Make Konoha great again (ability addition)

[Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe]

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Naruto:

• Spoiler: Not Needed

  [*]Attack Reflection (Naruto was able to reflect the Bijuu bombs that was thrown at him)
  [*]

Kakuzu:

• Spoiler: Not Needed

  • Limited Invulnerability (With Domu - it's stated that no ninjutsu except lightning style can pierce through it. Also Kakuzu himself stated that any physical attacks on him at this state is useless)
• Inorganic Physiology (Type 1; Kakuzu's body except his heart is made of threads as completely shown here)

Juubidara & Kaguya:

• Immortality (Type 1; after gaining Shinju, Juubidara was able to live forever)

Black Zetsu:

• Inorganic Physiology (Type 1; Black Zetsu hasn't any organs and is a liquid-like being, even minato admitted that it isn't a human)

Edo Tenseis:

• Resistance to Pain Manipulation (Madara after becoming a human said now i can feel pain, which shows us as an edo he wasn't able to feel pain. Also other edo shinobis didn't show any signs of suffering from pain when they gained heavy injuries. For example these)

Pain:

• Power Nullification (Shinra Tensei is stated to be able negate ninjutsus no matter what size they are. e.g It negated Senpou: FRS)
• Power Mimircy & Duplication (Pain can create clone from others which have the same powers as them and are tireless)

Sasori & puppet masters:

• Thread Manipulation (I don't think this needs any explanations because their original power is using chakra threads and strings)

Deidara:

• Deconstruction (C4 has microscopic bombs which can disintegrate things at cellular level. e.g it disintegrated living things and turned them into dust)
• Extrasensory Perception (Deidara can sense what's beyond and above the ground while he's under the depth of earth. Since he is able to detect magnetic forces, he never loses sight of his position even when underground)
• Light Manipulation (With C0, Deidara can release his light of life, which is stated to be intense)

Sasuke:

• Weather Manipulation (With Katon: Gōryūka no Jutsu, Sasuke can create so hot clouds and air which are enough to make a thunderhead)

Zetsu:

• Plant Manipulation (Zetsu is able to merge himself with plants because of changing his insectivorous plant shell with chakra. Which makes him to not only uses the organic network of plant roots to travel with high speed to different places, but can even use them in a fight)

Hashirama Cell users:

• Resistance to Curse Manipulation (Guruguru who's made of Hashirama Cells was unaffected by Orochimaru's Curse Mark which is listed as Curse Manipulation in the wiki)

Izanagi users:

• Teleportation (as a sub ability - Izanagi transcends space and time to respawn its user in a different location which made its users to teleport as here it's explained)

Kamui users:

• Spoiler: Not Needed

  [*]Resistance to Sealing (they can travel to kamui dimension without any problems, which is stated to be a sealed dimension)
  [*]

Black Receiver users:

• Power Nullification (as a Black Receiver user, Obito was able to negate high class ninjutsus such as Sasuke's Amaterasu amped Susanoo Arrow)

Obito:

• Paralysis Inducement due to Black Receivers (Madara made Obito to use black receivers without rinnegan through Gedo Mazo and he can use it as here it's explained. Also OM Obito was able to use them in the fight with Konan although he hadn't Rinnegan. He would get Resistance to PI too as well)

---

(Staffs only):

Agree:
Disagree:
Natural:

 

[AlternativePrinciple]

Damn, theres a lot of abilities missing in this verse

Also doesn’t black zetsu get paralysis inducement because he hit juubidara in the heart and he couldn’t move?

 

[karo_senpaii]

---

Naruto:

• Attack Reflection (Naruto was able to reflect the Bijuu bombs that was thrown at him)

Kakuzu:

• Limited Invulnerability (With Domu - it's stated that no ninjutsu except lightning style can pierce through it. Also Kakuzu himself stated that any physical attacks on him at this state is useless)
• Inorganic Physiology (Type 1; Kakuzu's body except his heart is made of threads as completely shown here)

Juubidara & Kaguya:

• Immortality (Type 1; after gaining Shinju, Juubidara was able to live forever)

Black Zetsu:

• Inorganic Physiology (Type 1; Black Zetsu hasn't any organs and is a liquid-like being, even minato admitted that it isn't a human)

Edo Tenseis:

• Resistance to Pain Manipulation (Madara after becoming a human said now i can feel pain, which shows us as an edo he wasn't able to feel pain. Also other edo shinobis didn't show any signs of suffering from pain when they gained heavy injuries. For example these)

Pain:

• Power Nullification (Shinra Tensei is stated to be able negate ninjutsus no matter what size they are. e.g It negated Senpou: FRS)
• Power Mimircy (Pain can create clone from others which have the same powers as them and are tireless)

Sasori & puppet masters:

• Thread Manipulation (I don't think this needs any explanations because their original power is using chakra threads and strings)

Deidara:

• Deconstruction (C4 has microscopic bombs which can disintegrate things at cellular level. e.g it disintegrated living things and turned them into dust)
• Extrasensory Perception (Deidara can sense what's beyond and above the ground while he's under the depth of earth. Since he is able to detect magnetic forces, he never loses sight of his position even when underground)
• Light Manipulation (With C0, Deidara can release his light of life, which is stated to be intense)

Sasuke:

• Cloud Creation (With Katon: Gōryūka no Jutsu, Sasuke can create so hot clouds and air which are enough to make a thunderhead)

Zetsu:

• Plant Manipulation (Zetsu is able to merge himself with plants because of changing his insectivorous plant shell with chakra. Which makes him to not only uses the organic network of plant roots to travel with high speed to different places, but can even use them in a fight)

Hashirama Cell users:

• Resistance to Curse Manipulation (Guruguru who's made of Hashirama Cells was unaffected by Orochimaru's Curse Mark which is listed as Curse Manipulation in the wiki)

Izanagi users:

• Teleportation (as a sub ability - Izanagi transcends space and time to respawn its user in a different location which made its users to teleport as here it's explained)

Kamui users:

• Resistance to Sealing (they can travel to kamui dimension without any problems, which is stated to be a sealed dimension)

Black Receiver users:

• Power Nullification (as a Black Receiver user, Obito was able to negate high class ninjutsus such as Sasuke's Amaterasu amped Susanoo Arrow)

Obito:

• Paralysis Inducement due to Black Receivers (Madara made Obito to use black receivers without rinnegan through Gedo Mazo and he can use it as here it's explained. Also OM Obito was able to use them in the fight with Konan although he hadn't Rinnegan. He would get Resistance to PI too as well)

Most are fine but kamui is not going to be resistance.
Izanagi teleportation is not necessary as it is not teleportation but reality warping. Just coz the end result mimics teleportation doesn't mean we should give it
also resistance to pain manipulation should be immunity actually.

 

[AlternativePrinciple]

Most are fine but kamui is not going to be resistance.
Izanagi teleportation is not necessary as it is not teleportation but reality warping. Just coz the end result mimics teleportation doesn't mean we should give it
also resistance to pain manipulation should be immunity actually.

Agreed

 

[Damage3245]

Limited Invulnerability (With Domu - it's stated that no ninjutsu except lightning style can pierce through it. Also Kakuzu himself stated that any physical attacks on him at this state is useless)

This isn't Invulnerability, just enhanced durability.

 

[Testarossa002]

Naruto:

• Attack Reflection (Naruto was able to reflect the Bijuu bombs that was thrown at him)

This is more of a power feat rather than hax
I'm pretty sure it's listed in his AP/Dura section. If you think it's AR, then his AP/Dura needs to be downgraded

Edo Tenseis:

I mean, yeah but is it really needed?
They're made of dust. It's like giving resistance to Pain manipulation to a stone

Kamui users:

This is like giving wardens resistance to sealing because they can freely move to and fro from prison
Everything else apart from what Karo raised are fine with me ig

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Good Stuff

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

This isn't Invulnerability, just enhanced durability.

Agreed

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

• Immortality (Type 1; after gaining Shinju, Juubidara was able to live forever)

Is there a reason why we trust this as an actual fact instead of just an average villain monologue with zero basis and large egos that think they are completely invincible?

 

[Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe]

Yo. I fixed the problems. But i thought that could be resistance to sealing as three verses has its resistance because they are able to traverse through sealed realms without problem but ok i removed that.
And yeah i was wrong about invulnerability, because a character automatically has it not with a power up. Attack reflection also got removed.

How many problems are left?

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Is there a reason why we trust this as an actual fact instead of just an average villain monologue with zero basis and large egos that think they are completely invincible?

Being invincible doesn’t grant eternal existence

You’re confusing two distinct things

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

Being invincible doesn’t grant eternal existence

You’re confusing two distinct things

I think you misunderstood me, I meant it as an example. To simplify what I meant is, "What makes this as an actual ability he has, instead of him just talking through confidence." Since the "overestimating oneself", "Flowery language", and "Name fallacy" are common troups in shouen.

 

[Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe]

Is there a reason why we trust this as an actual fact instead of just an average villain monologue with zero basis and large egos that think they are completely invincible?

