Red bitch versus Green bitch (Makima versus Tatsumaki)

[LIFE_OF_KING]

The world's strongest psychic versus The Devil of Control
Both in-character
No prior knowledge
Starting distance of 10 meters
Speed is unequalized
Location: Krat from Lies Of P

Spoiler

Mental strength is secondary. All you really need is overwhelming power.: 6 (@Phoenks @ssgengar @Engine @Raiden38 @Harith0cell @BoastJr)

If you're going to get in our way, then die.: 3 (@ZillertheBucko @Zabazab @Serlock_Holmes)

Hurting people doesn't make anyone happy. But everyone feels better after a nice dessert:

 

[Coomandar]

not a good match.

this is what happens:

Tatsumaki would also obliterate Japan if needed.

one-side battle indeed.

 

[DMUA]

I think the only factor that could make this swing is if Tatsumaki counts as a japanese citizen

Even if the answer was yes that'd just result in Makima getting her to kill herself by accident, so it's not really any more a compelling matchup for it

 

[Epiccheev]

Christmas color type match

 

[Phoenks]

Tatsumaki can destroy Makima down to the cellular (if not even lower) level with any casual TK attack due to the AP difference. And it's thought-based. Makima lacks feats of coming back from that degree of destruction.

On top of that, even if Makima can come back, Tatsumaki will not hesitate to just send her body into outer space at Rela+ speed and end the battle via BFR.

On top of that, even if Makima still comes back, Tatsumaki could just incapacitate via deconstructing her for 24 hours straight without Makima being able to retaliate.

 

[Zabazab]

Tatsumaki crumples Makima into a coin-sized ball of meat & bone, thinks the job's done, and gets hit with 「Unnamed Bio Hax」. Brain melts out of her schnoz and it's gg.

 

[Emirp sumitpo]

Would Tatsumaki even count as a Japanese citizen? Japan doesn't really exist in where Tatsumaki comes from, and Tatsumaki is like... French apparently.

So the contract wouldn't work on Tats

 

[Recon1511]

I mean with speed unequalized Tatsumaki atomizes her with a thought

Also, despite the OPM world being a giant Japan, it's not really Japan and Murata has described the psychic sisters as being french looking.

 

[Maitreya12]

Speed being unequalized here means Makima can’t even perceive Tatsumaki either.

 

[Phoenks]

Yeah doesn't even count as Japan, Tatsumaki just atomizes her. She could destroy Psykos down to the cells, and she is like trilions of times stronger than Makima lmfao.

Tatsumaki stomps.

 

[Coomandar]

I think the only factor that could make this swing is if Tatsumaki counts as a japanese citizen

Even if the answer was yes that'd just result in Makima getting her to kill herself by accident, so it's not really any more a compelling matchup for it

tatsumaki is french.

 

[Zabazab]

Tatsumaki has no way of knowing Makima will come back from being a puddle, or even that it's a damage transferal ability. She'll reduce Makima to a smear, cackle at how easy it was, and later her brain tissue will liquify.

 

[Phoenks]

Tatsumaki has no way of knowing Makima will come back from being a puddle, or even that it's a damage transferal ability. She'll reduce Makima to a smear, cackle at how easy it was, and later her brain tissue will liquify.

1. Prove that Makima can come back from complete cellular, if not even atomic destruction.
2. Prove that Makima won't immediately come back.
3. Explain how she would liquify her brain and provide evidence.

 

[BoastJr]

 

[Zabazab]

1. Prove that Makima can come back from complete cellular, if not even atomic destruction.

I don't think the process of her immortality (Law Hax-based Damage Transferal targetting what opponents view as "Attacks") should warrant something like that, it's not regeneration after all, but her best feat is that Denji cooking & eating all of her, including hair & blood, wouldn't have stopped her Contract if Denji didn't view it as "not an attack, but love" (Mid-High given it's digestion, but assigning regeneration degrees to her ability is wrong in the first place).

Would Tatsu's go-to even be destruction at that level? A light squeeze would pop Makima like a grape.

