Adaptation and Reactive Evolution For Dragon Physiology (Genshin Impact)

[Furina003]

Adaptation And Reactive Evolution

Dragons are able to adaption and evolve to suit the environment of the world in which they live
Orobashi explained in his experiments that Vishap was able to adapt and evolve from all the experiments he did, this experiment is explained in detail in the book The Byakuyakoku Collection. Kukulkan explains that dragons and only they have the concept of evolution, dragons are also able to evolve into human form to suit the place where they live. Kulkulan also explains that dragons are able to adapt and evolve in extreme capacities. with this evolution they have new powers and become stronger to adapt to the environment created by the heavenly principles.

from the various feat that have been given, from here we can conclude that dragons have the concept of evolution that they use to survive and adapt to the place where they live. their adaptation and evolution have extreme/extraordinary capacities, because with this evolution they are able to gain new, stronger powers and can even take human form. yeah, from here dragons should gain the ability to adaptation and reactive evolution

Agree: @Sahlwrld (adaptation) @OmniScalator @PedjaTarzan (adaptation) @Voidnether (adaptation & RE for Vishap enkanomiya)
@Shey (only adaptation) @Quibster (adaptation) @FinePoint @DarkDragonMedeus

Disagree: @PedjaTarzan (Reactive Evolution) @Voidnether (RE for natlan dragon)

Neutral: @Sahlwrld (RE) @Quibster (RE)

If there is any mistake when I enter the voting results, please let me know, I will fix it.

 

[MSahla]

Looks fine

 

[OmniScalator]

looks good

 

[PedjaTarzan]

i said this for raiden shoguns case, but reactive evolution based on what its description requires character to develop new set of powers and abilities and get stronger over time
Otherwise yeah this is clear Adaptation and i agree with it

 

[Furina003]

i said this for raiden shoguns case, but reactive evolution based on what its description requires character to develop new set of powers and abilities and get stronger over time
Otherwise yeah this is clear Adaptation and i agree with it

This is clearly reactive evolution, you can read the description given where the dragons are able to evolve to generate new powers and become stronger. and the orobashi experiment also proves this

 

[PedjaTarzan]

This is clearly reactive evolution, you can read the description given where the dragons are able to evolve to generate new powers and become stronger. and the orobashi experiment also proves this

I mean evolving overtime to be able to handle such enviorement doesnt fall into reactive evolution, we litterally have cases in real life how animals evolved trough time to adapt to the said enviorement thats why im not sure abt reactive evolution as an genuine ability.

 

[Furina003]

I mean evolving overtime to be able to handle such enviorement doesnt fall into reactive evolution, we litterally have cases in real life how animals evolved trough time to adapt to the said enviorement thats why im not sure abt reactive evolution as an genuine ability.

yes i mean the opposite, dragons not only adapt but they also evolve, that's why kukulan explained. when the heavenly nail was dropped they were able to evolve and survive, this is what made the dragon race able to live until now, because with this evolution they have new powers and become stronger to adapt to the environment created by the heavenly principles, and this also explains why dragons are able to take human form like kukulan who took the form of bona, the human who spoke to us during the world quest in natlan.

So, i think this is very different from evolution in the real world which can take thousands of years or even millions of years.

 

[Voidnether]

I thought we were already over this distinction.

As opposed to Reactive Evolution, Adaptation only gives a character the ability to balance the resources of its current body, not to, for example, grow more durable or powerful.

What they meant about "more durable or powerful" refers to their powers & abilities and their resistances mainly..

This ability is also similar to Adaptation, but with the powers & resistances gained being more varied and extreme, rather than simply adapting to better utilize one's resources to survive environments or having only occasionally grown new abilities or resistances. With Reactive Evolution, a user is ideally always supposed to be able to "evolve", if over long periods of time, with new abilities or resistances, while Adaptation meets clear limits in this regard. While Reactive Evolution is often always active, its effects may not always activate to benefit the user, and this needs to be evaluated through feats & scaling.

You could ask, well what about this then?

Developing greater statistics. However, if this is the only way in which they "evolve", then Accelerated Development should be given instead to avoid redundancy.

Judging from the fact that it was stated to be like: "To attain a stronger body, to gain ever mightier power, we dragons have had to constantly adapt and transform ourselves based on our environment." I don't think that's enough to justify Reactive Evolution at all.

