Danganronpa V3 Downgrades

[Queen_Dasania]

After a new calc I did was approved, and some discussions I’ve been having, I think it’s time to downgrade the V3 characters.

My calc has the explosions the students survived in the tunnel at athlete level. They also survived flamethrowers, which this wiki has at street level. They also survived high falls, which also appear to be in the athlete to street level range. So the tunnel durability feats, which they survived, but still knocked then out briefly, are in the athlete to street level range, meaning this should be the max durability of really every character

Now my thoughts on the current placement;

I think the main feat placing everyone on small building level is flawed for a few reasons. First off, it assumes that the aquarium glass Tenko and Gonta broke is as strong as ballistic glass because it’s made from acrylic glass. Aquarium glass is far weaker than ballistic glass, due to the way ballistic glass is made. It’s made with layers that can help it absorb kinetic energy, while aquarium glass is just thick glass. Ballistic glass is more expensive to make, which is why aquariums don’t use it. I unfortunately can’t suggest any better numbers to use, as there just aren’t really any good ones, since we don’t have fragmentation numbers for aquarium glass, but the current number just really inflates the power of the feat, and I don’t think we can use the calc for it

https://www.quora.com/Is-it-a-good-...other-alternatives-to-achieve-good-durability (info linked here)

Scaling everyone to Keebo’s durability also feels flawed. Sure he’s only as strong as a senior citizen, but he’s made of metal, it’s reasonable to assume he’d be more durable than normal humans.

We also say small building level due to Kaito’s body surviving the rocket feat. But he still would’ve did from it. Monokuma was just mad that he happened to die from his sickness first. So he shouldn’t scale in durability since the “feat” would’ve killed him

I also think that, assuming this rocket is more powerful than the one Jin Kirigiri was in is flawed, as we don’t know if they were designed exactly the same, or how reliable what we’re seeing it


We also have some anti feats that really counter the idea of all the characters being small building level. In chapter 1, even though Rantaro didn’t actually die from the shot put ball, it was believable enough that Kaede was executed due to having “done” it. At the height the shot put ball was at, it should have had street level energy when it hit him. There is no approved calc for this, but I think it’s evident enough, especially with the other evidence I’m putting out

Shuichi, in the final chapter, needed Keebo to blast down a door for him, which only needed wall level power. Later in that chapter, Keebo was scared to blast down the rubble that covered Himiko in fear of hurting her, to the point where he resorted to going to the exisals for help lifting it instead. The energy needed to blast the rubble away is only wall level


This pretty consistently limits humans in the verse to athlete to street level.

There is one potential counter to this. Ryoma can hit shot put balls at wall level. This feat and calc are approved and sound. However, I have two solutions. One; we only have the peak humans in the verse scale. Ryoma, Maki, Gonta, Tenko, and Kirumi, while leaving everyone else at Street level. Or, we assume Ryoma can only achieve this level of power with his talent, and leave all the humans in the verse at street level. I don’t think this is too far fetched, as we see often enough that Kodaka makes his characters have power when using their talents that’s far above their normal level, like with Leon or Mondo

 

[Sparkive]

In general, I agree (except for the part about scaling them up to a flamethrower), but I recommend you link the calculation you're saying has problems.
I'd also like to add that in Kaito's execution itself, Keebo protects the rest of the debris from the execution, probably implying that he's more resistent.

 

[Queen_Dasania]

In general, I agree (except for the part about scaling them up to a flamethrower), but I recommend you link the calculation you're saying has problems.
I'd also like to add that in Kaito's execution itself, Keebo protects the rest of the debris from the execution, probably implying that he's more resistent.

I don’t think there’s any problem with scaling them to the flame thrower, it would be weird not to. But I’ll wait for others to comment

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:FantaRin_The_First/K1B0_Feat

And this is the calc

And yeah, I agree. Keebo is definitely more durable

 

[Sparkive]

I don’t think there’s any problem with scaling them to the flame thrower, it would be weird not to. But I’ll wait for others to comment

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:FantaRin_The_First/K1B0_Feat

And this is the calc

And yeah, I agree. Keebo is definitely more durable

I meant for you to put it in the OP, but oh well.

 

[StrymULTRA]

We also say small building level due to Kaito’s body surviving the rocket feat. But he still would’ve did from it. Monokuma was just mad that he happened to die from his sickness first. So he shouldn’t scale in durability since the “feat” would’ve killed him

This is not how it works. Kaito was already severely weakened due to his illness, and his body was not destroyed anyways. We do allow durability feats from corpses not being damaged from attacks, so I do not see why this would be different.

 

[Sparkive]

This is not how it works. Kaito was already severely weakened due to his illness, and his body was not destroyed anyways. We do allow durability feats from corpses not being damaged from attacks, so I do not see why this would be different.

Makes sense, and what do you think of the aquarium glass feat?

 

[Thebadtimetrio32]

After a new calc I did was approved, and some discussions I’ve been having, I think it’s time to downgrade the V3 characters.

My calc has the explosions the students survived in the tunnel at athlete level. They also survived flamethrowers, which this wiki has at street level. They also survived high falls, which also appear to be in the athlete to street level range. So the tunnel durability feats, which they survived, but still knocked then out briefly, are in the athlete to street level range, meaning this should be the max durability of really every character

In Kaede’s execution, after she gets dragged really high up she gets put in a fall that takes 3.52 to 6.16 seconds. The values for both get roughly about 31.585 to 96.738 Kilojoules. If you want me to make a blog for it I can but here’s the feat anyhow

Additionally, you can infer that due to the Monokubs always needing the existals to deal with most if not any of the students, the students should scale to when the Monokubs spin Kiyo around really fast, which I’ve had calced to 121.916 Kilojoules. Here’s the feat, if you want the calc let me know

I will say that I agree that MOST of V3 comfortably fit the street-wall ranges without cross scaling to Hopes Peak, there’s a reason why most of them used to be 10-B afterall.