2. Prove that Makima won't immediately come back.

Her Contract's speed has varied frequently, from nearly-instant, to a several seconds, to an unknown length of time (a few tens of seconds? minutes?) when she was shot on a train in Chapter 22 and revived in Chapter 26.

3. Explain how she would liquify her brain and provide evidence.

With her aforementioned 「Unnamed Bio Hax」 (no ability in CSM will ever be properly explained, it is what it is).

 

[Recon1511]

Also I should note that her first attack is actual full body destruction

Hell given the difference in AP Makima would be turned into a red mist like the monster fodder in these two panels lol

 

[Zabazab]

Yes she would be reduced to mist instantly, no one's denying that.

 

[Phoenks]

I don't think the process of her immortality (Law Hax-based Damage Transferal targetting what opponents view as "Attacks") should warrant something like that, it's not regeneration after all, but her best feat is that Denji cooking & eating all of her, including hair & blood, wouldn't have stopped her Contract if Denji didn't view it as "not an attack, but love" (Mid-High given it's digestion, but assigning regeneration degrees to her ability is wrong in the first place).

Cooking and eating is not Mid-High. You have to first consider the fact that digestion is over-time, not instantaneous, and even at the end of the process, it does not even incinerate all cellular matter, which is the requirement for Mid-High. Also, you are trying to use a vague scan to prove this is absolutely true in the first place, when the scan could be referring to him cutting her to pieces, him swallowing her, and only at its best interpretation would be referring to the act of digestion in its entirety.

Also, immortality like this still does have levels to it. You can't just say it works on any type and any degree of damage, as that would be a NLF.

Her Contract's speed has varied frequently, from nearly-instant, to a several seconds, to an unknown length of time (a few tens of seconds? minutes?) when she was shot on a train in Chapter 22 and revived in Chapter 26.

Which is precisely why you can't make that assumption.

Even in her best-case scenario, Tatsumaki has thousands of kilometers worth of ESP and enhanced senses combined with thousands of times faster reaction speed. Regardless of Makima's strategy, she'd pick up on it before she could do anything.

Would Tatsu's go-to even be destruction at that level? A light squeeze would pop Makima like a grape.

Both want to kill each other no matter what

Even ignoring that this is in the OP, yes, it is her go-to to disintegrate her opponents.

 

[Shmooply]

I would like to thank Death Battle for this influx of matches where Gojo and Makima get turned into statistics.

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Just posting this to make it clear that Phoenks is a fraud fr, not even gonna vote.

 

[Coomandar]

She is a asshole bitch but not at this level

are you sure?

 

[Coomandar]

Tatsumaki is still a sociopath, dont forget it.

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

Yes, I mean, why would she kill 116 million of people (Babys, childs and such) just for one kill lol. She cares about human life to an extent

 

[Coomandar]

she had no problem with killing everyone in HA base

 

[Phoenks]

Japan point is irrelevant. She isn't from Japan lol.

 

[Coomandar]

Yes, I mean, why would she kill 116 million of people (Babys, childs and such) just for one kill lol. She cares about human life to an extent

because she is bloodlusted here, not in character.

bloodlusted tatsumaki is an assassin.

she doesn’t care about humans while enraged at all.

 

[Coomandar]

Japan point is irrelevant. She isn't from Japan lol.

not that, makima can ressurect from japan’s citizens

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

Japan point is irrelevant. She isn't from Japan lol.

Ik, im talking about she killing random people

But well, wathever

 

[Coomandar]

Ik, im talking about she killing random people

But well, wathever

she would destroy japan so makima wouldnt be to resurrect.

but this would not be needed thought

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Makima FRA, actually

 

[LIFE_OF_KING]

Both are in-character now (I don't think it changes something, but they said that in-character would be more interesting and fair)

 

[Phoenks]

Both are in-character now (I don't think it changes something, but they said that in-character would be more interesting and fair)

It's not more fair Tatsumaki still slams the **** out of her.

