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DC Comics - The Legendary DC Heralds Upgrade
- Thread starter Emirp sumitpo
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I agree. Independent of how we scale the Phantom Zone, the problem remains that whether we scale Superman to it at all is still suspect. This discussion has only dragged on as long as it has due to the predictable derailing from the Transcendings.
Yes. That does not mean it scales to the Sphere, as I already explained.
Because it operates as a physical space and there are no indications of it having higher spatial dimensions, and it lacks a temporal dimension.
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I dunno why you do this. Does Deagon responding allow the staff to properly evaluate in peace? If yes, why do we not? If not, why are you ok with him doing it?
Also Transcending didn't start the argument, Deagon did.
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Your participation in high-tier comic book discussions has -- without exception -- led to multi page bickering that involves you two making an argument out of every possible thing, refusing to back down no matter how thoroughly your reasoning or evidence is debunked, and only ever ends when staff intervenes. It is to a point where your arrival in a thread guarantees derailing.
These discussions feel more like babysitting than debate. Even the most basic logical conclusions are met with demands for excruciatingly specific dissections, every element of which is questioned even further, and further, and further. This behavior from users who have just recently finished serving a ban for bad-faith conduct is not acceptable. I don't think either of you should be allowed to participate in important comic discussions, it is always a mess.
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Deagon seems to stay more on topic and argue in good faith logic though. I am not so certain about you guys always being reliable in that regard.
Regardless, this is just pointless circular arguing for the sake of arguing, and that certainly seems to happen a lot whenever you are involved.
Regardless, this is just pointless circular arguing for the sake of arguing, and that certainly seems to happen a lot whenever you are involved.
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It would at least save an awful lot of time and energy for everybody else involved in those types of discussions if we topic-ban them, yes, but let's try to stay on topic here please.
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On-topic, we are awaiting Eficientes input before we move forward with a more detailed discussion about the following feats.
IdiosyncraticLawyer
Username OnlyVS Battles
Joke Battles
Administrator
Content Moderator
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When can we expect this to be resolved?
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Ant, do you have any input? Feats you agree/disagree with given the arguments presented?
More notably, the ones that are leaning towards acceptance?
More notably, the ones that are leaning towards acceptance?
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If somebody lists all of the ones that are leaning towards being accepted (by the staff members who evaluated the feats one-by-one), together with links to the available evidence, I will check through it and comment if I have any evaluation to share.
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No, definitely not. The scale of the time-space manipulation in question was never clarified beyond that it might be able to affect the entire local galaxy.
This seems mostly fine, unless it is a Kryptonite type of situation, but Orion's lower universe manifestation has not normally been portrayed as being nearly this powerful, so some consistency with other feats would be preferable.
Superboy-Prime, not Superman-Prime, but was he truly portrayed at a comparable power level to Countdown in this story?
Remake all of universal space-time or gradually reshape reality one piece at a time? Clarifications from other parts of this story would be very appreciated.
This seems rather straightforward, yes, but it also needs to have support in how Superman was portrayed at the time in terms of power level.
As I mentioned earlier, the former is far too unproven to be taken as automatic gospel, rather than as hyperbole, and the latter seems unspecified in how much of the Phantom Zone that was shaken.
It is far too inconsistent with Barbatos' earlier portrayal, and he also seemed to be bound and severely weakened by tenth metal chains at the time.
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Both countdown and Legion of 3 worlds,they were comparable but TT wasn't in countdown ahd infinite crisis just Legion of 3 worlds.
Flash forward wally said it would be suicidal for him to go against superman in a fight.
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I want to know, why are we arguing over whether or not Ion has infinite power? The Ion Entity is already 2-C to 2-A via scaling to Superboy Prime.
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Yes, but as far as I recall, Geoff Johnns did not personally portray Superboy-Prime as anywhere near that powerful during the time of his creation, but rather as that it was very impressive of him to be able to move planets.
However, if I remember correctly, during the Sinestro Corps war, Geoff portrayed SBP as being able to defeat a weakened Anti-Monitor, who had just taken damage from a compressed galaxy-destroying explosion, so he would at least be tier 3-C.
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And by the time he fought Ion, was he portrayed as anywhere near universal at the time?
Which comic did Sodam Yat fight Superboy Prime?
TimeTrapperFanBoy
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In "Tales of the Sinestro Corps: Superman-Prime" Superboy Prime arrives on Earth and fights the Earth Heroes, he is eventually overwhelmed by them and they proceed to dogpile him, that is until sunlight hits him and his power jumps from tier 4 to tier 2 in just mere seconds right before he fights ION.
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So yes, then. He was Tier 2 when he fought Ion.
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That was after Superboy Primes defeat by the hands of the two Supermen, which includes their dimension border shattering feat.
Wait, isn't that a feat we can use here? Earth 2 Superman destroying that dimensional border?
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What is difficult to quantify about it?
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Bump
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Ah, okay. I suppose that makes sense; maybe I'll read through the comic, and see if that feat messed with the Universe or something, or if there's any quantifiable way to tier it.
In the mean time, have you given your opinion on the following feats that are leaning towards agree?
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I just wanna post this here lmao https://2.bp.blogspot.com/PjsJfUtla...qrcWp5lcXPGGPatxujtZ9U3LJ9qyvn1c-Ae4TSg=s1600
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So, hold on. I would just like some info on something, because the answer will depend on whether or not Superman scales fully to Pre-Flashpoint Darkseid, and not just his Avatars.
So, on the profile, we credit Darkseid's speed for tackling an unprepared Post-Crisis Superman, yet later down the comic's run, Superman not only withstands a mean blast from Darkseid, but blatantly overpowers him, forcing Darkseid to BFR him.
Also, the feat where Darkseid incapacitates Superman with a 'casual blast', also shows Superman getting right back up like -- seconds later. So my question stands: Are we scaling Superman to Darkseid in this manner?
To support this, I want to note, it was stated that Doomsday did not fight an avatar of Darkseid by the author of their encounter. Food for thought.
So, on the profile, we credit Darkseid's speed for tackling an unprepared Post-Crisis Superman, yet later down the comic's run, Superman not only withstands a mean blast from Darkseid, but blatantly overpowers him, forcing Darkseid to BFR him.
Also, the feat where Darkseid incapacitates Superman with a 'casual blast', also shows Superman getting right back up like -- seconds later. So my question stands: Are we scaling Superman to Darkseid in this manner?
To support this, I want to note, it was stated that Doomsday did not fight an avatar of Darkseid by the author of their encounter. Food for thought.
IdiosyncraticLawyer
Username OnlyVS Battles
Joke Battles
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And I want to note that Darkesid's bodies his true form controls are called emanations, not avatars, the latter of which are just even weaker bodes his emanations control, so saying Doomsday didn't fight an avatar of Darkseid is a red herring.
Hellbeast
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Yep so DD would outright scale to the Emanation which has some interesting scaling
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Didn't I evaluate all of them earlier here?
Dan Jurgens did not portray Darkseid as a higher-reality entity who used projections against lower realities, but other authors did. It is just a very common standard case of the writers constantly contradicting each other.
Dan Jurgens only considered Odin to be of a planetary scale as well, for example.
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You might have, I'll look up and see if you went through all of them.
This is fair, I suppose. Nevertheless, has Darkseid ever been shown or stated to use lower-powered Avatars on the same Earth?
That would work for justifying like, the DCAU for example, but not Post-Crisis. Hasn't it just been that one Emanation through and through? And what of the Superman scaling?
This is fair, I suppose. Nevertheless, has Darkseid ever been shown or stated to use lower-powered Avatars on the same Earth?
That would work for justifying like, the DCAU for example, but not Post-Crisis. Hasn't it just been that one Emanation through and through? And what of the Superman scaling?
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While Superman got back up from the blast, he's obviously beaten up and can only watch Darkseid leave. To add to that, the previous issue also had Darkseid easily restrain Superman with TK with Superman powerless to do anything and in general the storyline treats Darkseid as beyond Clark
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Has people here looked at Firestorm's Big Bang feat on his profile? I think it's the most blatant one out there
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Alright, but even then that's one storyline compared to the countless others where Superman has battled against -- and bested -- Darkseids pre flashpoint Emanation
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No, it's from Action Comics, during the time Action Comics was a weekly series and Superman was a backup feature in it. It's from 637 and 638
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Okay. Understood. Thank you for the information.
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