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One Punch Man upgrades

Thank you, Ant. Should we wait for Kav before implementing these changes? Should we contact him and link him to this thread?
 
We should, Azathoth. Though i wonder if he's done with his exams or something cause by tomorrow, we gotta do that whole AP revision project.
 
Probably yes. He gets annoyed with me when I screw up, and has considerably better judgement than I currently do.
 
No problem. I hope that he can help to clear up all of the cinematic time issues that have popped up the last month. Personally, like DontTalk, I am okay with it when no distortion is apparent, and think that it would be more convenient to use in such cases, but I think that Kavpeny shares Illuminati's approach that none whatsoever should preferably be used.
 
I'm still a tad confused here. Boros can kick someone to the moon in under 1 second, that's great and all. But wouldn't that be a feat of strength rather than speed? And if Saitama is able to jump back to the moon in the same amount of time, wouldn't that only apply to him and no one else since he is massively above the rest of the cast in stats?
 
So i'm guessing where having a mix Boros, Garou, and Saitama having "likely Planet level" with Sub-Relativistic+ speeds, yea?
 
Well, in real life physics it would be a feat of strength and speed, but you make a good point that fiction is full of cases that do not equate the two. There are plenty of very slow Marvel characters that can punch people into space.
 
Sheoth said:
I'm still a tad confused here. Boros can kick someone to the moon in under 1 second, that's great and all. But wouldn't that be a feat of strength rather than speed? And if Saitama is able to jump back to the moon in the same amount of time, wouldn't that only apply to him and no one else since he is massively above the rest of the cast in stats?
Click to expand...
Around 2, not under 1.

As I said earlier, the reason the feat works as a speed feat is due to the fact that Boros repeatedly showed the ability to hit Saitama with enough force to annihilate the surounding area and send him flying, rush after and pass him, and then hit him in another direction. The only reason he didn't do this when kicking Saitama to the moon was likely because Boros was expecting being launched into space to kill him. Also, as Ant said, sending someone of a similar size to yourself flying is different than sending a small ball flying.
 
I'm pretty much in agreement with Sheoth. So likely Planet level with Sub-Relatvistic+ speeds sounds fine to me.
 
Azathoth the Abyssal Idiot said:
Sheoth said:
I'm still a tad confused here. Boros can kick someone to the moon in under 1 second, that's great and all. But wouldn't that be a feat of strength rather than speed? And if Saitama is able to jump back to the moon in the same amount of time, wouldn't that only apply to him and no one else since he is massively above the rest of the cast in stats?
Click to expand...
Around 2, not under 1.
As I said earlier, the reason the feat works as a speed feat is due to the fact that Boros repeatedly showed the ability to hit Saitama with enough force to annihilate the surounding area and send him flying, rush after and pass him, and then hit him in another direction. The only reason he didn't do this when kicking Saitama to the moon was likely because Boros was expecting being launched into space to kill him. Also, as Ant said, sending someone of a similar size to yourself flying is different than sending a small ball flying.
Click to expand...
Ahhhh... That makes sense. So DontTalk was disagreeing and said he likely wasn't hitting him with the same force during all of the other strikes, correct?

Well, I am kind of split on wether or not the other strikes were as powerful/fast. A case could be made for either side imo...
 
Well, again, I was thinking in terms of real life physics, and forgetting that this is fiction that we are talking about. All of our pages make a massive distinction between strength and speed after all, and lightspeed travel does not automatically translate into infinite punching power within them.
 
Yeah. DontTalk believes the strikes weren't as powerful as the one that sent Saitama into space, whereas I'm of the opinion quite a few of them were.

I mainly believe that due to Boros' first strike against Saitama actually appearing to have more destructive force (obliterated the top of his ship and a large portion of his crew while sending Saitama flying), and there being other strikes that appeared to have similar if slightly less force than the one that sent him to the moon, such as when Boros was in the air, pounded Saitama towards the ground, darted onto the ground, ran in a circle, and jumped back up to meet him with a kick before Saitama was even at the bottom.
 
