Lookism Discussion Thread

[Powerscalingcat]

By chance, I came across an interesting feat listed on Johan's wiki that doesn't seem to have been approved yet.
Johan cleanly ripping a steel door off faster than Daniel can even tell what he did

I disagree wih the speed blizts thing, Daniel's comment doesn't mean he didn't see Johan rather he has no idea HOW he did, I say this because we literally see Daniel copy Johan later and replicate the feat and we know Daniel's copy works based on sight so by default he had to have seen how Johan did it

The statement might not be enough to suffice Johan doing it faster than Daniel could perceive, though it's definitely good for lifting strength in Low Tiers (since this is from Chapter 150, which is before even the God Dog arc, wherein Johan's hardware was called out for being terrible)
You could prob calculate the size of the door with Johan's hand

This I do agree with, not sure if I brought it up in my earlier post about BOS feats that haven't be calc'd

Seth bending a metal bar with his thumb (If anyone can find a study that calculates the strength of a hand in proportion to a thumb it might work? Johan overpowers in a thumb battle after this) Chapter 261 btw

This one I def sent hopefully someone calcs it

I ended up rereading through Hostel while looking for Seth's feats and got emotional from how much of a masterpiece the Hostel Tragedy was

True

I just wish darius didn't exist lol

All the character has accomplished is give PTJ a bad name for being unable to write male SA (not that the writing for the female SA is any better since it happened to Mira at least 2 times and there were never any consequences)

Its also just kind of hypocritical to have a derogatory gay stereotype in a series famous for yaoi baiting lol

 

[Sigmagoon14]

Random thought,why do we never scale Basement Hulk to High 8-C, since the narrative was practically screaming that Hangyeoul has physical stats of Tom Lee, and even Goo confirmed twice that he was on par with Tom Lee? So why do we never actually give him that rating?

 

[Pyro9278]

Random thought,why do we never scale Basement Hulk to High 8-C, since the narrative was practically screaming that Hangyeoul has physical stats of Tom Lee, and even Goo confirmed twice that he was on par with Tom Lee? So why do we never actually give him that rating?

Did Goo confirm that Lookism's Hulk has the same strength as Tom? I don't recall Goo saying that. A lot of that fight was really just a ridiculous display of endurance, though even an old Charles could have beaten him.

 

[CatLover313]

Random thought,why do we never scale Basement Hulk to High 8-C, since the narrative was practically screaming that Hangyeoul has physical stats of Tom Lee, and even Goo confirmed twice that he was on par with Tom Lee? So why do we never actually give him that rating?

We can’t forget that after the crewheads defeated BH, his brother than amped him up with drugs and he became red. Thats the version Goo fought and made those Tom statements of.

 

[Sigmagoon14]

Did Goo confirm that Lookism's Hulk has the same strength as Tom? I don't recall Goo saying that. A lot of that fight was really just a ridiculous display of endurance, though even an old Charles could have beaten him.

Yup, the first time Basement Hulk was smacking him on the floor, and the second time Goo directly says, "This thing is Tom Lee's level in all but one aspect: it doesn't have intelligence." So yeah, if I remember right, Goo also calls him dangerous during that encounter.

Edit : Yup he said that twice

We can’t forget that after the crewheads defeated BH, his brother than amped him up with drugs and he became red. Thats the version Goo fought and made those Tom statements of.

Ain't no way that bum version has Gongseop-level AP. On his best day he scales to 50% Tom. I am talking about the one version Goo fought, because as I wrote above, Goo confirmed that the amped version is at Tom level. That's why I thought he should at least have scaling to Old Gap's feat.

 

[CatLover313]

Yup, the first time Basement Hulk was smacking him on the floor, and the second time Goo directly says, "This thing is Tom Lee's level in all but one aspect: it doesn't have intelligence." So yeah, if I remember right, Goo also calls him dangerous during that encounter.

Edit : Yup he said that twice

Ain't no way that bum version has Gongseop-level AP. On his best day he scales to 50% Tom. I am talking about the one version Goo fought, because as I wrote above, Goo confirmed that the amped version is at Tom level. That's why I thought he should at least have scaling to Old Gap's feat.

Ah that’s what u mean. Well I won’t disagree with that version of BH scaling, he got a clear cut statement backing him up

 

[Powerscalingcat]

Random thought,why do we never scale Basement Hulk to High 8-C, since the narrative was practically screaming that Hangyeoul has physical stats of Tom Lee, and even Goo confirmed twice that he was on par with Tom Lee? So why do we never actually give him that rating?