I don't really think this is a hyperbole. Being a Ten Tails jinchuriki will make you to understand something that you never knew. i.e Juubito knew Hagoromo used Sword of Nunoboko to recreate the world while nowhere it's stated that Hagoromo did this, even not in the Uchiha Tablet nor Madara himself didn't know it. He was able to use new jutsus without even trying them before. After Madara becoming a simple Ten Tails Jinchuriki, he just said "i never thought that six paths' power is this strong" while after gaining shinju, he said now i can live forever. Which means now he knows he would live forever. I believe shinju has something within its existence to make others immortal. The tree was existed since creation of the world which shows us the tree wouldn't die due to aging. The mix of it and Kaguya's consciousness gave birth to Ten Tails which has an endless life force (aka immortality type 1 as accepted in the wiki). So i take Juubidara's words not hyperbole because of this reason.

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

I think you misunderstood me, I meant it as an example. To simplify what I meant is, "What makes this as an actual ability he has, instead of him just talking through confidence." Since the "overestimating oneself", "Flowery language", and "Name fallacy" are common troups in shouen.

No i completely understood you


You don’t say you live eternally out of ego or overestimation of battle capabilities, that’s invulnerability not immortality type 1, op didn’t propose that, reread his post

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

No i completely understood you


You don’t say you live eternally out of ego or overestimation of battle capabilities, that’s invulnerability not immortality type 1, op didn’t propose that, reread his post

Clearly not, since you are arguing against an argument I never made.

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Clearly not, since you are arguing against an argument I never made.

You did
You literally said “invincible” when the proposal was immortality type 1


Something completely unrelated and never proposed nor implied by the scans

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

You did
You literally said “invincible” when the proposal was immortality type 1

Wow, you're getting that after reading a single word instead of the sentence?

Something completely unrelated and never proposed nor implied by the scans

Never said it was, read my argument again, you can see like @Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe did. He understood that I never said nor argued about invincibility of any type, nor did I argue the OP did. It was an example of a common type of troupe in anime, with these kinds of characters,


But since you are incapable of understanding that, let me rephrase it yet again.
"Why is this statement an actual feat, instead of a hyperbole?"
That was my question, I was curious if I could get an answer for that, but it seems like instead we have clearly gone off the rails. I won't reply to you anymore since this is clearly irrelevant to the thread, but if anyone else is willing to explain my question, I would be extremely grateful.

 

[MinatoSparkle]

Recommended additions:

• Should replace the fan translated scan of Madara being immortal with the official version (which lines up better with the raws)
• This is an imgur with the Pain power mimicry scan you put and one about his ability to create clones of the Akatsuki

Disagreements:

• Edo Tensei can feel pain. Madara may have just meant that the pain is different, not that it's new to be able to feel pain at all
• There's no real proof that the rods that stopped Sasuke's Susanoo Arrow did so via power nullification or just plain neutralizing the force with an equal opposing force, which would be an AP feat
• Is there evidence that the rods Obito uses have paralysis inducement?

Otherwise, I agree. Btw, where do you get 3rd DB/manga scans? They're pretty low res in general

 

[Damage3245]

Power Nullification (Shinra Tensei is stated to be able negate ninjutsus no matter what size they are. e.g It negated Senpou: FRS)

That translation doesn't say anything about nullifying Ninjutsu.

 

[Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe]

That translation doesn't say anything about nullifying Ninjutsu.

It's explaining the negation power of shinra tensei like how it negated rasenshuriken. Im sure authors don't say "negation" at most of times and instead of that they use some other words. 飛ばす also means scattering which maybe is similar to negation.

Even without the scan it's clear that shinra tensei is able to negate ninjutsus like how it negated rasenshuriken.

 

[Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe]

Also Bunta said that Shinra Tensei Repelled Rasenshuriken and rasenshuriken got negated so im sure databook means ST is able to negate ninjutsus by saying it can repel them

 

[Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe]

That

Agreed

What do you think about other abilities after fixing? Do you agree with them?

 

[LuffyRuffy46307]

I definitely agree with the points made and with Op, great job bro.

 

[Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe]

That

Agreed

Still waiting for your response

 

[karo_senpaii]

Also Bunta said that Shinra Tensei Repelled Rasenshuriken and rasenshuriken got negated so im sure databook means ST is able to negate ninjutsus by saying it can repel them

Or it was so much stronger than the rasenshuriken that it dispelled the tiny wind blades?

 

[Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe]

Or it was so much stronger than the rasenshuriken that it dispelled the tiny wind blades?