Now my thoughts on the current placement;

I think the main feat placing everyone on small building level is flawed for a few reasons. First off, it assumes that the aquarium glass Tenko and Gonta broke is as strong as ballistic glass because it’s made from acrylic glass. Aquarium glass is far weaker than ballistic glass, due to the way ballistic glass is made. It’s made with layers that can help it absorb kinetic energy, while aquarium glass is just thick glass. Ballistic glass is more expensive to make, which is why aquariums don’t use it. I unfortunately can’t suggest any better numbers to use, as there just aren’t really any good ones, since we don’t have fragmentation numbers for aquarium glass, but the current number just really inflates the power of the feat, and I don’t think we can use the calc for it

https://www.quora.com/Is-it-a-good-...other-alternatives-to-achieve-good-durability (info linked here)

Scaling everyone to Keebo’s durability also feels flawed. Sure he’s only as strong as a senior citizen, but he’s made of metal, it’s reasonable to assume he’d be more durable than normal humans.

If you can grab the person who calced the feat and asked them why, and they admitted that they ass pulled it, then sure. There is a way to get glass destruction which is really complicated although I have gotten it to 0.006 Tons of TNT through it. I can make a blog for that too, I don’t wanna flood my initial response and I just woke up so sorry if me asking to port calcs every time gets annoying.

And yeah, I agree with downgrading the durability of the average human due to K1-B0 being more durable as a robot. Note, this means that K1-B0’s AP will be about street-wall, however his dura will scale to wherever that recalc is, is that fine?

We also say small building level due to Kaito’s body surviving the rocket feat. But he still would’ve did from it. Monokuma was just mad that he happened to die from his sickness first. So he shouldn’t scale in durability since the “feat” would’ve killed him

I also think that, assuming this rocket is more powerful than the one Jin Kirigiri was in is flawed, as we don’t know if they were designed exactly the same, or how reliable what we’re seeing it

For the first paragraph, I forward what Strym said. His corpse was heavily unfazed by what vaporized Jin. The only harm on his body was his illness, and he was unaffected despite that major illness.

I don’t think assuming the rocket is more powerful is flawed, Tsumugi intended to make V3 a 1 to 1 product of the original Hopes Peak universe, and this execution is meant to be a call back to the Hopes Peak one which nearly 1 to 1 mechanics, the differences only being that Kaito’s is more aggressive and dives down, although Kaito’s still has the heat up which is inferred to have killed Jin and comes back to earth the exact same, alongside other differences my tired brain can’t rack up.

We also have some anti feats that really counter the idea of all the characters being small building level. In chapter 1, even though Rantaro didn’t actually die from the shot put ball, it was believable enough that Kaede was executed due to having “done” it. At the height the shot put ball was at, it should have had street level energy when it hit him. There is no approved calc for this, but I think it’s evident enough, especially with the other evidence I’m putting out

Shuichi, in the final chapter, needed Keebo to blast down a door for him, which only needed wall level power. Later in that chapter, Keebo was scared to blast down the rubble that covered Himiko in fear of hurting her, to the point where he resorted to going to the exisals for help lifting it instead. The energy needed to blast the rubble away is only wall level

For first anti feat, sure.

Second anti feat, for the first half Shuichi could lack the Destructive capability to break down walls but scale to 9-A in AP, assuming that 9-A is sound anyway. For the latter half, I don’t think its fair to use a lower calc for K1-B0 when he has High 8-C stuff. Unless he really condensed his blast, he should be using the High 8-C energy here and thus that would be killing Himiko. 15.24 Megajoules is not an anti feat to Lower end Kilojoules either, which you didn’t argue against yet but I’m mentioning it anyway.

There is one potential counter to this. Ryoma can hit shot put balls at wall level. This feat and calc are approved and sound. However, I have two solutions. One; we only have the peak humans in the verse scale. Ryoma, Maki, Gonta, Tenko, and Kirumi, while leaving everyone else at Street level. Or, we assume Ryoma can only achieve this level of power with his talent, and leave all the humans in the verse at street level. I don’t think this is too far fetched, as we see often enough that Kodaka makes his characters have power when using their talents that’s far above their normal level, like with Leon or Mondo

My conclusion is this:

Gonta should very obviously upscale any calc in the verse, and even if Ryoma’s 9-B was talent, Gonta is so superhumanly impressive that he would upscale due to raw strength I believe
Kaito’s 9-A stuff is still fine although in my recent revision I offered to upgrade the 9-A feat to upscale Hopes Peak characters, I hate Gonta getting one shot by Chihiro lmfao and the characters who currently scale should still scale to that.
Unless the calcer for the original calc folds and my recalc gets rejected once posted, K1-B0 and only K1-B0 would have 9-A durability, and we wokld use that as consistentcy for 9-A Tenko
Regardless of what happens regarding K1-B0 or anyone else, I agree with a 9-C to 9-B downgrade for everyone else

 

[StrymULTRA]

Makes sense, and what do you think of the aquarium glass feat?

Honestly idrc about that given that we don't have a real frag value for glass so...

 

[Queen_Dasania]

This is not how it works. Kaito was already severely weakened due to his illness, and his body was not destroyed anyways. We do allow durability feats from corpses not being damaged from attacks, so I do not see why this would be different.