The only version of Tom Lee, Goo knew atp was the one he and Gun fought when they were 15, that version of Tom hadn't come out of retirement yet (Tom himself states it has been 3 years since he came out of retirement which is exactly when Goo and Gun were sent to test him during the white demon arc) which we see during their fight was nowhere near close to Tom's full power (Goo was unaware Tom was holding back and Tom was unaware how much stronger Goo had gotten) as Tom matched 1 sword Goo, when 0 sword Goo basically no diff'd basement hulk, this was phase 3 basement hulk, Goo compared phase 2 basement hulk to Tom (the one using a broken hammer as a weapon let alone a katana) according to Goo's own words the only difference between phase 2 BH and Tom is IQ, Goo straight up perceptioned blizted phase 3 No.1 who broke Goo's hammer before he could react (phase 3 should obviously be stronger than phase 2 so by that logic stronger than however strong Goo thinks Tom is)

Yet Tom was able to match 1 sword Goo and we know Tom was far from using his full power (signature moves, ultimate king etc)

Hyngeol himself also basically soft reconned himself in a later chapter by saying that basement hulk could become as strong as Tom Lee rather than actually being as strong as him

We have no idea how Goo and Gun testing Tom went however based on how Goo talks to Tom and how easily Tom was able to handle Goo (before Goo got a hold of a katana) it's entirely possible that Tom actually beat both 15 year old Gun and Goo, which wouldn't be all that crazy as Tom directly stated that 2A Yuseong and Madeok are on par with 15 year old Gun and Goo, that was a version of Tom that was playing with the workers per his own words due to being hired by Daniel, we saw him legit use finger flicks to fight both them and even nearly perception blizted yuseong, the only one who gave an impressive performance was Mandeok going blow for blow with him, however Tom was using his dangler inspector persona (which is him holding back) and Tom himself told Eugene, Yuseong and Madeok that he was holding back

So personally I would be against scaling BH to large building

As Tom was using air pressure finger flicks againsg yuseong who Tom directly compared to 15 year old Goo

And also how casually he was handling 1A Goo who was using the same amount of power as his 15 year old self (before he got serious and showed Tom how much he had grown promoting him to get more serious as well)

 

[Sigmagoon14]

The only version of Tom Lee, Goo knew atp was the one he and Gun fought when they were 15, that version of Tom hadn't come out of retirement yet (Tom himself states it has been 3 years since he came out of retirement which is exactly when Goo and Gun were sent to test him during the white demon arc) which we see during their fight was nowhere near close to Tom's full power (Goo was unaware Tom was holding back and Tom was unaware how much stronger Goo had gotten) as Tom matched 1 sword Goo, when 0 sword Goo basically no diff'd basement hulk, this was phase 3 basement hulk, Goo compared phase 2 basement hulk to Tom (the one using a broken hammer as a weapon let alone a katana) according to Goo's own words the only difference between phase 2 BH and Tom is IQ, Goo straight up perceptioned blizted phase 3 No.1 who broke Goo's hammer before he could react (phase 3 should obviously be stronger than phase 2 so by that logic stronger than however strong Goo thinks Tom is)

Yet Tom was able to match 1 sword Goo and we know Tom was far from using his full power (signature moves, ultimate king etc)

Yeah, that's why I think he can only scale to Gap's feat. Also, to add to that, Goo says he is dangerous not when he was joking, but when he got serious and started blitzing BH.
And my point still stands: if it was able to hurt Goo, and Goo even called him dangerous, meaning he should have enough AP to damage Goo. And Goo at that point already had Large Building level durability, so ain't no way that BH, who should be at 258 MJ, was able to damage and be a threat to Goo, whose dura is 9K MJ or higher.

Hyngeol himself also basically soft reconned himself in a later chapter by saying that basement hulk could become as strong as Tom Lee rather than actually being as strong as him

Actually, you are wrong here. Hangyeoul said that in 472, and I am talking about 473 because Goo's statement came from there. So yeah, there is no retcon here. Those statements from Goo still stand tall.

We have no idea how Goo and Gun testing Tom went however based on how Goo talks to Tom and how easily Tom was able to handle Goo (before Goo got a hold of a katana) it's entirely possible that Tom actually beat both 15 year old Gun and Goo, which wouldn't be all that crazy as Tom directly stated that 2A Yuseong and Madeok are on par with 15 year old Gun and Goo, that was a version of Tom that was playing with the workers per his own words due to being hired by Daniel, we saw him legit use finger flicks to fight both them and even nearly perception blizted yuseong, the only one who gave an impressive performance was Mandeok going blow for blow with him, however Tom was using his dangler inspector persona (which is him holding back) and Tom himself told Eugene, Yuseong and Madeok that he was holding back

Again, you are wrong. It's one of the big misconceptions in the PTJ verse that Yuseong and Mandeok were 15-year-old Gun & Goo level during 2A, which is not true at all. People think Tom got reminded of Gun and Goo means they are Gun and Goo's level, which is false because Tom himself wasn't sure if they're truly Gun and Goo level. That's why I said it's the biggest misconception of the verse. If Tom himself isn't sure, then why are people assuming he directly said that when he himself isn't sure and wanted to test them?