I kinda don't wanna debate about the part where they devolve themselves which debunks the entire thing, but this was always Adaptation from when Enkanomiya first released. Reactive Evolution is too vague based on those statements alone, the best you can get is a "possibly" rating but I really doubt it. You can put my votes on Adaptation btw since I won't reply any further.

The first two sentences being a metaphor, and the third sentence is actually the real one (Considering when they say about attaining a stronger body and gaining mightier power, was about them constantly adapting and transforming themselves based on the environment debunks the arguments for RE)

 

[Furina003]

I thought we were already over this distinction.

What they meant about "more durable or powerful" refers to their powers & abilities and their resistances mainly..

You could ask, well what about this then?

Judging from the fact that it was stated to be like: "To attain a stronger body, to gain ever mightier power, we dragons have had to constantly adapt and transform ourselves based on our environment." I don't think that's enough to justify Reactive Evolution at all.

I kinda don't wanna debate about the part where they devolve themselves which debunks the entire thing, but this was always Adaptation from when Enkanomiya first released. Reactive Evolution is too vague based on those statements alone, the best you can get is a "possibly" rating but I really doubt it. You can put my votes on Adaptation btw since I won't reply any further.

The first two sentences being a metaphor, and the third sentence is actually the real one (Considering when they say about attaining a stronger body and gaining mightier power, was about them constantly adapting and transforming themselves based on the environment debunks the arguments for RE)

reactive evolution should be good enough, because they not only adapt, but also evolve.

they become stronger and have abilities that they did not have before. and kukulan also explains that this adaptation and evolution has entered an extreme capacity.

this is good, according to the explanation page about reactive evolution

 

[Voidnether]

reactive evolution should be good enough, because they not only adapt, but also evolve.

they become stronger and have abilities that they did not have before. and kukulan also explains that this adaptation and evolution has entered an extreme capacity.

this is according to the explanation page about reactive evolution

Evolve, and then what category? Nothing there indicates them gaining new abilities or resistances, that's why it's stated Adaptation meets this clear limit of this regard.

You can argue for RE on the "greater statistics" category but at best it's just a possibly or it wouldn't get RE at all with this interpretation:

The first two sentences being a metaphor, and the third sentence is actually the real one (Considering when they say about attaining a stronger body and gaining mightier power, was about them constantly adapting and transforming themselves based on the environment debunks the arguments for RE)

 

[Furina003]

Evolve, and then what category? Nothing there indicates them gaining new abilities or resistances, that's why it's stated Adaptation meets this clear limit of this regard.

You can argue for RE on the "greater statistics" category but at best it's just a possibly or it wouldn't get RE at all with this interpretation:

You just need to read what I have explained, and what is explained in the reply column.

they gain new forms and new powers. they are stronger than before.

this adaptation and evolution has also been explained to have extreme capacity.

so? all of this meets the requirements for reactive evolution

 

[Voidnether]

You just need to read what I have explained, and what is explained in the reply column.

they gain new forms and new powers. they are stronger than before.

this adaptation and evolution has also been explained to have extreme capacity.

so? all of this meets the requirements for reactive evolution

They don't, btw. The rest of the scans there are just Adaptation, nothing there indicates RE.
"They gain new forms and new powers" and it's just them being stronger than before, and remember how those first two sentences are just used to explain the extreme environment since the first two are just an analogy?
It's not really stronger than before, like if you wanna argue for RE. I don't think just with those two statements could get you in the greater statistics rating but yeah.

 

[Furina003]

They don't, btw. The rest of the scans there are just Adaptation, nothing there indicates RE.
"They gain new forms and new powers" and it's just them being stronger than before, and remember how those first two sentences are just used to explain the extreme environment since the first two are just an analogy?
It's not really stronger than before, like if you wanna argue for RE. I don't think just with those two statements could get you in the greater statistics rating but yeah.

There is no analogy there, you think why can the bismal vishaps have elements other than hydro, it is because they evolved.

this is also the reason why kukulan is able to take human form. so you should differentiate which is evolution and which is adaptation.

adaptation is just adjusting to what is facing it without changing the body structure or adding new abilities. while evolution is the opposite.

adaptation ≠ evolution but evolution is already a level above adaptation

 

[Voidnether]

There is no analogy there, you think why can the bismal vishaps have elements other than hydro, it is because they evolved.

this is also the reason why kukulan is able to take human form. so you should differentiate which is evolution and which is adaptation.

adaptation is just adjusting to what is facing it without changing the body structure or adding new abilities. while evolution is the opposite.

adaptation ≠ evolution but evolution is already a level above adaptation

The term "Evolution" does not necessarily mean that it is Reactive Evolution, it could pretty much be used as an analogy for adaptation or just basically statistics amplification. It varies.