No. Databook actually stated that ST can negate any ninjutsus or projectiles no matter what size they are:

It repels any attacks or objects by releasing chakra from the user's hand, creating a powerful shockwave. This technique can repel both small projectiles and large-scale attacks, making it extremely versatile

 

[Damage3245]

No. Databook actually stated that ST can negate any ninjutsus or projectiles no matter what size they are:

It says it repelled the attack, not that it negated it.

 

[Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe]

It says it repelled the attack, not that it negated it.

????

It's explaining the negation power of shinra tensei like how it negated rasenshuriken. Im sure authors don't say "negation" at most of times and instead of that they use some other words. 飛ばす also means scattering which maybe is similar to negation.

Even without the scan it's clear that shinra tensei is able to negate ninjutsus like how it negated rasenshuriken.

Also Bunta said that Shinra Tensei Repelled Rasenshuriken and rasenshuriken got negated so im sure databook means ST is able to negate ninjutsus by saying it can repel them

 

[Entity]

So if wind repels fire we give power nullification to the wind?

 

[Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe]

No. U misunderstood what i said. Read the arguments again.

 

[Entity]

No. U misunderstood what i said. Read the arguments again.

If I remember correctly shinra tensei ia a gravitational push/pull, so it shouldn't have power nullification, it repels attacks with gravitational powers. It is not like the big black balls

 

[Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe]

If I remember correctly shinra tensei ia a gravitational push/pull, so it shouldn't have power nullification, it repels attacks with gravitational powers. It is not like the big black balls

It's just push not pull. Also it's a power that is made by the pain's chakra. And it controls attraction not gravity. Pulling things and controlling gravity is the work of Bansho Tenin not Shinra Tensei. And i gave all explanations above (higher messages and op). So No.

 

[Samlex1234]

Most are fine but kamui is not going to be resistance.
Izanagi teleportation is not necessary as it is not teleportation but reality warping. Just coz the end result mimics teleportation doesn't mean we should give it
also resistance to pain manipulation should be immunity actually.

Reality warping in itself is a versatile ability that can manifest in various forms depending on how the user wields it. At its core, it allows the manipulation of reality itself, but its expression can differ greatly. For example Omnipotence in itself is reality warping, but its expression can vary, ranging from world creation (space-time manipulation) to abilities like mind manipulation, empathic manipulation, status effect inducement, or memory manipulation as seen with Eida manifestations of the ability.

 

[Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe]

 

[karo_senpaii]

Reality warping in itself is a versatile ability that can manifest in various forms depending on how the user wields it. At its core, it allows the manipulation of reality itself, but its expression can differ greatly. For example Omnipotence in itself is reality warping, but its expression can vary, ranging from world creation (space-time manipulation) to abilities like mind manipulation, empathic manipulation, status effect inducement, or memory manipulation as seen with Eida manifestations of the ability.

There is a key difference between omnipotence and this. Omnipotence has an abundance of feats for its subset abilities. I'm going to ignore space time since the "world" meaning is still contested but there is an abundance of statements for both emphatic manipulation and memory manipulation as well as feats shown on panel.
For izanagi where is the evidence for teleportation? We know teleportation is travel too space time, something well emphasized in naruto verse. Now is there any statement for that for Izanagi? Do you seriously think we should index an ability as teleportation because "they seemed to appear elsewhere"? That's not even remotely close to enough evidence for space time travel.

It's simply just RW

 

[Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe]

There is a key difference between omnipotence and this. Omnipotence has an abundance of feats for its subset abilities. I'm going to ignore space time since the "world" meaning is still contested but there is an abundance of statements for both emphatic manipulation and memory manipulation as well as feats shown on panel.
For izanagi where is the evidence for teleportation? We know teleportation is travel too space time, something well emphasized in naruto verse. Now is there any statement for that for Izanagi? Do you seriously think we should index an ability as teleportation because "they seemed to appear elsewhere"? That's not even remotely close to enough evidence for space time travel.

It's simply just RW

Actually that's not so much important. It's just explaining why they have different location of death instead of respawning in the same place that they died. In that link i explained it's similar to teleportation as karin said similar things when she saw both Obito's teleportation and izanagi's teleportation(?). When Obito and Danzo got disappeared, karin wasn't able to sense their chakra and their chakra suddenly appeared in somewhere else. As i said before this isn't an important ability and is a sub one, but just added this because some verses has this mechanic for some of their abilities

 

[Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe]

My honest reaction when i messaged several mods (and several times) but still nothing happened (i got mad):

 

[Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe]

 

[AlternativePrinciple]

Did you tag mods?

 

[Ryu-Strongest-Fighter-in-Universe]

Did you tag mods?

Yeah i asked them in their profile but no one cared