Just because it happened once, doesn’t mean that that’s the regular way we’d approach things

From what I’m seeing, that character was already dead prior to the explosion, and we have no confirmation that explosion would’ve killed him, so the scaling is ok

Yes, Kaito’s body survived the rocket, and the rocket didn’t kill him. But the attack was still an execution intended to kill him, so I think it’s fair to assume he wouldn’t have survived it

That being said, if we do end up still accepting the other small building level calc, I’m ok with this being used as supporting evidence. But if this were the only valid feat of this level, I would just be iffy accept it personally

 

[Thebadtimetrio32]

Yes, Kaito’s body survived the rocket, and the rocket didn’t kill him. But the attack was still an execution intended to kill him, so I think it’s fair to assume he wouldn’t have survived it

That being said, if we do end up still accepting the other small building level calc, I’m ok with this being used as supporting evidence. But if this were the only valid feat of this level, I would just be iffy accept it personally

What would’ve killed him was most likely the latter impact that likely would’ve harmed the rest of the cast that was watching. It’s inferred that what caused the vaporization was when the ship moves so fast into space that it considerably heats up, which we have confirmation Kaito lived up to that point and was unaffected by that completely. Even with the latter impact Kaito’s body was unharmed which is rare for Danganronpa deaths.

 

[StrymULTRA]

Yes, Kaito’s body survived the rocket, and the rocket didn’t kill him. But the attack was still an execution intended to kill him, so I think it’s fair to assume he wouldn’t have survived it

The thing is that his body was still largely intact, so we cannot say it's as durable as Jin because the latter was straight up charred, there is a difference in toughness between the two.

 

[Queen_Dasania]

In Kaede’s execution, after she gets dragged really high up she gets put in a fall that takes 3.52 to 6.16 seconds. The values for both get roughly about 31.585 to 96.738 Kilojoules. If you want me to make a blog for it I can but here’s the feat anyhow

Hmm. I’d probably be more comfortable with an official calc made on that, but that is pretty good evidence at least.

Additionally, you can infer that due to the Monokubs always needing the existals to deal with most if not any of the students, the students should scale to when the Monokubs spin Kiyo around really fast, which I’ve had calced to 121.916 Kilojoules. Here’s the feat, if you want the calc let me know

I can also agree to this. Where is the calc? If it’s approved, we should list it on the page. If not, we should get it approved so we can. And wouldn’t this mean an upgrade for the Monokubs? They’re currently listed as below average human, which feels like a huge oversight with a calc like this out there



As for the rest, I can agree to majority of what you say. lol I will say this isn’t my only planned crt, so dw too much about Gonta getting one shot by Chihiro anyway

And I can agree with the weaker characters on street to wall level, while keeping the upper characters on small building level

And the calcer explicitly say why they use the values for ballistic glass. It’s because ballistic glass and aquarium glass both use acrylic glass. I can understand why they used that number, but again, ballistic glass is way stronger due to how it’s made. It’a made to absorb energy with layers In ways that aquarium glass isn’t. If it’s the best number we can get, I guess I’ll reluctantly agree, but if you have a method that can find the actual number, I’d love that personally

Fanta rin did the calc. Idk how to tag them. If someone can, that’s helpful. But I’ll just leave a message on their board

 

[Queen_Dasania]

Also though, one issue with having weaker and stronger characters on different tiers is that they were both equally affected by attacks in the tunnel. We could just choose that up to an inconsistency, but it’s worth bringing up

I honestly think V3 is just a bit tricky to scale. But it’s why I’m bringing all this up so that we can have a discussion on it

 

[Queen_Dasania]

The thing is that his body was still largely intact, so we cannot say it's as durable as Jin because the latter was straight up charred, there is a difference in toughness between the two.

I’m assuming you’re saying that he can be scaled to Jin Kirigiri, which is fair (provided the main verse never gets downgraded)

 

[Thebadtimetrio32]

Hmm. I’d probably be more comfortable with an official calc made on that, but that is pretty good evidence at least.

Kaede falls before her execution

The first time we see her stop falling is 711 frames, although she looks like that isn't near the start of her drop, so we'll start when the play goes "live" for a high end, which is 645 frames, then she falls by frame 799, 799 - 711 is 88/25 frames or 3.52 seconds. For high end, 799 - 645 = 154/25 frames or 6.16 seconds

Using both times, Kaede had been falling for either 60.75 meters or 186.06 meters

Kaede weighs 53 kg according to the monopad.

Low end: 31,585.74 Joules (Wall level)

High end: 96,738.18 Joules (Wall level) (I made this from a discord message, if the feat gets accepted I'll make a blog for it.

I can also agree to this. Where is the calc? If it’s approved, we should list it on the page. If not, we should get it approved so we can. And wouldn’t this mean an upgrade for the Monokubs? They’re currently listed as below average human, which feels like a huge oversight with a calc like this out thered

Monokubs spin Korekiyo around

Korekiyo is 1.88 meters according to the monopad, and for him to move this much he must've moved 360 degress

(2) * pi * 1.88 = 11.81 meters

They spun him 22 times, so he was spun 259.82 meters in total.