Sending him flying shouldn't be connected tto his speed out of the already mentioned reasons (basically any physical strike of island level Attack potency would be over 0.9c if we did that. Hence speed and strength isn't viewed as related in that direction).

Aside from that you know my opinion, but in this case I really don't hold the main authority here. So if the rest of the staff agrees on this, then they should by all means implement it.
 
DontTalk said:
Sending him flying shouldn't be connected tto his speed out of the already mentioned reasons (basically any physical strike of island level Attack potency would be over 0.9c if we did that. Hence speed and strength isn't viewed as related in that direction).
Aside from that you know my opinion, but in this case I really don't hold the main authority here. So if the rest of the staff agrees on this, then they should by all means implement it.
Click to expand...
I agree with this.
 
Well, I have high regard for your sense of judgement, and agree with you about this.

Implementing the AP upgrade does not seem very controversial, whereas the speed upgrade seems much more uncertain, mainly due to that real life physics generally do not apply to speed and attack power correlations within fiction; but the possibility of cinematic time gives it an extra degree of uncertainty as well.
 
I believe I was pretty clear that I disagreed with assuming cinematic time-frame as the basis for speed ratings, because cinematic time is both unreliable and often results in incorrect speeds.

Secondly, the fact that ONE is intrinsicly involved in the Anime production is irrelevant. Almost every author owns intellectual property in any of the franchise's subsequent adaptations. Now, while this does not mean we react with a "LOL, non canon", it definitely means that if some aspect of an adaptation is contradictory to the source material, then the source material will be relied upon regardless to the credentials of authenticity that the adaptation boasts.

Another excellent point brought up by DontTalk is the fact that the velocity of an object which has been set into motion is a very weak basis to determine the velocity of the object (or character) responsible for said motion. The only person whose speed can be scaled to is Saitama jumping from the moon to the earth, which, disregarding cinematic time frames, already has a calc.

IMO, the speed stat doesn't need to be changed at all.


As for the Attack Potency, again, the webcomic is the primary canon material. However, the manga depicts Boros to be capable of destroying the surface of a planet, not the planet itself. Again, no support for the statement in question, and contradiction in an alternative adaptation.

Again, the scaling is not solid, and IMO, Attack Potency should be listed as "At least Multi-Continent level, probably Planet level", along with an explnation for said rating.

Agreements/Disagreements?


P.S.: To those of you who haven't done so already, kindly also take another look here, and let me know what you think.
 
As usual, I think that Lord Kavpeny makes sense.
 
I agree with Kav on the AP thing, and will change affected characters to "At least 6-A, likely 5-B".

Still, as DontTalk said here (despite our disagreement in this particular case), I'm not particularly comfortable with the idea of discounting all speed feats in anime as possible cinematic time and being forced to remeasure them. That said, it will be good to have solid rules and make no exceptions (as it will help the overall quality of the site), I just don't particularly agree with this one, though my mind is obviously open to change.
 
Lord Kavpeny, once again, makes a very solid case. I agree with him.
 
I have changed it. Boros and Garou are now "At least 6-A, likely 5-B" while Saitama is "At the very least High 6-A, likely at least 5-B, probably far higher" which is a bit of a mouth full, but I feel it gets the point across.
 
@Azathoth: Don't mean to nitpick, but could you please change "likely" to "probably"?

Reason:

  • Webcomic: ?? (will wipe off the face of the earth)
  • Manga: Multi-Continent level+
  • Anime: Planet level
Two contradictory secondary sources, which implies that the actual AP statistic is indeterminate, hence "probably" is more apt than "likely", aka "At least 6-A, probably 5-B" instead of the current listing.
 
"Likely" is utilized to indicate that while a hypothetical statistic is favourable, there isn't any evidence to back it up. "Probably" is utilized if the statistic is entirely indeterminate.
 
No problem.

By the way, I have expanded on info for a few characters (mainly pre-monster Garou and sealed Boros). I hope this is acceptable.
 
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