 

[Zabazab]

Cooking and eating is not Mid-High. You have to first consider the fact that digestion is over-time, not instantaneous, and even at the end of the process, it does not even incinerate all cellular matter, which is the requirement for Mid-High. Also, you are trying to use a vague scan to prove this is absolutely true in the first place, when the scan could be referring to him cutting her to pieces, him swallowing her, and only at its best interpretation would be referring to the act of digestion in its entirety.

You're acting as though it's vague when it's one of the most explicit showcasings we get for her Contract.

Kishibe does not believe that eating her would suffice (he is not aware of the loophole that only perceived attacks are transferred yet), and mentions people are dying currently because of Makima being in pieces. Denji does not believe blowing up Makima would be enough to put her down.

Denji has to even eat Makima's hair and blood to ensure she dies, which suggests she could come back from something as small as a hair or a drop of blood (you can see both blood and hair in the panel). The timeframe for her return from this is currently unknown (Makima was in pieces for at least a few hours and did not revive). Kishibe thought she would return from Denji's stomach or waste, which only did not occur because of the contract loophole.

(Scans stolen from Cyberblader90 btw)

Makima's Contract doesn't even activate if she's receiving continuous damage, and the context is absolutely referring to complete digestion. Not just "cutting her up and swallowing her".

Also, immortality like this still does have levels to it. You can't just say it works on any type and any degree of damage, as that would be a NLF.

It's technically not even immortality. It's an application of Law Manipulation that transforms perceived attacks. Any self-perceived attack causing damage that doesn't hit soul-nonsense levels (CSM has no soul mentions) would just be transformed.

Even if you do want to pretend her Contract acts like regeneration, it's feats are high enough.

Even in her best-case scenario, Tatsumaki has thousands of kilometers worth of ESP and enhanced senses combined with thousands of times faster reaction speed. Regardless of Makima's strategy, she'd pick up on it before she could do anything.

Her ESP says she was tracking locations via terminals the characters were carrying, no? Would she bother to actively track a red mist?

 

[PhantomØ4]

Also I should note that her first attack is actual full body destruction

Hell given the difference in AP Makima would be turned into a red mist like the monster fodder in these two panels lol

I think it’s pretty funny that people act like Makima’s contract is “If I take damage I will just regenerate deadpool style where I have to re-create myself from a mass of my body” instead of what it is— law hax that transfers the result of an attack on her being to occur to random japanese— and appears to regenerate because that attack’s effects are no longer on her. If you act like she can’t damage transfer from mist then even if her finger got vaporized she wouldn’t be able to heal from that which goes against the common regen scale either way. We should stop ignoring mechanics and acting like all healing effects act under the same idea.

 

[Phoenks]

Kishibe does not believe that eating her would suffice (he is not aware of the loophole that only perceived attacks are transferred yet), and mentions people are dying currently because of Makima being in pieces. Denji does not believe blowing up Makima would be enough to put her down.

Denji has to even eat Makima's hair and blood to ensure she dies, which suggests she could come back from something as small as a hair or a drop of blood (you can see both blood and hair in the panel). The timeframe for her return from this is currently unknown (Makima was in pieces for at least a few hours and did not revive). Kishibe thought she might return from Denji's stomach or waste, which only did not occur because of the contract loophole.

(Scans stolen from Cyberblader90 btw)

Makima's Contract doesn't even activate if she's receiving continuous damage, and the context is absolutely referring to complete digestion. Not just "cutting her up and swallowing her".

At the absolute best, ignoring the fact that this is all a possibility in the first place (Can't be proven), what you've provided is Low-High due to the blood argument, which is not sufficient enough to prevent Tatsumaki from winning with a single attack.

It's technically not even immortality. It's an application of Law Manipulation that transforms perceived attacks. Any self-perceived attack causing damage that doesn't hit soul-nonsense levels (CSM has no soul mentions) would just be transformed.

Even if you do want to pretend her Contract acts like regeneration, it's feats are high enough.

The feats are not high enough, as they only reach Low-High. And you may only say damage which has been transferred before can be transferred. Any extrapolations are NLF.

