All Purpose Dragon Ball Thread

[Darkmon_cns]

This is an interesting matter, it is a difficulty, dose the wiki accept that speed generally increases in a somewhat linear fashion or truly at all with Strengthen increases from ki? We could argue god ki dosen't prove that but plenty of individuals without god ki persumable with normal ki are at the top of the scaling chain right beside goku and Vegeta. This is difficult to dismiss.

Tho I suspect ultimately what will be decide is that simply at these very high extremes the str to speed rite of increasing ki simply falls off and they become none linked due to a lack of evidence still linking them in this absurd situation.

 

[Darkmon_cns]

I earnestly find it more likly for the general increase of all state to be rejected then for it alone be used as evidence for infinite speed. It is simply not enough evidence to prove something like that especially sense the vast majority of the evidence for the linar rate between speed and power exists im the first half of the series all pre super

 

[SomebodyData]

Im not trying to ragebait or be super controversial but at the moment the wiki doesn't really have a good explanation that I, a non staff/non calc team basic b*tch member, can properly understand and Im just asking for clarification

Fiction usually doesn't treat the gap between tier 2 and tier 3 as infinite pretty much. Madoka Magica has a tier 7 character reach tier 2 after 14-100 exponential amps for example.

That's pretty much it; plus SSJG is also never treated as an infinite multiplier afterwards.

 

[Breadbear83]

It literally isn't

Ssjg made a guy go from 4B to 2C

That's an infinite increase in ki, and therefore infinite speed

As for the multiplier, things such as Infinite 2C exist. Sure you can argue that countably infinite increases in power doesn't make u go from 3 universes (in DBS and GT's case) to 4 or higher, but its definitely possible for them to still BE at 3 universes, just infinite within those confines

Yet you guys choose to lowball it to x160,000 for... No reason besides math, which isn't even a good reason given the system in place on this site

I just think its weird

Was speaking of if your logic would be accepted in the wiki

There has been a discussion on the multiplier removals that multiplier stacking to billions of times of feat is wrong because of lacking backup feats in dragon ball z

With infinite speed from a multiplier tied to AP, there are literally, no back up feats for MFTL+ to infinite speed, it's the peak of it being valid arguing if the multiplier is valid or not

 

[AguilaR202]

Multipliers are bullshit after SS1
For reference a character with a PL of 1 with SSBKKx20 would have a PL of 160 million, enough to outstrip the growth of 25 + years of narrative power increases (literal coughing newborn Baby Goku to SS1) And we’re lead to believe characters stack this level of growth under a year between arcs?

 

[Breadbear83]

Removing anime-exclusive content from manga Dragon Ball - Staff Only

If anyone wants some examples of why this thread should've been kept staff-only: 7 nothingburger posts in an hour. If this keeps up, we'll have four entire pages of comments that don't add anything meaningful by the end of the day. half of these "nothing-burger" posts are people who are...

vsbattles.com

Sapphire, it rather seems that the panel is midway of the explosion, of course at first the process can be at first violent frag, but it can't be fully pulverized/vaporized later

 

[Darkmon_cns]

Multipliers are bullshit after SS1
For reference a character with a PL of 1 with SSBKKx20 would have a PL of 160 million, enough to outstrip the growth of 25 + years of narrative power increases (literal coughing newborn Baby Goku to SS1) And we’re lead to believe characters stack this level of growth under a year between arcs?

The power if SS ontop of the power of a god sayain times 20... Ya I think that makes sense

 

[AguilaR202]

Ya... arms for hand to hand combat can't really accelerate like a body could so if you want to prove, even assuming the hands can move as fast as there full body travel speed, that the hands could reach those speeds accounting for acceleration- the feat would basically need to cross any given distance in like one second. Sense that's generally the only way to prove proportional travel time otherwise it be alot of math with a huge range and we'd probably end uo using the conservative end

Viltrumites are So6P war arc nardo victims and im tired of pretending they’re not.

 

[Darkmon_cns]

Viltrumites are So6P war arc nardo victims and im tired of pretending they’re not.