And yeah, if you were arguing about "Vishaps" here. Only the one exclusive in Enkanomiya gets Reactive Evolution, you can read Vol 4 on Byakuyaku Collection and then try to explain it on the CRT because it's just not there. You should know what abilities and resistances that they get on there. Doesn't apply to Natlan which is just Adaptation at best.

 

[Voidnether]

I still agree with adaptation for both of them, Reactive Evolution is only exclusive to those in Enkanomiya, that's all. If you're putting this on the "Dragon Physiology" even though I'm unsure if we have that then just list Adaptation on there.

Vishaps and Dragons are two different species, no? Dragon is a Saurian. Especially when we're talking about Natlan here.

 

[Furina003]

The term "Evolution" does not necessarily mean that it is Reactive Evolution, it could pretty much be used as an analogy for adaptation or just basically statistics amplification. It varies.

And yeah, if you were arguing about "Vishaps" here. Only the one exclusive in Enkanomiya gets Reactive Evolution, you can read Vol 4 on Byakuyaku Collection and then try to explain it on the CRT because it's just not there. You should know what abilities and resistances that they get on there. Doesn't apply to Natlan which is just Adaptation at best.

This is why the terms adaptation and evolution are different, you say this is just a metaphor or just an analogy, but the dragons prove that they are able to evolve not just adapt.

how can we say it's just adaptation? while they have clearly awakened new powers and become stronger, they also change their body structure to adapt to the new environment.

that's why kukulan said this is already at the extreme capacity stage, because they are not just adapting but have changed themselves

 

[MSahla]

Vishaps and Dragons are two different species, no? Dragon is a Saurian.

Well Vishaps are Dragon-Like creatures, they once followed each of their own Dragon Sovereigns and eventually they will become the True Dragon

Well, Saurians is like an Ancient Dragon devolved into a Saurians according to the new WQ, in Koholasaurus description it is said that theres the biggest dragon in the sea which is likely the Hydro Dragon and Koholasaurus is the descendant of this sea dragon.

 

[Voidnether]

Well Vishaps are Dragon-Like creatures, they once followed each of their own Dragon Sovereigns and eventually they will become the True Dragon

Well, Saurians is like an Ancient Dragon devolved into a Saurians according to the new WQ, in Koholasaurus description it is said that theres the biggest dragon in the sea which is likely the Hydro Dragon and Koholasaurus is the descendant of this sea dragon.

That's why I kinda don't wanna say much about the "devolve" part because it'll be dumb if that debunks everything, not when there's no context provided. Yeah, that should differentiate it.

This is why the terms adaptation and evolution are different, you say this is just a metaphor or just an analogy, but the dragons prove that they are able to evolve not just adapt.

how can we say it's just adaptation? while they have clearly awakened new powers and become stronger, they also change their body structure to adapt to the new environment.

that's why kukulan said this is already at the extreme capacity stage, because they are not just adapting but have changed themselves

The one I bolded just happens on Enkanomiya, and it's exclusively to Vishaps, not the Natlan ones in where the statements there are vague.

 

[PedjaTarzan]

I still agree with adaptation for both of them, Reactive Evolution is only exclusive to those in Enkanomiya, that's all. If you're putting this on the "Dragon Physiology" even though I'm unsure if we have that then just list Adaptation on there.

Vishaps and Dragons are two different species, no? Dragon is a Saurian. Especially when we're talking about Natlan here.

Both originate from era of the dragons so i dont think it makes it a huge issue, and its already noted that both vishaps and dragans have own ways of adaptation so crt purpose is fine

 

[MSahla]

Well.. I kinda neutral for Reactive Evolution for now but i Agree with Adaptation because we already know this since Before Sun and Moon.

 

[Voidnether]

Both originate from era of the dragons so i dont think it makes it a huge issue, and its already noted that both vishaps and dragans have own ways of adaptation so crt purpose is fine

Yeah, just wanna clarify that RE is only exclusive to those in Enkanomiya because Natlan statements are like so vague and the context for them devolving were them devolving into Saurians. So that's enough to differentiate that Dragons in Natlan aren't Vishaps but rather Saurians.. That's all probably, idk

 

[Furina003]

The one I bolded just happens on Enkanomiya, and it's exclusively to Vishaps, not the Natlan ones in where the statements there are vague.

kulkulan explained that for all dragon races, vishap is just the lowest level of dragon hierarchy, you agree with vishap and deny for natlan or even sovereign dragon class this is really unreasonable. yeah i will put your vote according to what you agree and what you reject

 

[MSahla]

We should be fine with Adaptation.

 

[Furina003]

Both originate from era of the dragons so i dont think it makes it a huge issue, and its already noted that both vishaps and dragans have own ways of adaptation so crt purpose is fine

So, to be sure, do you agree with RE or not?

 

[Voidnether]

kulkulan explained that for all dragon races, vishap is just the lowest level of dragon hierarchy, you agree with vishap and deny for natlan or even sovereign dragon class this is really unreasonable. yeah i will put your vote according to what you agree and what you reject

Hierarchy generally only works when it's related to their statistics, not their abilities and resistance except if it was like HSR where Aeons just somehow happen to scale from their Emanators and Pathstriders due to all of their abilities coming off from that Aeon..

You can say it is unreasonable, but except if it's demonstrated there like the Vishaps on Byakuyaku Collection (Vol 4) then I don't have a reason to agree with what you're saying especially if it's illogical and there were too many assumptions without a good statement backing it up. If a feat were to be so blatant, no one would have any issue accepting them but for abilities like these and that much assumptions? Yeahhh... Don't think so.

 

[PedjaTarzan]

So, to be sure, do you agree with RE or not?

no, only adaptation

 

[Furina003]

Hierarchy generally only works when it's related to their statistics, not their abilities and resistance except if it was like HSR where Aeons just somehow happen to scale from their Emanators and Pathstriders due to all of their abilities coming off from that Aeon..

You can say it is unreasonable, but except if it's demonstrated there like the Vishaps on Byakuyaku Collection (Vol 4) then I don't have a reason to agree with what you're saying especially if it's illogical and there were too many assumptions without a good statement backing it up. If a feat were to be so blatant, no one would have any issue accepting them but for abilities like these and that much assumptions? Yeahhh... Don't think so.

kukulan has explained everything, so they are able to grow stronger and change their appearance, because they are able to evolve.

vishap is just a dragon that is not even in the same class as kulkulan. you equate it with aeons is a mistake.

because vishap and kukulan or sovereign are one dragon nation. and kukulan explained it for all dragons in teyvat, so I think your statement is really unreasonable

I'm not assuming, because it's proven that dragons can indeed evolve, that's why Kukulan explained it and they were able to survive until now.

 

[Voidnether]

kukulan has explained everything, so they are able to grow stronger and change their appearance, because they are able to evolve.

vishap is just a dragon that is not even in the same class as kulkulan. you equate it with aeons is a mistake.

because vishap and kukulan or sovereign are one dragon nation. and kukulan explained it for all dragons in teyvat, so I think your statement is really unreasonable

I'm not assuming, because it's proven that dragons can indeed evolve, that's why Kukulan explained it and they were able to survive until now.

And what has been shown? None.

For instance, if a heat-resistant vishap matures in a cold environment, its offspring will have high body fat, greater predilection towards sleep, and may express the Cryo element.

Prior to maturation, Bathysmal Vishaps can also choose which traits to "activate." For example, a vishap with both heat-resistant and cold-resistant traits can selectively express heat resistance if it matures in hot conditions, or cold resistance if it matures in cold conditions. One researcher remarked that they "had already stored a veritable armory within their bodies" before meeting the people of Enkanomiya.

^^ These two are the explanations for the Vol 4.
Either there's a good argument why those above Vishaps in the hierarchy scales to the Vishaps in terms of Reactive Evolution by being able to do these two, or you just give me an argument what type of Reactive Evolution they are.
These two are literally the statements, and I couldn't even figure out what type of Reactive Evolution they would be:

To attain a stronger body, to gain ever mightier power, we dragons have had to constantly adapt and transform ourselves based on our environment.

We dragons boast extreme adaptability and evolutionary capacity, but this was used against us — countless Dragonborn could only devolve so as to survive in present-day Natlan...

Isn't the context of evolving there about a human capable of evolving into a dragon?
Yeah, I think I'll stop here.

 

[Furina003]

And what has been shown? None.

yeah they showed it, do you think why kukulan can take human form? that's because dragons evolved using phlogiston adapting themselves to the world created by the heavenly principle. and this is also the reason why they got stronger.

^These two are the explanations for the Vol 4.
Either there's a good argument why those above Vishaps in the hierarchy scales to the Vishaps in terms of Reactive Evolution by being able to do these two, or you just give me an argument what type of Reactive Evolution they are.
These two are literally the statements, and I couldn't even figure out what type of Reactive Evolution they would be:

I have given many literal statements. and kukulan did show that ability in front of the little saurian

Isn't the context of evolving there about a human capable of evolving into a dragon?

humans can't even evolve. you just need to read the op i gave.

Yeah, I think I'll stop here.

yes i have put your vote in, and i will wait for the staff to turn this on

 

[Shey]

Agree for just Adaptation

 

[MrTayman616]

from the various feat that have been given, from here we can conclude that dragons have the concept of evolution that they use to survive and adapt to the place where they live. their adaptation and evolution have extreme/extraordinary capacities, because with this evolution they are able to gain new, stronger powers and can even take human form. yeah, from here dragons should gain the ability to adaptation and reactive evolution

This kinda shows it bad.

Can you just give the scans for this? It'd be better for to see if it's reactive evolution or not.

 

[Furina003]

This kinda shows it bad.

Can you just give the scans for this? It'd be better for to see if it's reactive evolution or not.

aren't all the scans in the OP? that's just a summary of what was explained before you just need to read the feats given

 

[Furina003]

Bump

 

[Furina003]

bump

 

[FinePoint]

Most of this evidence is just links to other wikis.

I'm afraid I can't, on principal, evaluate this thread based on secondhand information.

Please include direct scans from the official material.

 

[Furina003]

Most of this evidence is just links to other wikis.

I'm afraid I can't, on principal, evaluate this thread based on secondhand information.

Please include direct scans from the official material.

ok, i'll give it, btw the wiki only shows the dialogues that are in the game, but i'll give you scenes from the game. It might take a while, i'll let you know when it's done

 

[FinePoint]

ok, i'll give it, btw the wiki only shows the dialogues that are in the game, but i'll give you scenes from the game. It might take a while, i'll let you know when it's done

No problem, take your time.

 

[Furina003]

No problem, take your time.

Dragons are able to adaption and evolve to suit the environment of the world in which they live. Orobashi explained in his experiments that Vishap was able to adapt and evolve from all the experiments he did, this experiment is explained in detail in the book The Byakuyakoku Collection. Kukulkan explains that dragons and only they have the concept of evolution, with this evolution they have new powers and become stronger to adapt to the environment created by the heavenly principles. Kulkulan also explains that dragons are able to adapt and evolve in extreme capacities.

I have replaced the scene using a scene that comes directly from the game

 

[FinePoint]

Dragons are able to adaption and evolve to suit the environment of the world in which they live. Orobashi explained in his experiments that Vishap was able to adapt and evolve from all the experiments he did, this experiment is explained in detail in the book The Byakuyakoku Collection. Kukulkan explains that dragons and only they have the concept of evolution, with this evolution they have new powers and become stronger to adapt to the environment created by the heavenly principles. Kulkulan also explains that dragons are able to adapt and evolve in extreme capacities.

I have replaced the scene using a scene that comes directly from the game

Thank you very much.

I think this definitely qualifies for Adaptation.

However, I do not think it qualifies for Reactive Evolution, since the growth in power happens over generations, meaning any particular dragon does not seem to grow stronger in response to their environment, but rather adjusts their 'seeds' to benefit them or their offspring later.

It also doesn't seem combat-applicable, but worth noting.

 

[Furina003]

Thank you very much.

I think this definitely qualifies for Adaptation.

However, I do not think it qualifies for Reactive Evolution, since the growth in power happens over generations, meaning any particular dragon does not seem to grow stronger in response to their environment, but rather adjusts their 'seeds' to benefit them or their offspring later.

It also doesn't seem combat-applicable, but worth noting.

I want to ask a little, kukulan stated that they were able to transform into a stronger body to survive until now, which means that kukulan is really able to evolve, like what kukulan did where he was able to change his form into a human and it didn't take long.

doesn't this meet the requirements for reactive evolution?