 

[Powerscalingcat]

Yeah, that's why I think he can only scale to Gap's feat. Also, to add to that, Goo says he is dangerous not when he was joking, but when he got serious and started blitzing BH.
And my point still stands: if it was able to hurt Goo, and Goo even called him dangerous, meaning he should have enough AP to damage Goo. And Goo at that point already had Large Building level durability, so ain't no way that BH, who should be at 258 MJ, was able to damage and be a threat to Goo, whose dura is 9K MJ or higher.

Ehhhh Goo left that fight without a scratch despite BH literally picking him up by the legs and slamming him head first into concrete and literally hulk jumping on top of him like a roided up gorilla and Gol blocked it with an umbrella, also yes in fact BH should be able to damage Goo even with that large of a stat difference, pre prison Jake, and Jerry were both able to harm Gun and Jerry even gave him a scar despite Gun being king level atp (you could argue its a retcon but for me the reason they gave him a scar is because Gun can't train how durable his skin is which is what Jerry and Eli damaged, and Jake just mate his lip bleed for the same reason, not to mention the only thing that was retconned was the gap in power being larger not the event itself)
We also had 3A Johan making tom bleed from biting his tongue and I think also bleed from his nose, point being we have a LOT of examples of way weaker characters damaging way stronger characters, same thing with Goo calling him dangerous.. while breaking both of his knees and beating him to near death with a hammer

Actually, you are wrong here. Hangyeoul said that in 472, and I am talking about 473 because Goo's statement came from there. So yeah, there is no retcon here. Those statements from Goo still stand tall.

As I said Goo's statment is about the Tom he fought when he was 15, 15 year old Goo is not large building level lol
We have no idea how much power he used but I doubt he was throwing large building level punches agaisnt a Goo he perceived as just a child/brat

Again, you are wrong. It's one of the big misconceptions in the PTJ verse that Yuseong and Mandeok were 15-year-old Gun & Goo level during 2A, which is not true at all. People think Tom got reminded of Gun and Goo means they are Gun and Goo's level, which is false because Tom himself wasn't sure if they're truly Gun and Goo level. That's why I said it's the biggest misconception of the verse. If Tom himself isn't sure, then why are people assuming he directly said that when he himself isn't sure and wanted to test them?

Even if he didn't state it directly, 15 year old Gun's best feat is scaling to a single Kojima and overwhelming them slowly due to having better endurance, technique, skill etc (The Kojima were loosing but I don't think Gun was outright a tier stronger than them)

Pre prison Gun got power crept by 3A Jake (imo the Gun that unlocked heat mode against Goo should be as strong as conviction that surpassed his prison self, and Cheoninlang heat mode Gun that fought the Kojima should be a tier above that)

Madeok and Yuseong are bare minimum king level if not above average King level so they should arguably scale HIGHER than 15 year old Gun and Goo (unless PTJ does yet another retroactive upscale and suddenly 14 year old Gun had already surpassed prime shingen or something)

Point being the best you can get for 15 year old Gun and Goo is single Kojima level who are not even King kevel and even if they were they got off screened by Tom so hard we haven't seen them since

So your point is kind of moot, Goo's perception of Tom Lee's power is probably really low because there is no way Tom Lee was throwing large building level punches against someone who wasn't even king level yet

 

[Pyro9278]

Ehhhh Goo left that fight without a scratch despite BH literally picking him up by the legs and slamming him head first into concrete and literally hulk jumping on top of him like a roided up gorilla and Gol blocked it with an umbrella, also yes in fact BH should be able to damage Goo even with that large of a stat difference, pre prison Jake, and Jerry were both able to harm Gun and Jerry even gave him a scar despite Gun being king level atp (you could argue its a retcon but for me the reason they gave him a scar is because Gun can't train how durable his skin is which is what Jerry and Eli damaged, and Jake just mate his lip bleed for the same reason, not to mention the only thing that was retconned was the gap in power being larger not the event itself)
We also had 3A Johan making tom bleed from biting his tongue and I think also bleed from his nose, point being we have a LOT of examples of way weaker characters damaging way stronger characters, same thing with Goo calling him dangerous.. while breaking both of his knees and beating him to near death with a hammer

Gun's scar doesn't really make sense, and that justification about Gun's skin doesn't make sense either. Most likely, Gun, knowing how masochistic he is, would have allowed Jerry to hurt him without taking it too seriously, but that doesn't mean he's remotely on Jerry's level. Also, when they make Tom bleed, it's simply because he's not taking it seriously or because he's usually suffering from hemoptysis due to overdoing it in fights (which still happens even now, even in fights between comparable people).