0.21 to 0.24 (as an average, too aids to go frame by frame when frame by frame websites won't accept this video for age reasons), 3 seconds

259.82 / 3 = 86.61 m/s (Subsonic)

Korekiyo weighs 65 kg

ill use the velocity u found with since thats needed

360 deg is 6.28319 rad
being spun 22 times in 3 seconds would make the angular velocity (6.28319*22)/3 = 46.0767266667 rad/s

to find moment of inertia u need to find angular momentum, and angular velocity which we already have

angular momentum is multiplying mass velocity and radius together or 65 kg*86.61*(1.88/2) = 5291.871 kg/m^2/s
moment of inertia is angular momentum/angular velocity or 5291.871/46.0767266667 = 114.849108928 kg/m^2

then the rotational energy would be 0.5*114.849108928*46.0767266667^2 = 121,916.046811 joules or wall level (Another discord message but there's no images so it's really easy to blog. But yeah Monokubs upgrade)

As for the rest, I can agree to majority of what you say. lol I will say this isn’t my only planned crt, so dw too much about Gonta getting one shot by Chihiro anyway

And I can agree with the weaker characters on street to wall level, while keeping the upper characters on small building level

I was also planning on making a large V3 CRT after the one I made which afaik I didn't get a lot of responses to. The V3 profiles seem very outdated in information and formatting, so I wanted to completely get them redone as a whole, and I am currently replaying through V3 (I have the game open playing Chapter 3's trial as we speak)

And yeah, I think a straight up 9-B rating is fine, but I can see "9-C, At most 9-B" while I think Kaito, Kokichi, Maki, Gonta, Kirumi, Tenko and potentially Ryoma would get 9-A (Unless we agree to upscale it from Jin's actual value, which would get them to baseline 8-C)

And the calcer explicitly say why they use the values for ballistic glass. It’s because ballistic glass and aquarium glass both use acrylic glass. I can understand why they used that number, but again, ballistic glass is way stronger due to how it’s made. It’a made to absorb energy with layers In ways that aquarium glass isn’t. If it’s the best number we can get, I guess I’ll reluctantly agree, but if you have a method that can find the actual number, I’d love that personally

Fanta rin did the calc. Idk how to tag them. If someone can, that’s helpful. But I’ll just leave a message on their board

This is a formula I was sarcastically given by a friend:
badtime, this is an easy step-by-step guide of how to calculate glass destruction feats!

step one: 21.4274565474/sqrt(radius of the destruction in centimeters) = pressure in MPa!
step two: pressure*area in mm^2 = force in newtons!
step three: force*thickness of glass in meters = energy if you need to calculate AP!

So using this and using the measurements in the calc:
21.4274565474/sqrt(238.8) = 1.39 MPa
Area is 10.99 m^2, or 10,990,000 mm^2
1.39 * 10990000 = 15,276,100 Newtons
15276100 * 1.18 = 18,025,798 Joules or 0.004 Tons of TNT (Wall level+)

I got 0.006 Tons from my own pixel scaling a while ago, so if it is preferred that I disregard the pixel scaling here then that's 9-A but rn it would be 9-B+. Imo, even if we disregard Kaito's feat, Gonta should EASILY be 9-A, same with Maki (Who I think upscales Tenko) and Kirumi.

Also though, one issue with having weaker and stronger characters on different tiers is that they were both equally affected by attacks in the tunnel. We could just choose that up to an inconsistency, but it’s worth bringing up

Easy inconsistency. They gas up Gonta's strength such as him lifting a manhole with two fingers (K1-B0 can't with two hands) chucking it 5 yards away effortlessly and that he could "easily crush a child's skull", alongside the fact that part of Chapter 1's trial was accusing him of throwing a shot put ball from a whole different room from the library with a small gap from the door. They also thought he was the only one in Chapter 2 who could chuck Ryoma from the pool's window, but wouldn't be accurate enough. Maki can also effortlessly snap Kokichi's neck like a twig, and causes Kaito to bleed with a likely not all out punch.

 

[Queen_Dasania]

Kaede falls before her execution

The first time we see her stop falling is 711 frames, although she looks like that isn't near the start of her drop, so we'll start when the play goes "live" for a high end, which is 645 frames, then she falls by frame 799, 799 - 711 is 88/25 frames or 3.52 seconds. For high end, 799 - 645 = 154/25 frames or 6.16 seconds

Using both times, Kaede had been falling for either 60.75 meters or 186.06 meters

Kaede weighs 53 kg according to the monopad.

Low end: 31,585.74 Joules (Wall level)

High end: 96,738.18 Joules (Wall level) (I made this from a discord message, if the feat gets accepted I'll make a blog for it.

Monokubs spin Korekiyo around

Korekiyo is 1.88 meters according to the monopad, and for him to move this much he must've moved 360 degress

(2) * pi * 1.88 = 11.81 meters

They spun him 22 times, so he was spun 259.82 meters in total.

0.21 to 0.24 (as an average, too aids to go frame by frame when frame by frame websites won't accept this video for age reasons), 3 seconds

259.82 / 3 = 86.61 m/s (Subsonic)

Korekiyo weighs 65 kg

ill use the velocity u found with since thats needed

360 deg is 6.28319 rad
being spun 22 times in 3 seconds would make the angular velocity (6.28319*22)/3 = 46.0767266667 rad/s

to find moment of inertia u need to find angular momentum, and angular velocity which we already have

angular momentum is multiplying mass velocity and radius together or 65 kg*86.61*(1.88/2) = 5291.871 kg/m^2/s
moment of inertia is angular momentum/angular velocity or 5291.871/46.0767266667 = 114.849108928 kg/m^2

then the rotational energy would be 0.5*114.849108928*46.0767266667^2 = 121,916.046811 joules or wall level (Another discord message but there's no images so it's really easy to blog. But yeah Monokubs upgrade)

I was also planning on making a large V3 CRT after the one I made which afaik I didn't get a lot of responses to. The V3 profiles seem very outdated in information and formatting, so I wanted to completely get them redone as a whole, and I am currently replaying through V3 (I have the game open playing Chapter 3's trial as we speak)

And yeah, I think a straight up 9-B rating is fine, but I can see "9-C, At most 9-B" while I think Kaito, Kokichi, Maki, Gonta, Kirumi, Tenko and potentially Ryoma would get 9-A (Unless we agree to upscale it from Jin's actual value, which would get them to baseline 8-C)

This is a formula I was sarcastically given by a friend:
badtime, this is an easy step-by-step guide of how to calculate glass destruction feats!

step one: 21.4274565474/sqrt(radius of the destruction in centimeters) = pressure in MPa!
step two: pressure*area in mm^2 = force in newtons!
step three: force*thickness of glass in meters = energy if you need to calculate AP!