I...what?

 

[AguilaR202]

I...what?

Larp

 

[Saqphire]

Removing anime-exclusive content from manga Dragon Ball - Staff Only

If anyone wants some examples of why this thread should've been kept staff-only: 7 nothingburger posts in an hour. If this keeps up, we'll have four entire pages of comments that don't add anything meaningful by the end of the day. half of these "nothing-burger" posts are people who are...

vsbattles.com

Sapphire, it rather seems that the panel is midway of the explosion, of course at first the process can be at first violent frag, but it can't be fully pulverized/vaporized later

Makes sense

 

[Mickey1940]

I earnestly find it more likly for the general increase of all state to be rejected then for it alone be used as evidence for infinite speed. It is simply not enough evidence to prove something like that especially sense the vast majority of the evidence for the linar rate between speed and power exists im the first half of the series all pre super

ki is used to enhance the body

if you enhance the body, you enhance both strength and speed

characters in dragon ball who are stronger almost always blitz weaker people because this is how the power system works

in post super, characters who are stronger regularly blitz people who are weaker. The same thing exists. Super has never claimed that the correlation between strength and speed is removed simply cuz characters "become too strong"

You can't exactly reject the entire power system like this

 

[Skarfz]

I havent been here for 3 years, wow.

Wouldn't this give DBS Goku infinite speed for making a shockwave that traversed all of u7?

Yes but Tournament of power contradicts inf speed

 

[Mickey1940]

Fiction usually doesn't treat the gap between tier 2 and tier 3 as infinite pretty much. Madoka Magica has a tier 7 character reach tier 2 after 14-100 exponential amps for example.

That's pretty much it; plus SSJG is also never treated as an infinite multiplier afterwards.

SSJG has been treated as a vastly superior transformation compared to base form in every context

the only way it was treated as "infinite" in any context is when Goku and Beerus nearly blew up u7, but the show went out of its way to explain why he doesn't do it anymore by properly controlling the form's immense power to cancel out the collateral damage. Said control is present in every other transformation afterwards

Claiming that the SSJG transformation is treated "differently" when it's STILL treated as significantly stronger than any transformation before it to the same degree and it's only actual feat having an in-universe explanation doesn't make much sense.

There's no stated or implied differences between the Ritual SSJG and the regularly used SSJG in any context whatsoever, and the only reason why the wiki treats it as different is because you haven't been able to math out "2C base Goku uses a 4B to 2C transformation" yet, which is insane to me

 

[Mickey1940]

Was speaking of if your logic would be accepted in the wiki

There has been a discussion on the multiplier removals that multiplier stacking to billions of times of feat is wrong because of lacking backup feats in dragon ball z

With infinite speed from a multiplier tied to AP, there are literally, no back up feats for MFTL+ to infinite speed, it's the peak of it being valid arguing if the multiplier is valid or not

no backup feats besides
1. Goku's shockwaves in BoG traversing all of u7
2. UI Goku shaking the infinite void by existing
3. GoD Toppo actively warping the entire realm and turning it into cosmic purple when it was green before

like yeah they're not traveling anywhere but why don't the performers of these feats scale to the speed of said feats

 

[Saqphire]

Wouldn't this give DBS Goku infinite speed for making a shockwave that traversed all of u7?

Attack speed

 

[Mickey1940]

I havent been here for 3 years, wow.

Yes but Tournament of power contradicts inf speed

how so?

 

[Mickey1940]

Attack speed

well he doesn't have that either

 

[Skarfz]

how so?

ToP has an ongoing timer, if characters had infinite speed at all they wouldnt be taking time to fight

 

[Mickey1940]

ToP has an ongoing timer, if characters had infinite speed at all they wouldnt be taking time to fight

uh

every fight in dragon ball takes time

even in GT and Toei

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

uh

every fight in dragon ball takes time

even in GT and Toei

Nah what do you mean SSJ3 Gotenks lasts 5 minutes? You crazy

 

[Saqphire]

uh

every fight in dragon ball takes time

even in GT and Toei

Let's nerf Toei chat

 

[Huesito88]

Let's nerf Toei chat

The Toei wank is too strong to be nerfed

 

[Skarfz]

Toei sees the infinite speed downgrade and makes goku fly across time in base

 

[BoastJr]

Goku Catches another Heart Virus (Toei Goku vs Illness !)

