About Fujitora's meteors

[The_Calaca]

To Toriyama Power > Hax and we don't use that reasoning.

During the Paramount War there was fodder marines who could stab Whitebeard and we don't scale them to 6-C just because of it since the verse follows some rules when it comes to slashing and piercing attacks. We shouldn't consider vibrations =earthquakes.

I said before that if the numbers change, the scaling would turn confusing leaving Fujitora far above everyone else.

 

[Damage3245]

Calaca; the energy of the earthquake still comes directly from Whitebeard.

The energy of the meteor however is a product of accelerating over time. Fujitora and the Stomp-Stomp fruit wouldn't scale no matter what the value of the meteor was.

Therefore there is no scaling discrepency you need to worry about if the meteor calc gets revised.

 

[The_Calaca]

It's not only due to Fujitora but the rest of the cast tho. That's something you're still ignoring.

 

[Damage3245]

It's not only due to Fujitora but the rest of the cast tho. That's something you're still ignoring.

The problem being that the rest of the cast have no feats or statements comparing them directly to the meteors.

Can we not address the scaling of the meteors when somebody actually does scale to them in some capacity? As the verse currently stands, there isn't a problem with the ratings; if a revision happens where a problem is introduced then we can address it when the time comes.

But right now I think there isn't an issue we need to worry about.

Scaling the Stomp-Stomp fruit directly to the meteors would introduce a lot more problems than it would solve.

 

[Dr.Fix]

It's not only due to Fujitora but the rest of the cast tho. That's something you're still ignoring.

• Currently there's no contradiction in the scaling regarding the 6-C. Kaido is scaling to Zunisha (One Piece)'s 28 Gigatons feat and with him, many other Top Tiers as the Yonko for reasons that are no worthy of being mentioned in this thread since it has been discussed already in the revisions. This will likely change in the future with new feats or re-calcs but as it is right now, it makes no sense. This is the weakest argument and it shouldn't be as considered as the others.

Literally the only discussion which you do not want to bring up cause it makes you look bad was "Other yonko should be comparable . . "

Five words. Five words and not a single mention from the manga as supportive evidence. This against 1655 words explaining why they do not with sources from the manga, arguments and counter arguents. You even agreed Kaido was the strongest.

 

[Damage3245]

@Dr. Fix, I appreciate the comments but this thread is supposed to be (in theory) restricted to Calaca and I, and staff members. If you have anything you want me to bring up you can let me know.

 

[VioIeLFC]

The yonko are comparable to each other, that isn't up for debate, even if Kaido is the strongest they're still comparable. Agree with scaling meteors

 

[Damage3245]

@VioleLFC: basically the same thing I said to Dr. Fix. This thread is supposed to be restricted.

 

[VioIeLFC]

Just the one comment for me, probably won't say any more unless someone replies to me

 

[Antvasima]

Somebody should ask the staff members listed in the One Piece verse page to comment here.

 

[Antvasima]

If we get no more input, I suppose that we might have to scale the most powerful characters from Zunisha instead, as a compromise solution.

 

[Damage3245]

@Antvasima; the plan is already to scale the most powerful characters from Zunisha. Going forwards with that is definitely better than trying to scale them to the meteors.

 

[The_Calaca]

I've done it.

@Damage

Who's that character who's scaling to the meteors exactly? Because you was arguing that nobody should scale in previous threads.

The current rating are subject to change. I said before that the current scaling makes sense but that'd change with the further discussions. That's why we need to settle this before.

What problems involve scaling the Zushi Zushi no Mi to the meteors exactly?

@Dr Fix

Kaido being the strongest doesn't mean he's massively above the other Yonko.

If some non-staff member wants to take part into the discussion then contact Damage3245 or me in our message walls to let us know your thoughts. This thread is supposed to be for staff members and both of us to not clutter it.

 

[Damage3245]

@Calaca; the problems scaling the Zushi Zushi no Mi to the meteor calc are mostly outlined in the coconut metaphor I used up above.

But aside from that, if we say that Fujitora's attacks in general are 13 Gigatons then that's what Sabo, Luffy and Zoro would likely scale to as well. There'd be big discussions about that, sure, but that's my initial impression. It would involve a huge shift in the verses ratings with very little supporting calcs.

> The current rating are subject to change. I said before that the current scaling makes sense but that'd change with the further discussions.

It might not change, or not change significantly. If something comes up then we can deal with it then.

For the time being would you be fine with just scaling the top tiers to Zunisha as a compromise like Ant suggests then revisit the topic when we have something new?

 

[The_Calaca]

That's the only problem we have if we do, while we have more problems with consistency if we don't.

There's nothing suggesting that they should scale them to that. The 13GT would be a mid-output (considering he was casual), but could be as low as 98MT. Sabo would only scale to the Ferocious Tiger since he didn't injured Issho at all. Same with Luffy and Zoro (but these two scales to other people).

No, I made this thread to talk about this because you keep denying this despite that every member but you and Fix have agreed to using the meteors for scaling purposes. This needs more input from the staff members, because we have two members so far who have voted for the yes.

