Goku upgrade

[Mickey1940]

If i remember correctly, Low 2C is timeline level, and 2C is between 2 to 1000 timelines, right? In this case, shouldn't Goku, Jiren, the Angels, and Grand Priest all be 2C? Since Vegeta is already Low 2C, and since Goku and Jiren are at least 3 times stronger than him individually, and since the Angels and the Grand Priest are expodentially stronger than Goku and Jiren, shouldn't all of them be 2C?

 

[WeeklyBattles]

No, being x times stronger than a baseline 2-C doesnt make you 2-C, just a higher level of Low 2-C

 

[Mickey1940]

how does that make any sense? The guys i mentioned can all destroy 2 or more timelines

 

[WeeklyBattles]

They have no feats of doing so, that's the problem. To go from Low 2-C to 2-C you need feats, you dont go from Low 2-C to 2-C with multipliers

 

[AstralKing7]

i remember when i didnt know anything about feats and scaling

 

[AKM sama]

You can be many times stronger than a Low 2-C but you'll still be Low 2-C unless you have a feat/implication of destroying 2 or more universes.

If you are referring to Beerus vs Champa destroying 2 universes, then that was a shared feat. It only makes them a very high level of Low 2-C. They have to do it individually to be considered 2-C.

 

[Jesterofgames]

I think its Because your multiplying what they can destroy not the energy out put. for example if a person can wipe out a solar system (and has the energy of a base line solar system character) and had there energy increased 1000 fold it would make sense that they would be MSS tier right? They can destroy 1000 solar systems ... but if you look at the tier list multiplying the baseline of solar system level by 100 wouldnt get multi solar system level or even remotly close to it.

The energy output between destroying 1 timeline and destroying 2 is iirc infinitly appart so just a standered energy multiplier isnt gonna make a person 2-C .

 

[Andytrenom]

The energy output between destroying 1 timeline and destroying 2 is iirc infinitly appart so just a standered energy multiplier isnt gonna make a person 2-C .

Is it infinity apart, or finite but impossible to determine accurately with physics

 

[Ovrhide]

Sinmple multipliers dont get you that high once you reach universe level or above. The gap becomes nearly transfinite in such high tiers.

 

[Mickey1940]

So if a low 2C character (X) is compared with a featless, confirmed character (Y) to be infinite above that said low 2C character, then Y is still low 2C, even though it has specific statements to be infinitely stronger than X?

 

[Ovrhide]

So if a low 2C character (X) is compared with a featless, confirmed character (Y) to be infinite above that said low 2C character, then Y is still low 2C, even though it has specific statements to be infinitely stronger than X?

If a character is infinitely above a low 2-C one, then he would be a tier above, or more depending on the level if infinity.

 

[Mickey1940]

What about 999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 times stronger?

 

[Ovrhide]

What about 999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 times stronger?

Thats not infinity. You can have that, to the power of a googleplexian, times grams number and still not be infinity. Infinity is not a number you reach, as any number you come up with is smaller than infinity (depends on the infinite, as there are different kinds, like aleph null, the smallest infinity).

But that doesnt apply all the time. If the character has the feats, regardless of statements, then they obviously would be a tier higher.

 

[Mickey1940]

So Low 2C characters are infinitely below 2C characters? But aren't they both 4D?

 

[Ovrhide]

Doesnt matter. Just like how there can be 3d beings infinitely above other 3D beings.

 

[Mickey1940]

So 2C is infinite 4D? But I thought 2A characters were infinite 4D

 

[Ovrhide]

I wish i could explain it better. But i think some of the mods can far better explain.

Btw, when we say infinite, we actually mean tranfinite. We just dont use that word often.

 

[Mickey1940]

What is tranfinite?

 

[Ovrhide]

Bigger than any finite number, but not infinity

 

[Mickey1940]

oh ok

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Infinitely stronger than a Low 2-C will get you 2-A, and it's rare, but enough of an AP increase can get you to 2-C via upscaling from a Low 2-C

 

[Schnee_One]

Where has that happened^

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

I once got an incomplete Arceus upgraded to 2-C via being unfathomably superior to the Low-2-C-by-breathing Creation Trio, and Dragon followed in my footsteps with a Millenniummon upgrade. Of course, major things happened to both franchises, so those upgrades quickly became obsolete, but you get the point.

 

[ALRF]

I don't feel like the reasoning you give is enough for it to be 2-C...

Only higher Low 2-C

 

[Kaltias]

Tbf our standards were kinda different back then.

Now it's more "the gap is completely unquantifiable so you need feats affecting multiple universes".

Infinitely above Low 2-C = 2-A still works I believe

 

[Ovrhide]

Those are rare occassions. Tho im sure mickey had his question answered, so we can probably leave it at that. Basically, basic multiplication doesnt get you tiers higher (a universe buster doesnt become a universe level + character by getting twice as strong, at least thats how it should normally work)

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

@ALRF. Afterwards, I thought so too, but downgrades wouldn't have happened due to other stuff.

@Kal. Frankly, I think that's asinine on our part. While I do think there has to be far more than just an AP boost of x, that part of qualification seems fishy.

 

[AntorusTheBurningThrone]

I think i'll explain this better than everyone else here.

See, just because you can destroy 2 Timelines, that doesn't make you 2-C. That's a little more closer to 1 Timeline + The Main Universe. It's basically a Low 2-C/High 3-A Feat, since it's destroying a Universe + A Timeline. Not multiple Universes. The Realm of Void being twisted and shit's all Low 2-C, due to it being outside Space and Time. 2-C is when you destroy multiple UNIVERSES. For example: Zeno destroying 6 Universes cause he got upset. That's Multi-Universal. Cause, it's Multiple Universes. Not a Timeline + A Universe (Universes, and Timelines are different in a sense).

Multiversal occurs when you're capable of destroying all the Timelines/Universes in your Franchise. However, if there aren't an infinite amount of Universes, then it's 2-B. High 2-B occurs when something even greater's involved, it's hard to explain on that part.

Multiversal+ (2-A+) occurs when you're capable of easily warping/destroying ALL the Timelines in your Franchise. However, there are an Infinite Number of Timelines, with an Infinite number of Universes, with an Infinite Number of possibilities. All of this makes ANYTHING 2-C seem pathetic as hell. Let alone Low 2-C.

And don't even get me started on 1-C+. Hopefully I made things clearer for ya now.

 

[The_Everlasting]

Universes and timelines are the same thing, and affecting the World of Void is a High 3-A feat.

 

[Kaltias]

I mean, Low 2-C to 2-C is like 4-B to 4-A, but with two differences.

1) They are universes and not solar systems (duh)

2) You legitimately have no idea about the "distance"

So the correct answer to "is this multiplier enough to be 2-C" would be "I dunno" more than "No".

To be safe, we ask for 2-C feats

 

[Regionfuego]

I'm pretty sure that considering how Dragon ball works, if they ever get 2-C feats or higher, it will be due to a multipler.


I don't think thye have a solid 2-C up until now, but I'm sure that they could display it eventually, given time

 

[Mickey1940]

I haven't gotten my question answered...

 

[Mickey1940]

Is there a finite, tranfinite, or infinite difference between 2C and low 2C?

 

[AntorusTheBurningThrone]

Universes and timelines are the same thing, and affecting the World of Void is a High 3-A feat.

No. Timelines are representations of Time that can change from the smallest affect. There can be different Timelines for different events. It can be changed in either a good way, or in a bad way. It can be limited, or it can be infinite. That's how Timelines work.

Universes are basically all things matter and space. Coming from Galaxies, Black Holes, Stars, and so forth. Timelines exist in the Universe. However, in said Universe, there have to be different Universes with DIFFERENT Timelines. You're only Universal+ when you affect both the Universe and its LINKED Timeline. However, if you affect all LIMITED Timelines, as well as the Universes that coexist with it, then you're Multiversal.

Different Universes with 1 Timeline are still Universal. Universes with different Timelines mean that, while there's still the Main Universe, there are also different Timelines with different Universes. Hence, why it's called the Multiverse.

Goku's NEVER been shown having a Multiversal Feat. Nor has he been shown to destroy a Universe + A Timeline. Controlling a Universe + A Timeline seems to be a Low 2-C Feat. Destroying Multiple Universes is a 2-C Feat. Destroying a Universe + its different Timelines (All of them) is 2-B. However, destroying a Universe + its timelines (In which, this case, the timelines are Infinite), then it's 2-A.

And I only called the Realm of Void Low 2-C due to its pure Nothingness. However, if you want to call it High 3-A, then go on ahead.

 

[AntorusTheBurningThrone]

Am I clear on this? Or...

 

[Andytrenom]

@Mickey The difference may not necessarily be infinite, but it is unquantifiable.

 

[AntorusTheBurningThrone]

Is there a finite, tranfinite, or infinite difference between 2C and low 2C?

Doesn't have to be any of them. It just has to be an unmeasurable growth.

 

[Mickey1940]

But the Tier List says that low 2C is timeline level, and 2C is 1000 timelines...

 

[Mickey1940]

Sorry if i'm getting annoying, I just wanna know the difference, cause i still don't understand

 

[AntorusTheBurningThrone]

Well, take a look at my replies. I've spent half of my Brain trying to clear this thing out.