"I Heard Maids are pretty strong in this world ! Lets Fight !" Rules : 1. Speed is equalised 2. Distance : 500 Metres 3. Location : Kaito's Mansion 4. Both H3A (Goku starts at SSJ1 but can transform higher. Illness starts Unfocused but can heighten it) 5. Early Majin Buu Saga Goku (Dead) is...

vsbattles.com

H3A Match

Toei Goku vs Illness

Both have low godly regen

 

[Darkmon_cns]

ki is used to enhance the body

if you enhance the body, you enhance both strength and speed

characters in dragon ball who are stronger almost always blitz weaker people because this is how the power system works

in post super, characters who are stronger regularly blitz people who are weaker. The same thing exists. Super has never claimed that the correlation between strength and speed is removed simply cuz characters "become too strong"

You can't exactly reject the entire power system like this

You can't say the power system behaves the same at an infinte extreme it dose with finite examples without proof, none of that proof exist at that level.

They can still be stronger and the one with more ki can still be faster, but at those levels it's no longer proven speed and power increase with anykind of relation to eachother.

 

[AguilaR202]

I believe in toei supremacy

 

[Huesito88]

I believe in toei supremacy

You don't need to believe it is factual that Toei like to wank the anime versions of there stuff a lot of the time

 

[Saqphire]

Toei sees the infinite speed downgrade and makes goku fly across time in base

They already did that with him outspeeding Hit

 

[Huesito88]

They already did that with him outspeeding Hit

Yes, but it's a outliner

 

[Skarfz]

They already did that with him outspeeding Hit

ermmmm, that was in ssb kaioken x10, not base

 

[Saqphire]

Yes, but it's a outliner

What if they all were just holding back cuz of ToP rules

 

[Saqphire]

You don't need to believe it is factual that Toei like to wank the anime versions of there stuff a lot of the time

Except when it comes to Sanji's inverse

 

[Huesito88]

Except when it comes to Sanji's inverse

They wank Zoro yes indeed

 

[FriendOfTheTeaParty]

99% of our calcs go against authorial intent lol, I bet you not a single one of our cloud feats were intended to be that strong lol

I actually know some verses that treat cloud feats as super impressive. One of them has an attack split clouds visible from outer space and a character went "wtf if this hits straight on itd mess up the continents"

 

[Hiryu-Z]

5-A calc of Piccolo destroying the moon from the manga

https://nerddragon.fandom.com/pt-br/wiki/Blog_de_usuário:Lotus_Reichhart_0/Dragon_Ball:_Piccolo_destrói_a_lua

 

[Saqphire]

5-A calc of Piccolo destroying the moon from the manga

https://nerddragon.fandom.com/pt-br/wiki/Blog_de_usuário:Lotus_Reichhart_0/Dragon_Ball:_Piccolo_destrói_a_lua

Why is the calc using the explosion radius as the speed? Also there's no mass being shown to fly off here either so it's bunk anyway

 

[Breadbear83]

5-A calc of Piccolo destroying the moon from the manga

https://nerddragon.fandom.com/pt-br/wiki/Blog_de_usuário:Lotus_Reichhart_0/Dragon_Ball:_Piccolo_destrói_a_lua

I think the DBZ kakarot version is better: https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...stroys_the_Moon,_Kakarot's_ver._(Dragon_Ball)

 

[Hiryu-Z]

Will SSJ Goku still be considered 50x his base form during Namek?

 

[Darkmon_cns]

How dose the wiki separate a "separate continity" from an adaption? All adaptions are a separate continuity unless something really weird happens like that one episode in avatar Last Airbender where they did a stage play you could describe that as an adoption within the same continuity but for normal stuff this Wiki deals with all adaptions are different continuities