So using this and using the measurements in the calc:
21.4274565474/sqrt(238.8) = 1.39 MPa
Area is 10.99 m^2, or 10,990,000 mm^2
1.39 * 10990000 = 15,276,100 Newtons
15276100 * 1.18 = 18,025,798 Joules or 0.004 Tons of TNT (Wall level+)

I got 0.006 Tons from my own pixel scaling a while ago, so if it is preferred that I disregard the pixel scaling here then that's 9-A but rn it would be 9-B+. Imo, even if we disregard Kaito's feat, Gonta should EASILY be 9-A, same with Maki (Who I think upscales Tenko) and Kirumi.

Easy inconsistency. They gas up Gonta's strength such as him lifting a manhole with two fingers (K1-B0 can't with two hands) chucking it 5 yards away effortlessly and that he could "easily crush a child's skull", alongside the fact that part of Chapter 1's trial was accusing him of throwing a shot put ball from a whole different room from the library with a small gap from the door. They also thought he was the only one in Chapter 2 who could chuck Ryoma from the pool's window, but wouldn't be accurate enough. Maki can also effortlessly snap Kokichi's neck like a twig, and causes Kaito to bleed with a likely not all out punch.

Ok, so I think that’s enough consistency to have the Monokubs, and lower tier students on wall level. Obviously I think you should make blogs for the calcs. But those are good feats, good calcs. I can agree enough with the higher students still being small building level, and possibly higher (though I do plan to do some revisions to the main verse that could affect that specific scaling)

And again, I think we could definitely do wall level+ to small building level for Keebo, really whatever depending on if we do a re calc for that feat.

If Maki can snap necks that easily, I think she at least can be placed at Peak Human lifting. It’s implied she’s superior to Tenko, so I think arguably only Maki would really scale to Peak Human. But I think that sounds accurate enough. Technically, the only lifting fears in the V3 verse (both done by me) are peak human, but I think Gonta can still be kept at superhuman since he’s so much stronger than everyone else,cans his strength is explicitly called superhuman

 

[StrymULTRA]

I think for the Kaito thing that while he shouldn't cross-scale by Jin for now, we can still downscale him from this common calc that is still 9-A I think.

 

[Thebadtimetrio32]

Ok, so I think that’s enough consistency to have the Monokubs, and lower tier students on wall level. Obviously I think you should make blogs for the calcs. But those are good feats, good calcs. I can agree enough with the higher students still being small building level, and possibly higher (though I do plan to do some revisions to the main verse that could affect that specific scaling)

And again, I think we could definitely do wall level+ to small building level for Keebo, really whatever depending on if we do a re calc for that feat.

Here's all the feats in a blog. I'll get them accepted while I can and we can include that in the revision.

Gonta, Kaito, Kokichi, Kirumi, Maki and Tenko: Small Building level
K1-B0's durability: Wall level+
Ryoma: At least Wall level
V3 Students and Monokubs: At most Wall level (Street level could be added as a rating)

This is my conclusion just so it gets put out there.

I think for the Kaito thing that while he shouldn't cross-scale by Jin for now, we can still downscale him from this common calc that is still 9-A I think.

The current calc should be fine, although the one you posted is actually around the same value. Still, the current calc of it vaporizing him should be good and was checked.

 

[StrymULTRA]

The current calc should be fine, although the one you posted is actually around the same value. Still, the current calc of it vaporizing him should be good and was checked.

Which calc? I think I've missed it.

 

[Thebadtimetrio32]

If Maki can snap necks that easily, I think she at least can be placed at Peak Human lifting. It’s implied she’s superior to Tenko, so I think arguably only Maki would really scale to Peak Human. But I think that sounds accurate enough. Technically, the only lifting fears in the V3 verse (both done by me) are peak human, but I think Gonta can still be kept at superhuman since he’s so much stronger than everyone else,cans his strength is explicitly called superhuman

Almost forgot to respond to this, but I think Lifting Strength should be left out as the current revision focuses heavily on the Attack Potency of characters. Although if you want more substance for your upcoming revisions (I'll hold off on mine until you do yours), Snapping necks super causally is Class 1. Tenko in the raws also has a statement that she would snap any males necks for Kaede (Kaede FTE1). Take that as you will

I would also like to calculate Gonta lifting the man hole with two fingers and even chucking it 5 yards. I had calced it before but idk where I placed it, but I remember it reaching Class 1-5. There are some speed calcs I would like to pass on too, but this revision is not the place for it.

 

[Queen_Dasania]

Here's all the feats in a blog. I'll get them accepted while I can and we can include that in the revision.

Gonta, Kaito, Kokichi, Kirumi, Maki and Tenko: Small Building level
K1-B0's durability: Wall level+
Ryoma: At least Wall level
V3 Students and Monokubs: At most Wall level (Street level could be added as a rating)

This is my conclusion just so it gets put out there.

The scaling of average students gets tricky. Obviously from my calc, we can say athlete level. We can say street level from the flamethrowers imo. But if all your calcs are accepted, we have solid wall level durability for at least Kaede. It could be only applied to her, but she should just outright have wall level durability. Obviously for others, I think the “at least street level, at most wall level” is entirely fair, especially with the explicit street level anti feat/implication for Rantaro

I’m not entirely sure about Kokichi. He only ever really hurts a very sick Kaito

 

[Thebadtimetrio32]

Which calc? I think I've missed it.