As I said Goo's statment is about the Tom he fought when he was 15, 15 year old Goo is not large building level lol
We have no idea how much power he used but I doubt he was throwing large building level punches agaisnt a Goo he perceived as just a child/brat

Yeah, a young Goo definitely did NOT see Tom Lee's full power.

Even if he didn't state it directly, 15 year old Gun's best feat is scaling to a single Kojima and overwhelming them slowly due to having better endurance, technique, skill etc (The Kojima were loosing but I don't think Gun was outright a tier stronger than them)

Pre prison Gun got power crept by 3A Jake (imo the Gun that unlocked heat mode against Goo should be as strong as conviction that surpassed his prison self, and Cheoninlang heat mode Gun that fought the Kojima should be a tier above that)

Madeok and Yuseong are bare minimum king level if not above average King level so they should arguably scale HIGHER than 15 year old Gun and Goo (unless PTJ does yet another retroactive upscale and suddenly 14 year old Gun had already surpassed prime shingen or something)

Point being the best you can get for 15 year old Gun and Goo is single Kojima level who are not even King kevel and even if they were they got off screened by Tom so hard we haven't seen them since

So your point is kind of moot, Goo's perception of Tom Lee's power is probably really low because there is no way Tom Lee was throwing large building level punches against someone who wasn't even king level yet

I really think that if Young Goo and Gun are above King level, then they should be comparable to Mandeok and Yuseong. And I know it's jarring because a Young Gun would then be far superior to the Kojima brothers, but keep in mind that he probably wasn't even fighting seriously, just like he did in the Hostel arc.

 

[Powerscalingcat]

Gun's scar doesn't really make sense, and that justification about Gun's skin doesn't make sense either. Most likely, Gun, knowing how masochistic he is, would have allowed Jerry to hurt him without taking it too seriously, but that doesn't mean he's remotely on Jerry's level. Also, when they make Tom bleed, it's simply because he's not taking it seriously or because he's usually suffering from hemoptysis due to overdoing it in fights (which still happens even now, even in fights between comparable people).

That.. was my point, that way weaker characters have been able to hurt way stronger characters in the past, also why does the thing about Gun being unable to train his skin make sense? We know that cannocially they can't train their organs (cuz duh how would you?) This isn't indicative of Gun's actual durability

Yeah, a young Goo definitely did NOT see Tom Lee's full power.

I really think that if Young Goo and Gun are above King level, then they should be comparable to Mandeok and Yuseong. And I know it's jarring because a Young Gun would then be far superior to the Kojima brothers, but keep in mind that he probably wasn't even fighting seriously, just like he did in the Hostel arc.

Gun defiantly was fighting the Kojima seriously, non serious Gun is Gun wearing his glasses/without his glasses but casual

Serious Gun is heat mode Gun (when he gets excited) and rips his shirt off, he also had the same killing aura as when he told gen 2 he was gonna get serious (fighting with killing intent) Gun was 15/16 during cheoninlang so him being that weak should be fine as the dude was already low king kevel lol and could arguably beat a king especially if he went UI

I don't think he had unlocked masteries by then or at least wasn't shown to have

Anyhow I am glad we agree young Goo did not see Tom's full power, imo given that the highest you can scale 15 year old Gun and Goo is vaguely small building level I don't think Tom was throwing large building level punches so imo the current BH scaling is fine

 

[Pyro9278]

That.. was my point, that way weaker characters have been able to hurt way stronger characters in the past, also why does the thing about Gun being unable to train his skin make sense? We know that cannocially they can't train their organs (cuz duh how would you?) This isn't indicative of Gun's actual durability

Yeah

Gun defiantly was fighting the Kojima seriously, non serious Gun is Gun wearing his glasses/without his glasses but casual

Serious Gun is heat mode Gun (when he gets excited) and rips his shirt off, he also had the same killing aura as when he told gen 2 he was gonna get serious (fighting with killing intent) Gun was 15/16 during cheoninlang so him being that weak should be fine as the dude was already low king kevel lol and could arguably beat a king especially if he went UI

I don't think he had unlocked masteries by then or at least wasn't shown to have

Anyhow I am glad we agree young Goo did not see Tom's full power, imo given that the highest you can scale 15 year old Gun and Goo is vaguely small building level I don't think Tom was throwing large building level punches so imo the current BH scaling is fine

I believe that Gun and Goo from Cheonliang are actually at higher levels than they appear, although until more is shown of them, they will remain only one level above the Kojima brothers.

Edit: Btw, what do you think of what I told you in the DM?