Her ESP says she was tracking locations via terminals the characters were carrying, no? Would she bother to actively track a red mist?

Tracked the location of the rest of the heroes communicators inside the Monster Association base.[3] Able to sense Psykos and Drive Knight's presence and pinpoint their whereabouts even while both of them were underground.[4] Can sense spatial distortions and dimensional travel.[5]

With this level of ESP she could easily just sense the moment Makima reappeared and immediately take care of her. Assuming she doesn't instantly come back and give Tatsumaki knowledge of that.

Makima only gets one shot at this, anyway. The moment Tatsumaki knows about her immortality she's going to be prepared for it.

It just looks like liquification to me, is it stated to be disintegration?

It literally makes him fade into nothing in the end lol.

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Makima can literally think and fight while repeatedly losing lives per punch while throwing hands with Chainsaw Denji, dying doesn't hinder her in the slightest
she literally just needs to think to kill Tatsumaki, Tatsumaki has to go through a bunch of BS to even get to a wincon.
This is hardly a fight, Makima wins extremely decisively, gg.

 

[Phoenks]

I think it’s pretty funny that people act like Makima’s contract is “If I take damage I will just regenerate deadpool style where I have to re-create myself from a mass of my body” instead of what it is— law hax that transfers the result of an attack on her being to occur to random japanese— and appears to regenerate because that attack’s effects are no longer on her. If you act like she can’t damage transfer from mist then even if her finger got vaporized she wouldn’t be able to heal from that which goes against the common regen scale either way. We should stop ignoring mechanics and acting like all healing effects act under the same idea.

It is still on you to prove her ability works at that level regardless of if we treat it has immortality, resurrection, law hax, etc.

The argument does not change.

 

[Phoenks]

Makima can literally think and fight while repeatedly losing lives per punch while throwing hands with Chainsaw Denji, dying doesn't hinder her in the slightest
she literally just needs to think to kill Tatsumaki, Tatsumaki has to go through a bunch of BS to even get to a wincon.
This is hardly a fight, Makima wins extremely decisively, gg.

Tatsumaki doesn't have to go through any BS, a single attack would destroy her down to a level she has no evidence to be capable of coming back from.

Nobody even bothered to address her just tossing Makima into space either, lmao.

 

[ZillertheBucko]

Tatsumaki doesn't have to go through any BS, a single attack would destroy her down to a level she has no evidence to be capable of coming back from.

Makima FRA

 

[Zabazab]

At the absolute best, ignoring the fact that this is all a possibility in the first place (Can't be proven), what you've provided is Low-High due to the blood argument, which is not sufficient enough to prevent Tatsumaki from winning with a single attack.

The feats are not high enough, as they only reach Low-High. And you may only say damage which has been transferred before can be transferred. Any extrapolations are NLF.

Cooking & complete digestion of every part of a person chemically breaks down biomatter and extracts usable molecules. It'd be a level of biological destruction comparable to Mid-High.

Calling it "just a possibility" when the wisest guy in the series was like "damn that shouldn't have worked, must be a loophole on her Contract only working on attacks." Plus CSM Part 1's final chapter makes no sense if eating Makima is normally enough to kill her, since it's explained that Denji seeing cannibalism as love is what bypassed her Contract & killed her, not the level of destruction.

Tracked the location of the rest of the heroes communicators inside the Monster Association base.[3] Able to sense Psykos and Drive Knight's presence and pinpoint their whereabouts even while both of them were underground.[4] Can sense spatial distortions and dimensional travel.[5]

With this level of ESP she could easily just sense the moment Makima reappeared and immediately take care of her. Assuming she doesn't instantly come back and give Tatsumaki knowledge of that.

This is when tracking a specific object and actively searching someone respectively. Does her ESP have any feats similar to sensing the change from dead to living?

It literally makes him fade into nothing in the end lol.

If you mean the Rock Guy, he turned to dust because he's made of Rock. The fodder behind her were reduced to splatters/red mist.