Here

 

[Queen_Dasania]

Almost forgot to respond to this, but I think Lifting Strength should be left out as the current revision focuses heavily on the Attack Potency of characters. Although if you want more substance for your upcoming revisions (I'll hold off on mine until you do yours), Snapping necks super causally is Class 1. Tenko in the raws also has a statement that she would snap any males necks for Kaede (Kaede FTE1). Take that as you will

I would also like to calculate Gonta lifting the man hole with two fingers and even chucking it 5 yards. I had calced it before but idk where I placed it, but I remember it reaching Class 1-5. There are some speed calcs I would like to pass on too, but this revision is not the place for it.

I’ll definitely make its own revision for it. But that being said, it does say in the link you posted to only use snapping necks as evidence for class 1 if it’s backed by other feats too. So id keep it to peak human for them. Also, definitely post your calc for the lifting strength for Gonta! The one I did focused on simply lifting the manhole cover, and the fact that he did it with two fingers. Your calc sounds like a good expansion of it

 

[Thebadtimetrio32]

The scaling of average students gets tricky. Obviously from my calc, we can say athlete level. We can say street level from the flamethrowers imo. But if all your calcs are accepted, we have solid wall level durability for at least Kaede. It could be only applied to her, but she should just outright have wall level durability. Obviously for others, I think the “at least street level, at most wall level” is entirely fair, especially with the explicit street level anti feat/implication for Rantaro

I can agree to K1-B0 being a stone wall due to being a Robot, but Kaede doesn't have that excuse so it wouldn't quite make sense. The Monokubs physically also shouldn't be too impressive from the rest of the cast, considering they need existals to threaten any of them. The Rantaro thing is pretty jarring, however it isn't uncommon for Danganronpa (Even Hopes Peak Arc) to have weird anti feats while still giving the series consistent 9-A feats to scale to.

I’m not entirely sure about Kokichi. He only ever really hurts a very sick Kaito

An even sicker Kaito is the one who endured the 9-A execution with no visible injuries, and then his corpse tanked the latter force of the execution while Kaito can easily read Kaito's movements and knock him down albeit noting that he got slower. Maki also calls him an impressive fighter while getting tensed up to fight him, so he should definitely at least be far superior to the normies of the cast, and scaling to the higher end of feats. The only issue I would have is that he struggles to lift 175 pounds alongside Shuichi, Kiyo and Himiko however LS isn't the same as AP and Kokichi notes that he's specifically weak for lifting, so I don't have a direct issue with Kokichi scaling to At least 9-B and at best 9-A alongside Kaito and the others.

I’ll definitely make its own revision for it. But that being said, it does say in the link you posted to only use snapping necks as evidence for class 1 if it’s backed by other feats too. So id keep it to peak human for them.

The context is the reason why it varies to the point where you need consistency. Kokichi notes it as if Maki literally requires no effort to snap his neck considering her seemingly superhuman strength.

Also, definitely post your calc for the lifting strength for Gonta! The one I did focused on simply lifting the manhole cover, and the fact that he did it with two fingers. Your calc sounds like a good expansion of it

I added it to the V3 mega post. It's Class 1 for the lifting, and a potential Class 10 value considering the fact that he did it with two fingers

 

[NeverForgett]

@Thebadtimetrio32 Can you summarise your arguments cause it's a lot to read and from the OP, I agree with it.

 

[Queen_Dasania]

I can agree to K1-B0 being a stone wall due to being a Robot, but Kaede doesn't have that excuse so it wouldn't quite make sense. The Monokubs physically also shouldn't be too impressive from the rest of the cast, considering they need existals to threaten any of them. The Rantaro thing is pretty jarring, however it isn't uncommon for Danganronpa (Even Hopes Peak Arc) to have weird anti feats while still giving the series consistent 9-A feats to scale to.

An even sicker Kaito is the one who endured the 9-A execution with no visible injuries, and then his corpse tanked the latter force of the execution while Kaito can easily read Kaito's movements and knock him down albeit noting that he got slower. Maki also calls him an impressive fighter while getting tensed up to fight him, so he should definitely at least be far superior to the normies of the cast, and scaling to the higher end of feats. The only issue I would have is that he struggles to lift 175 pounds alongside Shuichi, Kiyo and Himiko however LS isn't the same as AP and Kokichi notes that he's specifically weak for lifting, so I don't have a direct issue with Kokichi scaling to At least 9-B and at best 9-A alongside Kaito and the others.

The context is the reason why it varies to the point where you need consistency. Kokichi notes it as if Maki literally requires no effort to snap his neck considering her seemingly superhuman strength.

I added it to the V3 mega post. It's Class 1 for the lifting, and a potential Class 10 value considering the fact that he did it with two fingers

With Kaede, I just still argue she had the blatant feat that the others don’t have. While yeah, she isn’t a stone wall like Keebo, she’d still scale below him since he’s wall level* and she’s just wall level. We’re not given any reason to believe she’d be less durable than anyone, and if she has a feat they don’t have, I don’t think it’s bad to assume she’d be more durable. Though I guess it’s not too bad to just scale her to everyone

And yeah, I guess. So we can scale Kokichi to Kaito then. We don’t have to go into LS too much here, as you said. But yeah, it’s not the same as ap, an I think Kokichi definitely seems to be lower in Ls for the reasons you said

 

[Thebadtimetrio32]

Can you summarise your arguments cause it's a lot to read and from the OP, I agree with it.

