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MCU speed downgrade

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Qawsedf234

Qawsedf234

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This staff thread has been accepted. With it comes a much harder definition of what travel speed is
If a character travels or flies very fast through a very empty terrain, in which it doesn't necessarily have to react to sudden obstacles, the speed in question is travel or flight speed, but not necessarily reaction speed. In order for it to also be reaction speed, and the speed in total hence applying to the character's combat speed, the character either must have demonstrated the ability to react to sudden obstacles while traveling at this speed, have a calculation made that supports the character having corresponding reaction speed/time or otherwise demonstrate having comparable reactions.

Simply being able to stop accurately at the target destination does typically not qualify, as it can be spotted from a large distance to make preparations to stop or the character could even slow down before reaching the destination, assuming we only know the average speed with which they moved.
Click to expand...
The Feats
More or less every single movie MCU character is scaled to this Iron Man calc and this Iron Man calc

  • For reference the scene in question (the relevant part being 0:51) has the armor fly from Tennessee to Miami. The issue being.... they fly in a straight line in the air. In other words, as the above new rule mentions, the pieces were facing no obstacles and would not need to preform rapid movements that would indicate they hard scale to their overall slight speed.
  • The second one is... also Iron Man flying in a straight line in the air over an ocean (for the most part). There's also no indication this scales to his reaction speed, espically since he had a tracking device that allowed him to know where Cap was going and when he needed to stop/slow down.

The new speed scaling
Everyone is downgraded to supersonic+ based on the following calcs
There's also feats that I think were calced but I can't find or stuff that just hasn't been calced such as
  • Iron Man reacting to a tank shot
  • Falcon blocking some bullets
  • Falcon dodging missiles in FatWS
Everyone currently not Captain Marvel tier gets downgraded to Supersonic+. Iron Man and War Machine can keep their ratings as travel speed however.
 
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iron man can flight while flying but you could still say hes not flying at top speed so for them to be MHS for sure there would have to have been a time where Tony is fighting and it would be stupid for him to not be flying at top speed, I dont know if thats happened someone would have to check

and has nobody ever reacted to Thors lightning?
 
It_is_i_wyatt said:
iron man can flight while flying
Click to expand...
Iron Man didn't gain inter-continental flight until IM3. After that movie there's never really a point that he goes out on some MoS style high speed flight duel. Even Vision vs White Vision had a clear case of them not fighting very fast while flying.
It_is_i_wyatt said:
and has nobody ever reacted to Thors lightning?
Click to expand...
Hela has. But that's about it.
 
Can't a lot of characters still scale through Hela? Thor kept up with her in combat, Thanos upscales from him, and a shit load of people downscale from Thanos.
 
Crimson_Shadow101 said:
Can't a lot of characters still scale through Hela?
Click to expand...
The scaling for MHS would be through Captain Marvel and not Hela. Hela's reaction feat to Thor's lightning isn't that good, just slightly moving her arms before a bolt hits her.
 
Actually wait. All of Captain Marvel's MHS speed feats are also all straight-line instances.
The first is travel speed while the second is questionable
Crimson_Shadow101 said:
I'm not quite sure if this changes anything, but KLOL has this Hela calc:
Click to expand...
Hela has instances of being unable to react to Thor's lightning, as does some other characters. I'm not sure if we should be saying she's actually faster than a lightning bolt.

Though that is more legitimate than the other examples brought up
 
You're missing some pretty blatant speed scaling and completely ignoring context with Hela
 
Also you're completely ignoring context for Iron Man's speed scaling the man fights and reacts to things while flying at these high speeds there's no reason from him not to scale to speeds he can fly while fighting at
 
Dalesean027 said:
r Iron Man's speed scaling the man fights and reacts to things while flying at these high speeds
Click to expand...
You would need to prove he's reacting to things while he preforms the speed feats I listed. Those are what are scaling him to MHS and they're both straight-line distances with nothing to react to.
 
Crimson_Shadow101 said:
Should we discuss who exactly should scale to Hela's speed?
Click to expand...
If the Spider-Man calc is accepted then the scaling just comes from him and Hela rather than Iron Man like it does now (barring that they're deemed outliers or inconsistent)

So the only adjustments would changing up the descriptions for relevant hub profiles like Captain America or Iron Man.
 
Qawsedf234 said:
You would need to prove he's reacting to things while he preforms the speed feats I listed. Those are what are scaling him to MHS and they're both straight-line distances with nothing to react to.
Click to expand...
That's fair for those since he's not fighting while flying but I can link to scene's we know Tony can regularly fight while at full flight and ignoring that just for these specific scenes kinda ignores narrative as well that's what I'm saying

 
Qawsedf234 said:
Oh I did miss her accepted calc here. Yeah. Hela tier people keeping their speed rating is fine then, since even under the assumption the CM stuff isn't usable that is.

Unless we're changing the scaling to be that everyone scales to Hela and maybe Iron Spider-Man
Click to expand...
That calc was done using a ruler, which is a pretty big no-no here. I re-did it in my 3.0 calc with proper pixel-scaling which came out to be MHS+.

And yes, this would explicitly scale only to the top-tiers and the god-tiers. Nobody else should scale.
 
Dalesean027 said:
That's fair for those since he's not fighting while flying but I can link to scene's we know Tony can regularly fight while at full flight
Click to expand...
Full flight =/= his inter-continental flight abilities. We have characters that can fly millions of times faster than light but now have heavily reduced combat speed because there's no indication that ones scales to the other.

Iron Man doesn't react to anything in the calced feats and doesn't have a speed statement like with DCEU Superman saying his reaction speed = travel speed. You would need hard evidence that he can fight at those speeds, which you haven't presented.
KLOL506 said:
re-did it in my 3.0 calc with proper pixel-scaling which came out to be MHS+.
Click to expand...
Same principal then. If accepted we just adjust the scaling to MHS for Spider-Man dudes and MHS+ for the Hela tier people
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
Surtur and Odin come to mind. Maybe awakened Thor? Valkyrie was able to surprise Hela
Click to expand...
Yeah, they are the god-tiers of the verse, Surtr, Odin, Awakened Thor (Obviously since this is his attack after all), Thanos and Hela would scale.

Valkyrie, maybe a "possibly" rating.
 
Crimson_Shadow101 said:
Awakened Thor absolutely scales. Valkrie no, as Hela was very obviously concerned with Surtur and no one else at that moment, and she only got her from a blindspot.
Click to expand...
Fair, as scaling Valkyrie may cause lots of other to scale, like Loki or Captain America, which will make scaling odd.
 


Surtur is literally her entire focus right now and she's facing in the exact opposite direction from which Valkrie is attacking.
 
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