Gremmy's meteorite calculations

[Antvasima]

Since the 3 different versions of the calculation are currently causing controversy, I have initiated this thread for simplified discussion regarding which one that is preferable:

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...h_calc_-_Kenpachi_destroys_Gremmy's_meteorite

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...each_Calc_-_Kenpachi_Slays_A_Meteor_(Revised)

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Dariel_Senju/Bleach_Downgrade,_Gremmy_Meteor

Note that the discussion should strictly stick to the topic of which calculation that has the greatest merit.

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

This should be interesting.

 

[Assaltwaffle]

I thought we agreed that the third option was optimal. At least that's what I and a couple calc members prefer.

 

[Soldier_Blue]

I think it was agreed on by pretty much every active staff member that the results of the calc by Piercer of Heaven just seem a tad much.

Myself and POH disagree on Dariel Senju's calc because it is contradicted by Hitsugaya's weather abilities affecting an area with a diameter of 23.562 km and it still doesn't affect all of Seireitei (Yamamoto's Bankai is the only Bankai so far to affect all of Seireitei).

Given all this, Gwyn's estimate of a 32+ km Seireitei makes most sense for now (well makes sense to me at least).

Edit:

Using the meteor mass (lower end) calc'ed by Gwyn, and using meteor velocity of 7900 m/s (based on a suggestion by Kepekley) and 11000 m/s, then we get results of 8.3457 Teratons and 16.18 Teratons.

So:

Low end = 534.9 Gigatons

Mid end = 8.3457 Teratons

High end = 16.18 Teratons

^ As for which one of these to accept, I'll leave that to others.

 

[Antvasima]

@Assaltwaffle

I started this thread because the old discussion was spread out and very hard to follow. This way any conclusions can turn much more coherent.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

To be fair, the first and third options have pretty much the same result; so I suppose High 6-C is more consistent? But from what I heard, most of the Admins seem to agree more with High 6-C

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

@Soldier Blue Honestly, the excuse of a result being too high isn't a very valid reason to disregard a calc. That's very subjective. However, my calc does have two faults that brings it down to around Continent level+.

My scaling is Gwynbleiddd's scaling but fixing the problems he had with his calc, (not having a scan that shows Sokyoku Hill's full height and using correct meteor velocity).

Also, his calc still wouldn't mesh with Tōshirō's statement as that would mean over 2/3 of Seireitei was affected by Tōshirō's storm and majority of characters would be under threat and possibly die.

 

[ShieldsPlus]

Related image

In comparison to this image .

• I do not see the large cliff in the first image in comparison to the cliff shown in the second image.
• The shape/structure of the buildings shown in the middle look different in the two images.

What happened here, exactly?

 

[Dbknowitall]

Seireitei is basically a Country for the most part so Gremmy getting a low 6-B or 6-B seems reasonable.

6-A was always kinda on the high ball

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

@Soldier Blue Seireitei would only be 96,211.0116363636 m, not even close to 1,500,000 m.

@Khristis

Basically, at the beginning of the war, the Sternritter kinda switched Seireitei with the Wandenreich via some sort of shadow dimension switching shit

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

@Dbknowitall That's not really how meteors work. A sphere shaped meteor with the radius of a continent would probably pack Moon level energy or higher.

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

Here's the problem with each calc:

- Gwynbleiddd's doesn't use full hill height for Seireitei Scaling or correct meteor velocity.

- I fixed those problems, however, I used the wrong side of Sokyoku Hill to scale Seireitei, (doesn't make a big difference but still) and scaled the meteor of the dome which is very inconsistent.

- Dariel's first scaling makes Sokyoku Hill hillaorusly small and thus the people used to scale it. His second scaling is literally using different scans of the same thing to get a smaller Seireitei size. Both of these scalings are severely contradicted by Tōshirō's statements on his storms AOE and etc. It doesn't add up. However, he did point out that the dome was inconsistent and used the correct side of Sokyoku Hill to scale.

Every calc has some sort of problem but this can easily be fixed. I'll post the calc in my next post.

 

[Dbknowitall]

@Dbknowitall That's not really how meteors work. A sphere shaped meteor with the radius of a continent would probably pack Moon level energy or higher.

we are basing calculation on art that can be changed base on the authors mood, thinking too much is something we should refrain from doing, i mean if they do change 6-A to High 6-C/6-B maybe in a few months it would change again there would always be new calculation coming, if the calc team cant pick one might as well meet in the middle 6-A was high, 6-C is low so 6-B seems reasonable, is cool that people are this passionate about calculations but sometimes overthinking stuff just makes it more diff to scale.

it be great if anyone could ask Kubo directly how big sereitei or how big he imagines it to be atleast that way we can come with a permanent solution.

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

This calc combines the legit parts of each calc and fixes the problemss they each individually had:

Ichigo=2 Pixels=1.74 m

Stand=116 Pixels=100.92

https://m.imgur.com/a/NeRNb

Stand=33 Pixels=100.92 m

Sokyoku Hill=969 Pixels=2,963.37818181818 m

Sokyoku Hill Height=45 Pixels=2,963.37818181818 m

Seireitei Diameter=1461 Pixels=96,211.0116363636 m

https://m.imgur.com/a/0tAL9

Seireitei Diameter=1660 Pixels=96,211.0116363636

Seireitei Height=815 Pixels=47,236.1292070098

Gremmy's Meteor:

https://m.imgur.com/a/lXxMv

Seireitei Height=475 Pixels=47,236.1292070098 m

Meteor Diameter=457 Pixels=45,446.1285212705 m

Meteor Radius=22,723.0642606352 m

It's a sphere so:

Volume=49146127100000 m^3

Density=3000 kg/m^3

Mass=147438381300000000 kg

Velocity=11,000 km/s

KE:

8.920022068649999e+24 Joules or 2.1319364408819310164 Petatons of TNT

Continent level

 

[Damage3245]

Woudn't that calc also mean that the walls & gate of the Seireitei are like 10 kilometres tall? And we know by the fact that the main characters have stood next to the wall and gate that they aren't 10 kilometres tall.... That's some really inconsistent art depiction right there.

Dariel's calc at least addresses the size of the meteor by using the exact same panel for both meteor and the Wandenreich.

 

[Soldier_Blue]

Dariel's calc at least addresses the size of the meteor by using the exact same panel for both meteor and the Wandenreich.

Yes, but as POH and I have pointed out, Dariel's calc of the Seireitei's size makes no sense when you take into account the range of Hitsugaya's weather manipulation. That's why Gwyn's makes more sense (to me at least).

 

[Damage3245]

The Seireitei's size has never made any sense when you look at the broad spectrum of Kubo's depicitions of it; he generally shows it as being as large as a huge city. Maybe space is different inside the borders of the Seireitei; I don't know. But I do know that out of most of the times Kubo has drawn it, he has not drawn it anywhere near continent or huge country sized.

Dariel's calc may not make the most sense from a story perspective, but it seems consistent with the powerscale up to that point in the series.

(Also, some other things about the Seireitei that don't make sense, the Seireitei is the size of a continent according to some calcs but there's only 3000 enlisted troops? That is crazy for that size, but not so much for a smaller-sized Seireitei.

 

[PaChi2]

I dont know if this could be a solution, but: At least High 6-C, possibly High 6-A?

 

[Damage3245]

Don't know about anyone else, but I'd be fine with: At least High 6-C.

 

[Antvasima]

Is anybody willing to invite all of the calc group members, as well as DontTalkDT and Executor NO here?

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

@PaChi Nah, wouldn't really solve anything. The calc I posted should fix the problems that each calc had.

 

[KinkiestSins]

Is anybody willing to invite all of the calc group members, as well as DontTalkDT and Executor NO here?

I will notify Cal and others since he approved it last time to get his opinion.

I will leave a quick message if you havent already.

 

[KinkiestSins]

@Ant Notified (I think) most in the calc group that are active. Might have missed a few.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

Using the meteor mass (lower end) calc'ed by Gwyn, and using meteor velocity of 7900 m/s (based on a suggestion by Kepekley) and 11000 m/s, then we get results of 8.3457 Teratons and 16.18 Teratons.

So:

Low end = 534.9 Gigatons

Mid end = 8.3457 Teratons

High end = 16.18 Teratons

^ As for which one of these to accept, I'll leave that to others.

I'm fine with this.

 

[KinkiestSins]

I am fine with the low or mid end as well. It is basically at this point pick how far you want bleach to be in tier 6. Also seems more consistent with High 6-C/6-B.

 

[Damage3245]

@Piercer of Heaven; how large would the Silbern be then based on your size for the meteor, and how large would Ishida be from that? Since we do see the meteor and the Silbern in the same panel.

 

[Antvasima]

@KinkiestSins

Thank you for the help.

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

@Damage3245 Very big but there is nothing we can do about that.

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

Just going to point out again that Gwynbleiddd's calc had problems that my calc fixes.

 

[Damage3245]

But if your problem with Dariel's calc is that it is inconsistent with the size of the Seireitei, then the problem with yours is that it is inconsistent with the size of the Silbern and Ishida. So it isn't much of a a fix.

EDIT: There may not be a perfect calc out there, but Dariel's at least uses the same panel for both meteor and Silbern, and feels more consistent with the powerscaling of the manga by that point. That's just my view on it.

 

[Antvasima]

@KinkiestSins

Did you ask DontTalkDT and Executor NO as well?

 

[KinkiestSins]

@Ant I did so. Edit: I also skipped calc group members like blue or aiden who havent done a calc in months.

It is your choice if you want to notify them as well.

I notified

Darkanine

Kepekley

Liger

Cal

AN

I didnt notify Assalt because he commented already, he might come back. Eventually...

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

@Damage3245 Except his size is contradicted, while mine is not. Me and @Soldier Blue have already mentioned that.

My calc uses the height of Seireitei, which is also in the same panel. What "feels" more consistent is irrelevant. You calc what you see, not what you personally feel makes sense.

 

[KinkiestSins]

@Damage3245 Except his size is contradicted, while mine is not. Me and @Soldier Blue have already mentioned that.

To be fair, Kubo cant scale an image to save the life of him.

I think the size being contradicted might just be irrelevant in the larger picture. I am neutral on this personally tho, but I be lying to say one calc that displays High 6-A results, compared to two or three that display at most 6-B results is consistent imo.

I will come back however when more opinions are given in the thread,

 

[Damage3245]

> What "feels" more consistent is irrelevant.

I was referencing the Large Island level value when saying that. When considering potential outliers, you need to look at the consistency of the series.

> Except his size is contradicted, while mine is not.

You just admitted your size is inconsistent with the Silbern and Ishida.

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

@KinkiestSins

That's true but no one wants to use the statements, so, we'll continue using the visuals.

This is kinda getting annoying now, considering how many times I have to repeat the same thing. The results being close means nothing when the calcs are fundamentally flawed, which I have specifically pointed out several times.

I even remade the entire calc in this comment section, using all the legitimate aspects of each calc and fixing all the problems that were mentioned, yet, peeps can't seem to grasp something so simple.

 

[Piercer_of_Heaven]

@Damage3245 There are no potential outliers here, so, that's irrelevant.

I swear, the simplest things can't be grasped. It goes without saying that, nothing is going to be 100% consistent, especially with Kubo.

The point is, Dariel's end result is completely contradicted by the information Tōshirō has given us on his AOE, among other things, while mine is not.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, hopefully the calc group members, DontTalkDT and Executor NO can help to straighten out this issue.

 

[Damage3245]

There's no need to be insulting over a difference of opinions on the matter...

While it's difficult to hope for consistency with Kubo, doesn't using a single panel that contains both the Silbern and meteor seem more consistent than using multiple different panels from various points in the series?

 

[KazuiK]

(Also, some other things about the Seireitei that don't make sense, the Seireitei is the size of a continent according to some calcs but there's only 3000 enlisted troops? That is crazy for that size, but not so much for a smaller-sized Seireitei.

In the seireitei there are also the houses of the royal families, central 46, stores or restaurants of the noble families besides having the research center and medical center and the headquarters of the 13 divisions.