Yeah sure:

• For K1-B0, the feat should be 0.004 Tons of TNT. Waiting for the calc to get applied, but it is agreed by the OP that outside of the really strong characters, only K1-B0 would get the scaling in his durability, his AP and the other characters wouldn't get that scaling (Wall+)
• Kaede and the Monokubs have 9-B feats that are approved by the OP although not approved by calc team yet (I just sent it to be checked). OP suggested to only give the straight 9-B rating to Kaede's durability, but I don't agree because Kaede has no reason to be a stone wall and shouldn't have durability that differs from any other average character. My opinion is that the average V3 character + Monokubs should have At most 9-B ratings for AP and durability, and I don't mind making the ratings "At least 9-C, At most 9-B" or something of the like.
• Kaito's 9-A feat was put into contention but I think the OP and everyone who was in the thread agrees that the 9-A Kaito feat is fine and the characters who already scaled to it remain unchanged, even Kokichi who was just put into contention, but I think it's now agreed that Kokichi keeps his 9-A rating
• Ryoma's 9-B feat is still fine, and even if it's just due to his metal ball and not through direct physicals (We never dove into it), I excluded him from everyone else since I think he should blatantly upscale Kaede and the Monokubs due to being a trained and dangerous Tennis Player. We don't have any evidence that he scales to the 9-A cast, so I won't make that assertion.

Maybe I missed things, but other than that it's just been LS stuff that's irrelevant to the thread.

 

[Queen_Dasania]

The Rantaro thing is pretty jarring, however it isn't uncommon for Danganronpa (Even Hopes Peak Arc) to have weird anti feats while still giving the series consistent 9-A feats to scale to.

For this specifically, I do plan to address this more with the main verse too. But the issue with Rantaro is that he has a street level anti feat, and his feats only go up to street level. You can kind of argue he should possibly scale to Kaede’s wall level feats since they endured the tunnel things similarly, but you could use that same argument to say everyone is on Gonta’s level, which clearly isn’t the case. You could also scale Rantaro to the Monokubs since, as you said, the kubs need the exisals to do harm to the students. But it could just be the case that the kubs just need the exisals for the stronger students

So it’s just shaky scaling. He’s supposed to be athletic in verse, so I’m still ok with a possibly wall level rating for him. But it’s just shaky

 

[Queen_Dasania]

Yeah sure:

• For K1-B0, the feat should be 0.004 Tons of TNT. Waiting for the calc to get applied, but it is agreed by the OP that outside of the really strong characters, only K1-B0 would get the scaling in his durability, his AP and the other characters wouldn't get that scaling (Wall+)
• Kaede and the Monokubs have 9-B feats that are approved by the OP although not approved by calc team yet (I just sent it to be checked). OP suggested to only give the straight 9-B rating to Kaede's durability, but I don't agree because Kaede has no reason to be a stone wall and shouldn't have durability that differs from any other average character. My opinion is that the average V3 character + Monokubs should have At most 9-B ratings for AP and durability, and I don't mind making the ratings "At least 9-C, At most 9-B" or something of the like.
• Kaito's 9-A feat was put into contention but I think the OP and everyone who was in the thread agrees that the 9-A Kaito feat is fine and the characters who already scaled to it remain unchanged, even Kokichi who was just put into contention, but I think it's now agreed that Kokichi keeps his 9-A rating
• Ryoma's 9-B feat is still fine, and even if it's just due to his metal ball and not through direct physicals (We never dove into it), I excluded him from everyone else since I think he should blatantly upscale Kaede and the Monokubs due to being a trained and dangerous Tennis Player. We don't have any evidence that he scales to the 9-A cast, so I won't make that assertion.

Maybe I missed things, but other than that it's just been LS stuff that's irrelevant to the thread.

Yeah, I agree to all this. Agreed on most things. And we have a condenses with it in the way that you said, we’ll just do the “at least street level, possibly wall level” for most characters

 

[Thebadtimetrio32]

Yeah, I agree to all this. Agreed on most things. And we have a condenses with it in the way that you said, we’ll just do the “at least street level, possibly wall level” for most characters

I think "At most" works better than a possibly, because the feats on one hand can prove without a doubt that they're 9-B, but the other feats prove that they can't be much higher than 9-C, so it signifies that the characters are AT MOST 9-B but at least 9-C

All that's needed is for my calcs to be checked and then to get this thread checked by a mod. By then, you can probably add the changes based on the OP and my summarization. From what I can tell, Kaito, Kirumi, Gonta, Kokichi, Maki and Tenko remain unchanged but you have a LOT of profiles to change ignoring those.

 

[Queen_Dasania]

I think "At most" works better than a possibly, because the feats on one hand can prove without a doubt that they're 9-B, but the other feats prove that they can't be much higher than 9-C, so it signifies that the characters are AT MOST 9-B but at least 9-C

All that's needed is for my calcs to be checked and then to get this thread checked by a mod. By then, you can probably add the changes based on the OP and my summarization. From what I can tell, Kaito, Kirumi, Gonta, Kokichi, Maki and Tenko remain unchanged but you have a LOT of profiles to change ignoring those.

Sounds good

 

[StrymULTRA]

Kaede falls before her execution

The first time we see her stop falling is 711 frames, although she looks like that isn't near the start of her drop, so we'll start when the play goes "live" for a high end, which is 645 frames, then she falls by frame 799, 799 - 711 is 88/25 frames or 3.52 seconds. For high end, 799 - 645 = 154/25 frames or 6.16 seconds

Using both times, Kaede had been falling for either 60.75 meters or 186.06 meters

Kaede weighs 53 kg according to the monopad.

Low end: 31,585.74 Joules (Wall level)

High end: 96,738.18 Joules (Wall level) (I made this from a discord message, if the feat gets accepted I'll make a blog for it.

I don't really agree with using assumptions like these given that it's clear that there has been a time skip.

Kaede seems to have fallen from a while, and 5 seconds is the minimal amount of time for a human to reach terminal velocity, which is 53 m/s here, same as Kaede's weight in kg lmao.

