last edited:
