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Ben 10: MFTL and MFTL+ (?) upgrade

Reiner04

Reiner04

9,631
10,327
So, as per this recent calc and already existing waybig's reacting to Conquest ray feat, all cast who scales should be upgraded to MFTL (in travel, reaction to combatt)

Also;


As can be seen clearly that Aggregor and Suglite reaction and combatt speed clearly scales to their flight speed (Aggregor was able dodge and react to attacks while flying and trio was able to react to Aggregor flight attacks which are visibly faster than his flight speed, Suglite could react to obstacles from point blank range while flying), So MFTL+ reaction + conbatt speed. Wank? WANK? WANK????

EDIT: Feedback MFTL+ Calc has been accepted too

Thanks to @Ghengiroo115 (Friend inside me), for following information:
Ghengiroo115 said:
A few things I want to add are:
  1. Way Big (and other top tiers) are consistently portrayed to be around the speed of regular characters. This can be seen here, here, here, here and here, and there are other examples too if we really need them.
  2. In the episode Deep, both Big Chill and some Piscciss Volann warriors are shown scaling to Ultimate Greg’s full flight speed. We know this is his full flight speed as he already has the piece of the Map of Infinity he was looking for and has zero reason to not go as fast as he can.
  3. Big Chill in the episode Tummy Trouble is shown casually reacting to Incursean spacecrafts and their weapons. These spacecrafts should have FTL travel and their attack speed would scale accordingly.
  4. Conductoids are stated to travel their home nebula by propelling themselves off of “minute voltage differences”. Not only should this require a lot of skill and good reaction speed to consistently pull off, but the attack speed and flight speed of Feedback’s electricity should also scale to this.
Click to expand...

Agree: @Friend inside me, @LuffyRuffy46307, @NXCHT.66, @Aolphl, @DarkDragonMedeus, @zaraus, @Maverick_Zero_X, @Firestorm808, @Rosa

Disagree: @Gendolfgg1
 
Last edited:
Damn you Reiner, this was meant to be my CRT.

Anyway obviously I agree. A few things I want to add are:
  1. Way Big (and other top tiers) are consistently portrayed to be around the speed of regular characters. This can be seen here, here, here, here and here, and there are other examples too if we really need them.
  2. In the episode Deep, both Big Chill and some Piscciss Volann warriors are shown scaling to Ultimate Greg’s full flight speed. This should be his full flight speed as he already has the piece of the Map of Infinity he was looking for and has zero reason to not go as fast as he can.
  3. Big Chill in the episode Tummy Trouble is shown casually reacting to Incursean spacecrafts and their weapons. These spacecrafts should have FTL travel and their attack speed would scale accordingly.
  4. Conductoids are stated to travel their home nebula by propelling themselves off of “minute voltage differences”. Not only should this require a lot of skill and good reaction speed to consistently pull off, but the attack speed and flight speed of Feedback’s electricity should also scale to this.
I’ll edit with the necessary clips and scans in a moment, I just wanted to list these out quickly.
 
Last edited:
Oh, this is a very strong speed improvement for Ben 10, but I have to disagree for the reasons listed below:

1) Fasttrack could not outrun Dr. Animo's rocket for a long time, which obviously flew at a speed not exceeding hypersonic. However, at the end of the Fasttrack, although it accelerated, it did not completely overtake the rocket, it just does not look like the speed that you want to assign to it.

2) I do not know which characters should scale to the speed of the ray Way Big, because he did not apply it to other aliens, but only to incredibly powerful ones that other aliens would not be able to defeat. Therefore, scaling is inappropriate, Tokustar's ray is a special type of attack that was used very rarely, and Ben used the alien mainly because of his physical strength. Space storm, cosmic rays - this is another topic with which I disagree.

About the rest:

🧐 I agree with the reaction to the Aggressor's flight (but I have already raised this issue in my thread), I agree with the Crystal's reaction to its own flight, but I do not agree with the attack speed, because it has not been demonstrated before in other battles.
 
still, the XLR8 is better because it has no friction, which is why it moves faster and accelerates, and Fasttrack has problems with this
 
Ghengiroo115 said:
Damn you Reiner, this was meant to be my CRT.

Anyway obviously I agree. A few things I want to add are:
  1. Way Big (and other top tiers) are consistently portrayed to be around the speed of regular characters.
  2. In the episode Deep, both Big Chill and some Piscciss Volann warriors are shown scaling to Ultimate Greg’s full flight speed. We know this is his full flight speed as he already has the piece of the Map he was looking for and has zero reason to not go as fast as he can.
  3. Big Chill in the episode Tummy Trouble is shown casually reacting to Incursean spacecrafts and their weapons. These spacecrafts should have FTL travel and their attack speed would scale accordingly.
  4. Conductoids are stated to travel their home nebula by propelling themselves off of “minute voltage differences”. Not only should this require a lot of skill and good reaction speed to consistently pull off, but the attack speed and flight speed of Feedback’s electricity should also scale to this.
I’ll edit with the necessary clips and scans in a moment, I just wanted to list these out quickly.
Click to expand...
I agree with Feedback's feat
 
by the way, according to the same logic, we need to improve Vilgax's reaction in proportion to his flight to Petropia
 
Gendolfgg1 said:
2) I do not know which characters should scale to the speed of the ray Way Big, because he did not apply it to other aliens, but only to incredibly powerful ones that other aliens would not be able to defeat. Therefore, scaling is inappropriate, Tokustar's ray is a special type of attack that was used very rarely, and Ben used the alien mainly because of his physical strength. Space storm, cosmic rays - this is another topic with which I disagree.
Click to expand...
Way Big’s speed comes from him physically reacting and moving before the Conquest Ray hit him, so it’s his physical movement that’s MFTL and not just his Cosmic Ray. Some characters that have shown themselves scaling in speed to Way Big level characters are Rath, Lightning Volt (Ben 23’s Frankenstrike), Feedback, Ghostfreak, Kevin, Rook, Zed and Chromastone.
 
Ghengiroo115 said:
Way Big’s speed comes from him physically reacting and moving before the Conquest Ray hit him, so it’s his physical movement that’s MFTL and not just his Cosmic Ray. Some characters that have shown themselves scaling in speed to Way Big level characters are Rath, Lightning Volt (Ben 23’s Frankenstrike), Feedback, Ghostfreak, Kevin, Rook, Zed and Chromastone.
Click to expand...
yes, I know, but I just don't know who the Way Big speed should scale to
 
Me when the when the.
🐘

Either way, i request to not multi post and keep the thread readable enough. If there's some misunderstanding regarding the basics of stuff then they can just be cleared up in Ben 10 general discussion thread tbh.
 
We don't downscale characters for the weapons they use, just coz it seems to be basic and all, for instance if a MFTL character uses Bow-arrow it doesn't mean his attack speed will be supersonic, lot's of MFTL characters uses lasers attacks and all, but doesn't mean they're soL, UA Aggregor Flight speed is visibly slower than his nuclear attack speed doesn't mean he should be downgraded to soL, Waybig uses cosmic rays doesn't mean it should be nuked to soL, conquest ray itself is a kind of laser based weapon. Doesn't mean it should be downgraded to. That's the reason we don't treat Fictional lasers same as irl one's. Fictional weapons do not necessarily just as much fast as their real life counterparts but just atleast should be that fast for sake of calc.
 
Ghengiroo115 said:
Damn you Reiner, this was meant to be my CRT.

Anyway obviously I agree. A few things I want to add are:
  1. Way Big (and other top tiers) are consistently portrayed to be around the speed of regular characters. This can be seen here, here, here, here and here, and there are other examples too if we really need them.
  2. In the episode Deep, both Big Chill and some Piscciss Volann warriors are shown scaling to Ultimate Greg’s full flight speed. We know this is his full flight speed as he already has the piece of the Map of Infinity he was looking for and has zero reason to not go as fast as he can.
  3. Big Chill in the episode Tummy Trouble is shown casually reacting to Incursean spacecrafts and their weapons. These spacecrafts should have FTL travel and their attack speed would scale accordingly.
  4. Conductoids are stated to travel their home nebula by propelling themselves off of “minute voltage differences”. Not only should this require a lot of skill and good reaction speed to consistently pull off, but the attack speed and flight speed of Feedback’s electricity should also scale to this.
I’ll edit with the necessary clips and scans in a moment, I just wanted to list these out quickly.
Click to expand...
Added in the OP.
Aolphl said:
Let Rex have Mftl+, I don't want anything else.
Click to expand...
Can we get much higher?
 
Reiner04 said:
We don't downscale characters for the weapons they use, just coz it seems to be basic and all, for instance if a MFTL character uses Bow-arrow it doesn't mean his attack speed will be supersonic, lot's of MFTL characters uses lasers attacks and all, but doesn't mean they're soL, UA Aggregor Flight speed is visibly slower than his nuclear attack speed doesn't mean he should be downgraded to soL, Waybig uses cosmic rays doesn't mean it should be nuked to soL, conquest ray itself is a kind of laser based weapon. Doesn't mean it should be downgraded to. That's the reason we don't treat Fictional lasers same as irl one's. Fictional weapons do not necessarily just as much fast as their real life counterparts but just atleast should be that fast for sake of calc.
Click to expand...
I understand this perfectly well, but we need some criteria and conditions with limitations in which physical phenomena must exist. For example, if metaphysics is not stated in the universe, then the speed of the characters should not exceed the speed of light, and if metaphysics is stated, then the speed can exceed the speed of light. It works exactly the same way with lasers, nuclear blasts and light beams. I just don't understand why some people, seeing that laser attacks are used in some fictional verse, rate them "subsonic, if numerical equivalents or other natural properties are not specified." I understand your essence of scaling, but I do not know if it can be applied to these characters specifically (due to the relativity of speed).
 
Gendolfgg1 said:
I understand this perfectly well, but we need some criteria and conditions with limitations in which physical phenomena must exist. For example, if metaphysics is not stated in the universe, then the speed of the characters should not exceed the speed of light, and if metaphysics is stated, then the speed can exceed the speed of light. It works exactly the same way with lasers, nuclear blasts and light beams. I just don't understand why some people, seeing that laser attacks are used in some fictional verse, rate them "subsonic, if numerical equivalents or other natural properties are not specified." I understand your essence of scaling, but I do not know if it can be applied to these characters specifically (due to the relativity of speed).
Click to expand...
Nuh uh.
 
Ghengiroo115 said:
Don’t ask
Click to expand...
e82b23e6fd5bac5d6845680ad8eb5a80.gif
 
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