0.5 * 53^3 = 74,438.5 Joules (Wall level)

Also I've realized this calc on Naegi I've checked to see if I'm doing it right is wrong, no idea why he got 91,854.3 Joules when to me his formula gives me 73,034 Joules in 3 different calculators I tried.

Also the calc is unusable due to the garbage cushioning the fall in Makoto's case but shhh.

 

[Queen_Dasania]

I don't really agree with using assumptions like these given that it's clear that there has been a time skip.

Kaede seems to have fallen from a while, and 5 seconds is the minimal amount of time for a human to reach terminal velocity, which is 53 m/s here, same as Kaede's weight in kg lmao.

0.5 * 53^3 = 74,438.5 Joules (Wall level)

Also I've realized this calc on Naegi I've checked to see if I'm doing it right is wrong, no idea why he got 91,854.3 Joules when to me his formula gives me 73,034 Joules in 3 different calculators I tried.

Also the calc is unusable due to the garbage cushioning the fall in Makoto's case but shhh.

At least the Naegi calc isn’t that far off

Good point about the Kaede calc though. She did fall from a pretty big height though

 

[StrymULTRA]

At least the Naegi calc isn’t that far off

Yeah I think it should be recalculated and replaced, the feat is just a supportive one for THH people anyway.

Also given that I forgot this:

Monokubs spin Korekiyo around

Korekiyo is 1.88 meters according to the monopad, and for him to move this much he must've moved 360 degress

(2) * pi * 1.88 = 11.81 meters

They spun him 22 times, so he was spun 259.82 meters in total.

0.21 to 0.24 (as an average, too aids to go frame by frame when frame by frame websites won't accept this video for age reasons), 3 seconds

259.82 / 3 = 86.61 m/s (Subsonic)

Korekiyo weighs 65 kg

ill use the velocity u found with since thats needed

360 deg is 6.28319 rad
being spun 22 times in 3 seconds would make the angular velocity (6.28319*22)/3 = 46.0767266667 rad/s

to find moment of inertia u need to find angular momentum, and angular velocity which we already have

angular momentum is multiplying mass velocity and radius together or 65 kg*86.61*(1.88/2) = 5291.871 kg/m^2/s
moment of inertia is angular momentum/angular velocity or 5291.871/46.0767266667 = 114.849108928 kg/m^2

then the rotational energy would be 0.5*114.849108928*46.0767266667^2 = 121,916.046811 joules or wall level (Another discord message but there's no images so it's really easy to blog. But yeah Monokubs upgrade)

I am not that comfortable in calculating like this rotational KE btw, I'll get to that later.

 

[Queen_Dasania]

I am not that comfortable in calculating like this rotational KE btw, I'll get to that later.

I feel like it’s ok. Shows they can generate the energy necessary to do that. Maybe not a durability feat for Korekiyo since he just gets spun, doesn’t hit anything. But if they can move him at that speed, I personally feel they’d scale

 

[StrymULTRA]

I feel like it’s ok. Shows they can generate the energy necessary to do that. Maybe not a durability feat for Korekiyo since he just gets spun, doesn’t hit anything. But if they can move him at that speed, I personally feel they’d scale

This is indeed a durability feat given that his body would literally splatter by being accelerated this fast in a super short amount of time, you're right about only the speed not being an issue, but it's the acceleration and deceleration what apply the force.

 

[Queen_Dasania]

This is indeed a durability feat given that his body would literally splatter by being accelerated this fast in a super short amount of time, you're right about only the speed not being an issue, but it's the acceleration and deceleration what apply the force.

Fair enough, it is definitely a durability feature going by irl physics, but anime and media in general tend to treat energy as just affecting you if you suddenly hit something

Either way. You are also right about acceleration and deceleration being what really matter. If they get him to that speed over the course of a minute, and then also take that long to stop him spinning, it’s much different than if he just suddenly reached that speed

In the clip though, it looks to happen suddenly. Buttt, tbf, it’s hard to know how accurate that is, and I’m guessing that will be your argument

And speed wise, monokubs are already subsonic, so this fest would already just be supporting evidence for that specifically

 

[StrymULTRA]

Fair enough, it is definitely a durability feature going by irl physics, but anime and media in general tend to treat energy as just affecting you if you suddenly hit something

Either way. You are also right about acceleration and deceleration being what really matter. If they get him to that speed over the course of a minute, and then also take that long to stop him spinning, it’s much different than if he just suddenly reached that speed

In the clip though, it looks to happen suddenly. Buttt, tbf, it’s hard to know how accurate that is, and I’m guessing that will be your argument

And speed wise, monokubs are already subsonic, so this fest would already just be supporting evidence for that specifically

It happens in like a second.

Though I am unsure if this passes the KE rules, given this:

Kinetic Energy based on Movement Speed is case by case: Fiction often treats the speed with which a character can move himself as unrelated to their attack power. As such feats like just running or carrying a small object, like another character, should only be used if the fiction has made clear that the speed of the movement correlates to the character's power or if the character uses the fast moving object to attack. Calculating the energy necessary for moving large structures at great speeds, using the speed things move as a secondary effect of an attack, throwing objects at great speeds etc. are all acceptable methods of quantifying a characters power regardless.

It seems like they're just spinning him fast and not trying to murder him by making him go spin super fast.

THOUGH a similar thing did happen with Mondo, though the scene is so nonsensical that I don't think it can be applied here.

 

[Queen_Dasania]

It happens in like a second.

Though I am unsure if this passes the KE rules, given this:

It seems like they're just spinning him fast and not trying to murder him by making him go spin super fast.

THOUGH a similar thing did happen with Mondo, though the scene is so nonsensical that I don't think it can be applied here.

I see. Then yeah, not really sure if this works then