 

[Damage3245]

Calaca; this is the main problem:

"Since we have no clear ideas on how we should calc the energy Fujitora used to pull down the meteors, then we should scale him to the meteors and therefore the rest of the characters who scales to him."

In the absence of a suitable method for calcing Fujitora's AP (despite the fact we have a City level+ calc and a Mountain level calc for him) we can't just make up a value for him based on the kinetic energy of the meteor.

None of Fujitora's own attacks are that powerful. And I have established that the energy required to accelerate something does not equal the final kinetic energy of it.

The optimal solution would be to ignore the meteors until someone comes along who scales to them; and scale the top tiers to Zunisha.

 

[The_Calaca]

I'm not arguing anymore. You know my arguments about this and you've made yourself clear. If new points comes with the rest of the staff members then I'll keep the discussion, but right now we're just agreeing to disagree.

 

[Damage3245]

Calaca; can you address my argument regarding the coconut metaphor?

"Dropping a coconut from 1 meter and 100 meters both have the same starting energy / acceleration due to gravity.

However if a coconut lands on your head from 1 meter that hurts a whole lot less than a coconut dropped from 100 meters. The kinetic energy of the latter coconut is much higher, but the initial energy put into moving the coconuts is low.

So Fujitora accelerating a meteor to the ground using gravity doesn't tell you how strong Fujitora's DF is just from the kinetic energy of the meteor hitting the ground."

You cannot get how strong Fujitora's DF is from the meteor calc.

So why do you want to scale him to the meteor calc?

 

[Antvasima]

Yes, it is best if both of you stop arguing, and wait for the staff.

For the record, I still agree with Calaca. We scale from the energy of meteorites in other verses as well, and shouldn't make exceptions here.

In addition, to accelerate the meteorites at much higher speeds than terminal velocity, most of the power would have to come from Fujitora.

 

[Damage3245]

In addition, to accelerate the meteorites at much higher speeds than terminal velocity, most of the power would have to come from Fujitora.

Quite right; but the 13 Gigaton calc isn't for the energy needed to accelerate the meteor.

It's completely unconnected and therefore shouldn't be used for scaling.

 

[The_Calaca]

I have nothing to say, I think you're correct about the metaphor, but this isn't something related at all. Scaling-wise it makes more sense scaling the God Tiers to Fujitora's meteors.

That's all I want to say. I'll wait for the votes now.

 

[Damage3245]

@Calaca; scaling-wise what is different exactly if we scale the God Tiers to Fujitora's meteors?

Also, Matthew hasn't given any reason for why he supports the scaling and isn't a knowledgeable member on One Piece. He should at least explain himself if he's going to throw a vote in.

 

[Antvasima]

Have you contacted other staff members?

 

[Andytrenom]

I do think Damage's points make sense and really don't seem to have been addressed properly.

Tho I am not knowledgeable on the series so I lack some context.

 

[The_Calaca]

Because instead of Likely 6-C, the admirals would be 6-C. It would change with the future revisions as well.

 

[Damage3245]

@Calaca, if Whitebeard has a 6-C feat and the Admirals directly scale to him, then the Admirals would be fully 6-C that way. But no calc has been proposed yet unfortunately. As it stands the Admirals could probably be a straight 6-C already, we just haven't finished the revisions to decide that.

@Andy, thanks for the comment. If you have any questions please ask.

 

[The_Calaca]

Whitebeard is off-topic right now. We had a discussion of his possible feats back in the previous thread, so let's not keep this discussion.

 

[Damage3245]

Okay, sure. But if the aim is to have a solid 6-C feat for the Admirals as opposed to making them Likely 6-C, I'm just pointing out that scaling them to the meteor isn't the only way it needs to happen.

 

[Andytrenom]

Yes, it is best if both of you stop arguing, and wait for the staff.

For the record, I still agree with Calaca. We scale from the energy of meteorites in other verses as well, and shouldn't make exceptions here.

In addition, to accelerate the meteorites at much higher speeds than terminal velocity, most of the power would have to come from Fujitora.

Most of the meteor feats I know involve someone actually overpowering the meteor after it reaches the level of energy. So I'm not sure if it will actually contradict how things are done in other verses.

The second point might work, tho I'm not really sure.

 

[Damage3245]

@Andy; Ant is correct that most of the power for accelerating the meteor would come from Fujitora. But we don't have a calc for accelerating the meteor.

 

[Elizhaa]

I think scaling to the meteors is fine.

I think so as well

 

[Antvasima]

You can also ask any staff members listed under One Piece in the Knowledgeable Members List to comment here.

 

[The_Calaca]

I've done it. Ogurtsow is the only KM besides Elizhaa who's a staff member.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. We preferably do need more staff input though.

If we do not get it, I suppose that the top tiers can probably scale both from Fujitora and Zunisha in combination.

 

[The_Calaca]

That's the current consensus. We also have a couple of feats calced and revised but that's besides the point of this thread.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay.

 

[Damage3245]

Can't help but notice that neither of the staff members have given a reason for why they think they should be used for scaling.

 

[Antvasima]

I gave reasons earlier.

 

[Damage3245]

I know you did, I was referring to the other two staff members who have commented.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay.