Titanic Asura's Wrath Revisions!

[ByAsura]

And reduced his entire body to lava gradually, which supports my point.

Both happened. And I don’t see why Asura doing it is any more valid, especially since it happens afterwards.

Funny you say that because things like gas and other combustibles tend to explode when heated up (especially to this degree), yet does the explosion scale to the catalyst? No, it usually scales well above.

I don’t see how this is such a big thing for burden of proof. The fact is, it happened after and the heat spread halfway across his entire body. Do explosions caused by the exact same source happen that slowly? No, I’m like 99% sure they’re coterminous.

What’s more likely is that Wyzen died and exploded, either due to a chain reaction caused by Asura’s punch or his death itself releasing massive amounts of Mantra that he took from the Karma Fortress.

Also, Wyzen explodes horizontally from well above Gaia’s surface. If Asura destroyed him on Gaia’s surface, why did no part explosion occur near the ground?

 

[Zamasu_Chan]

And reduced his entire body to lava gradually, which supports my point.

Both happened. And I don’t see why Asura doing it is any more valid, especially since it happens afterwards.

Funny you say that because things like gas and other combustibles tend to explode when heated up (especially to this degree), yet does the explosion scale to the catalyst? No, it usually scales well above.

Wyzen having metallic parts doesn’t make him a combustible robot. These guys can bleed two forms of blood and conceive children. They’re not entirely robotic so you need evidence on why he’s so flammable.

You’re also implying that they have some weakness to heat and would instantly explode. If that’s the case, why does this massive about of hot mantra, which was shown melting a Gohma physically stronger than Asura, not cause Asura’s body to immediately combust?

Make it make sense and stop dancing around semantics.

 

[ByAsura]

It also wouldn't necessarily make them vaporize upon death, and yet they do. The Gohma are fully organic, yet they vaporize upon death. Even Vlitra explodes once its core is breeched.

Probably has something to do with not having his body melted, or not absorbing a huge quantity of Mantra from the Karma Fortress.

You're the one dancing around semantics here. It objectively happened way after, right as it hit Wyzen's head, didn't cause any explosion on Gaia (despite Wyzen's finger being the source), and Asura's attacks don't cause some kind of delayed secondary explosion like this before or again. Not only that, but the explosion expanded outwards in a horizontal direction, meaning that this would have to be different from the effect that burned Wyzen by logic.

I genuinely don't get what could be more obvious, and you absolutely need to provide actual proof for what you're saying, especially since this has yet to be accepted.

 

[The_Axiom_of_Virgo]

This is getting ridiculous can we please avoid circular arguments in a CRT that's well over a month old?

 

[Zamasu_Chan]

It also wouldn't necessarily make them vaporize upon death, and yet they do. The Gohma are fully organic, yet they vaporize upon death. Even Vlitra explodes once its core is breeched.

That vaporization effect happened to any Gohma or Demigod that dies. It doesn’t matter how they die, they disintegrate regardless.

Probably has something to do with not having his body melted, or not absorbing a huge quantity of Mantra from the Karma Fortress.

What are you even saying?

You're the one dancing around semantics here. It objectively happened way after, right as it hit Wyzen's head, didn't cause any explosion on Gaia (despite Wyzen's finger being the source),

It turned the landscape into a volcanic wasteland. Why is that even important?

and Asura's attacks don't cause some kind of delayed secondary explosion like this before or again. Not only that, but the explosion expanded outwards in a horizontal direction, meaning that this would have to be different from the effect that burned Wyzen by logic.

Laughable. Ok, let’s use your logic here. All of Asura’s punches got broken on Wyzen’s finger. Asura got one lucky punch because he heated up a singular spot but it started exponentially increasing as as after effect, especially considering how long it took. Therefore Asura shouldn’t scale to Wyzen at all.

See how ridiculous that sounds? It’s that “after effect” logic you’re pushing. Not me. Asura punched Wyzen and he exploded, plain and simple.

I genuinely don't get what could be more obvious, and you absolutely need to provide actual proof for what you're saying, especially since this has yet to be accepted.

Yet again, the burden of proof is on you. You need to prove that Wyzen is somehow flammable and/or weak to extreme heat.

You wanna know something funny? Asura stretched Vajra Wyzen’s body to the point it started heating up and Wyzen’s finger was literally burning up during reentry yet he didn’t suddenly detonate.

Burden. Of. Proof!

 

[ByAsura]

That vaporization effect happened to any Gohma or Demigod that dies. It doesn’t matter how they die, they disintegrate regardless.

Except Vlitra. And it shows that they can have deaths that don't make sense for machines.

What are you even saying?

That Gongen Wyzen isn't Asura and the damages you showed aren't remotely comparable to what Wyzen received.

It turned the landscape into a volcanic wasteland. Why is that even important?

The landscape was already a volcanic wasteland. You literally linked that scene yourself, and my clip outright shows that the epicentre was far above Gaia.

Because, if Asura caused an explosion, why wouldn't it occur at the damn source (aka his finger)?

Laughable. Ok, let’s use your logic here. All of Asura’s punches got broken on Wyzen’s finger. Asura got one lucky punch because he heated up a singular spot but it started exponentially increasing as as after effect, especially considering how long it took. Therefore Asura shouldn’t scale to Wyzen at all.

This is utterly laughable. What does this even mean? How does this even remotely disprove anything I'm saying?

This has so little actual logic that I'm actually convinced that if you told a fish to swim, they'd develop wings and fly to Saturn.

It's a massive strawman that does not follow any logical conclusion from my point.

See how ridiculous that sounds? It’s that “after effect” logic you’re pushing. Not me. Asura punched Wyzen and he exploded, plain and simple.

It sounds ridiculous when you utterly strawman my point.

Here's what happened in sequence.

• Asura punches Wyzen's finger.
• The impact of the punch heats up his entire body.
• Right at the time he dies, a secondary explosion is created far above Gaia.

That is not ridiculous.

Yet again, the burden of proof is on you. You need to prove that Wyzen is somehow flammable and/or weak to extreme heat.

You're the one claiming Asura scales to this attack at all.

You wanna know something funny? Asura stretched Vajra Wyzen’s body to the point it started heating up and Wyzen’s finger was literally burning up during reentry yet he didn’t suddenly detonate.

Because his body wasn't melting. Stop strawmanning my points.

Burden. Of. Proof!

So. Provide. Proof. That. Asura. Blew. Him. Up. And. It. Wasn't. A. Secondary. Explosion!

 

[Zamasu_Chan]

Except Vlitra. And it shows that they can have deaths that don't make sense for machines.

We don’t actually see what happens to Vlitra's body because it fades to white.
Augus fades away due to his injuries.
Sergei dies to his injuries.
Deus dies to his injuries.
Olga is killed.
Yasha dies.
Asura dies.
All of them fade away like burning paper yet Wyzen is the only one that blows up.

That Gongen Wyzen isn't Asura and the damages you showed aren't remotely comparable to what Wyzen received.

You’re right, if anything, it's far wrose. Asura at this point is much stronger than Wyzen. It's also stated time and time again that Asura's anger destroys his body. That gigantic mantra arm is readiating with power and heat yet Asura doesn’t explode. Explain why he doesn’t explode since you claim they're prone to detonate.

The landscape was already a volcanic wasteland. You literally linked that scene yourself, and my clip outright shows that the epicentre was far above Gaia.

This was before Wyzen died. This was after. First it's a regular landscape with mountains and grey skies, then BOOM, all of a sudden there's lava, black clouds, thunder and lightning, and red skies. The explosion clearly had an effect on the land Asura was standing on. Also, no shit the explosion would be higher up, Wyzen's body is literally in space.

Because, if Asura caused an explosion, why wouldn't it occur at the damn source (aka his finger)?

It literally did lmaooo.

This is utterly laughable. What does this even mean? How does this even remotely disprove anything I'm saying?
This has so little actual logic that I'm actually convinced that if you told a fish to swim, they'd develop wings and fly to Saturn.
It's a massive strawman that does not follow any logical conclusion from my point.
It sounds ridiculous when you utterly strawman my point.

Aye man, I was just pointing out what you wer doing. It's not my fault you found yourself dumbfounded by your own logic.

Here's what happened in sequence.

• Asura punches Wyzen's finger.
• The impact of the punch heats up his entire body.
• Right at the time he dies, a secondary explosion is created far above Gaia.

That is not ridiculous.
You're the one claiming Asura scales to this attack at all.
Because his body wasn't melting. Stop strawmanning my points.

"Saitama's punches didn’t make Boros explode, the heat did it."

So. Provide. Proof. That. Asura. Blew. Him. Up. And. It. Wasn't. A. Secondary. Explosion!

You literally provided 0 evidence on why it's a secondary explosion and/or why Wyzen's body is so explosive to begin with.

You clearly don’t seem to know this but explosions do tend to go through a process where some objects heat up right before they explode, but it's just too fast for the human eye to see. That's literally what happens to Wyzen but it's slowed down for cinematic effect.

 

[ByAsura]

We don’t actually see what happens to Vlitra's body because it fades to white.

We see Vlitra compact, its core begin to burst open, a titanic release of energy happens and then an explosion follows.

Augus fades away due to his injuries.
Sergei dies to his injuries.
Deus dies to his injuries.
Olga is killed.
Yasha dies.
Asura dies.
All of them fade away like burning paper yet Wyzen is the only one that blows up.

When Yasha dies, you see his mantra releasing.

Gongen Wyzen, the guy who's the size of a planet and empowered by the Karma Fortress.

You’re right, if anything, it's far wrose. Asura at this point is much stronger than Wyzen. It's also stated time and time again that Asura's anger destroys his body. That gigantic mantra arm is readiating with power and heat yet Asura doesn’t explode. Explain why he doesn’t explode since you claim they're prone to detonate.

Asura didn't just absorb a huge amount of Mantra, he amplified his abilities with rage.

Because his body isn't going into complete meltdown.

This was before Wyzen died. This was after. First it's a regular landscape with mountains and grey skies, then BOOM, all of a sudden there's lava, black clouds, thunder and lightning, and red skies. The explosion clearly had an effect on the land Asura was standing on. Also, no shit the explosion would be higher up, Wyzen's body is literally in space.

Look at the ground underneath Asura turning into lava and the shockwave progressing across the planet afterwards. Plus, even if you somehow had proof that it melted this part of the planet, it still occurred in the sky from all visuals we see.

It literally did lmaooo.

This is the explosion. That is not.

Aye man, I was just pointing out what you wer doing. It's not my fault you found yourself dumbfounded by your own logic.

I did not remotely allude to any of that. You're making a complete strawman out of my points that does not at all follow my logic.

It's like if I claimed potatoes were the easiest vegetable to peel, and you countered that by saying you don't have a vegetable peeler so that can't be true.

In this case, I'm claiming that the punch was utterly destroying Wyzen to the point where it triggered a secondary explosion, much like the Death Star. It has nothing to do with anything you said.

"Saitama's punches didn’t make Boros explode, the heat did it."

That it not at all equivocal, as I explained above.

Wyzen was engulfed, and then randomly exploded. Boros was just blown apart.

You literally provided 0 evidence on why it's a secondary explosion and/or why Wyzen's body is so explosive to begin with.

I have provided evidence. His body explodes well after, at a different source, etc.

You clearly don’t seem to know this but explosions do tend to go through a process where some objects heat up right before they explode, but it's just too fast for the human eye to see. That's literally what happens to Wyzen but it's slowed down for cinematic effect.

Which is part of the explosion process and called a fireball. They do not heat up a single object thoroughly at that speed and then explode right after, and it occurs at the same point of origin, but fireballs (not the process of convection) travels far faster than kinetic energy.

 

[Zamasu_Chan]

We see Vlitra compact, its core begin to burst open, a massive explosion and then a secondary explosion.

Why is this relevant?

Gongen Wyzen, the guy who's the size of a planet and empowered by the Karma Fortress.

Why is this relevant?

Asura didn't just absorb a huge amount of Mantra, he amplified his abilities with rage.

I never said he absorbed any mantra.

Because his body isn't going into complete meltdown.

All that heat is coming out of him and I still see no explosion.

Look at the ground underneath Asura turning into lava and the shockwave progressing across the planet afterwards.

Yes, lava is one thing, the entire atmosphere was changed after the explosion too, something you neglected to point out.

Oh my god, that is not the explosion. That is the heat. This is the explosion.

Again, Asura's fists are a result of that explosion.

I did not remotely allude to any of that. You're making a complete strawman out of my points that does not at all follow my logic.

A strawman would be deliberately misquoting what you said and calling it your word verbatim. That's not what I did. I used your logic to create an example on why it bad.

That it not at all equivocal.
Wyzen was engulfed and completely melted, and then randomly exploded. Boros was just blown apart.

It's actually the same instance but you’re using willful ignorance and nitpicking to say they aren’t the same when it's the exact same scenario. Both characters heat up then blow up. They even turn the same color lmao.

I have provided evidence. His body explodes well after.

No you didn’t. All you did was repeat this line and hope for the best. I kept asking you, and will keep asking you, what caused his body to explode separately and why? Yet you never answered me. It's almost as if you keep avoiding to answer the question because A) you have no evidence to support it, B) once you finally answer it's the point is gonna be so bad you'd be ashamed of yourself, or C) you'll just say "because he exploded after" like you've said for the past hundread times.

Which is part of the explosion process and called a fireball. They do not heat up a single object thoroughly at that speed and then explode right after, and it occurs at the same point of origin.

Yeah, it happens to Wyzen.

 

[ByAsura]

Why is this relevant?

Because it shows that characters can explode.

Why is this relevant?

Because he's not like other girls, he's a planet-sized Mantra reactor.

I never said he absorbed any mantra.

I never said you did. Why is this relevant?

All that heat is coming out of him and I still see no explosion.

It expands outwards horizontally, which the heat on Wyzen's body didn't do. It's an explosion.

Yes, lava is one thing, the entire atmosphere was changed after the explosion too, something you neglected to point out.

I didn't point it out because it obviously could have happened at any time when Asura was under his finger or as Wyzen was being destroyed. Plus, my point was, again, that the explosion's source is shown to be in the sky, so this is not relevant.

Again, Asura's fists are a result of that explosion.

Again, they are not.

A strawman would be deliberately misquoting what you said and calling it your word verbatim. That's not what I did. I used your logic to create an example on why it bad.

You did not use my logic. You just said 'muh heat', claimed it was my logic, and called it a day.

It's actually the same instance but you’re using willful ignorance and nitpicking to say they aren’t the same when it's the exact same scenario. Both characters heat up then blow up. They even turn the same color lmao.

Here's the difference then. Saitama is still punching him and his fists/the heat they generate are travelling faster than his body bursting apart. You're talking about a single punch from Asura that slowly propagated up his arm.

No you didn’t. All you did was repeat this line and hope for the best. I kept asking you, and will keep asking you, what caused his body to explode separately and why?

Because the point isn't necessarily why he explodes separately, it's that he explodes separately.

Yet you never answered me.

I have.

It's almost as if you keep avoiding to answer the question because A) you have no evidence to support it, B) once you finally answer it's the point is gonna be so bad you'd be ashamed of yourself, or C) you'll just say "because he exploded after" like you've said for the past hundread times.

So far, your points rely on a misunderstanding of the laws of physics, shifting away the burden of proof, strawmans, false equivalences and not quoting entire sections of my arguments. You should be the one who feels shame, my guy.

He objectively did explode afterwards, though.

Yeah, it happens to Wyzen.

No it absolutely doesn't. The heat travels up his arm to his face in one direction. He does not explode outwards in a multi-directional blast until the fire reaches his head.

 

[Zamasu_Chan]

[Snip]

As I predicted, you went with option C. Since you don’t know why there were two explosions, that means YOU have to make assumptions. And as we all know, the claim with more assumptions is an extraordinary claim. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Initially your argument was "he's a robot", but since you no longer have that let to stand on, you're left with this open ended [headcanon] to the point you don't know why you said what you said.

My claim: Wyzen's body exploded because Asura punched him.
Your claim: Wyzen exploded because it's a secondary explosion caused by unknown means. Who knows what it is, it's probably because he's a robot. Or maybe because he's super hot, I can't give a reason.

 

[ByAsura]

As I predicted, you could not debunk that the explosion came after and had to resort to shining the most manipulative light on my points that you could.

Anyway, this is getting pretty heated. I'm going to calm down a little, you should calm down if you're not calm (my apologies if that's the case), and I think we should wait for what others think.

 

[Antvasima]

It would probably be best if ByAsura and Zamasu respectively explain all of their relevant arguments in a single easily understood post each, after which I can ask more staff members to evaluate them.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

I agree with Zamasu on this one.

 

[Zamasu_Chan]

Bump, please end my suffering.

 

[ByAsura]

I've just been doing other stuff, sorry, and I thought you were going to comment first.

It would probably be best if ByAsura and Zamasu respectively explain all of their relevant arguments in a single easily understood post each, after which I can ask more staff members to evaluate them.

Basically

• Asura punches Wyzen, making his body heat up massively.
• The heat spreads only up his arm and then slowly to his face.
• Wyzen explodes just after the head reaches his face, creating a horizontal blast that's a different direction to the vertical punch/heat and expands outwards.
• Notably, the epicentre of the explosion is shown twice to have occurred above Gaia, meaning the epicentre was not Wyzen's finger.

So, while Asura did kill Wyzen, the explosion created after appears to be a secondary reaction created by Wyzen's death and/or destruction.

It can't be some sort of fireball because the source and direction are different, and releases of kinetic energy don't just have some sort of delay that happens after. They occur at the same time, but the fireball is faster.

To me, the fact that this doesn't happen often in this game is just a bad excuse. There's also no example of Asura's punches having some kind of secondary effect ever again, and no real way that Asura's punch just randomly did this.

 

[Antvasima]

I've just been doing other stuff, sorry, and I thought you were going to comment first.

Basically

• Asura punches Wyzen, making his body heat up massively.
• The heat spreads only up his arm and then slowly to his face.
• Wyzen explodes just after the head reaches his face, creating a horizontal blast that's a different direction to the vertical punch/heat and expands outwards.
• Notably, the epicentre of the explosion is shown twice to have occurred above Gaia, meaning the epicentre was not Wyzen's finger.

So, while Asura did kill Wyzen, the explosion created after appears to be a secondary reaction created by Wyzen's death and/or destruction.

It can't be some sort of fireball because the source and direction are different, and releases of kinetic energy don't just have some sort of delay that happens after. They occur at the same time, but the fireball is faster.

To me, the fact that this doesn't happen often in this game is just a bad excuse. There's also no example of Asura's punches having some kind of secondary effect ever again, and no real way that Asura's punch just randomly did this.

Thank you.

Would you also be willing to write an explanation post, Zamasu? So I can ask more staff members to evaluate your arguments afterwards.

 

[Zamasu_Chan]

Would you also be willing to write an explanation post, Zamasu? So I can ask more staff members to evaluate your arguments afterwards.

I just want the staffs’ opinion on ByAsura’s Wyzen idea.

 

[Antvasima]

I just want the staffs’ opinion on ByAsura’s Wyzen idea.

Okay. No problem.

I've just been doing other stuff, sorry, and I thought you were going to comment first.

Basically

• Asura punches Wyzen, making his body heat up massively.
• The heat spreads only up his arm and then slowly to his face.
• Wyzen explodes just after the head reaches his face, creating a horizontal blast that's a different direction to the vertical punch/heat and expands outwards.
• Notably, the epicentre of the explosion is shown twice to have occurred above Gaia, meaning the epicentre was not Wyzen's finger.

So, while Asura did kill Wyzen, the explosion created after appears to be a secondary reaction created by Wyzen's death and/or destruction.

It can't be some sort of fireball because the source and direction are different, and releases of kinetic energy don't just have some sort of delay that happens after. They occur at the same time, but the fireball is faster.

To me, the fact that this doesn't happen often in this game is just a bad excuse. There's also no example of Asura's punches having some kind of secondary effect ever again, and no real way that Asura's punch just randomly did this.

@SomebodyData @Celestial_Pegasus @Wokistan @Mr._Bambu @Elizhaa @Qawsedf234

Would any of you be willing to help evaluate this please?

 

[Qawsedf234]

Would any of you be willing to help evaluate this please?

What are we supposed to be evaluating?

 

[Antvasima]

@ByAsura's suggestions apparently. Maybe he can explain further?

 

[Qawsedf234]

I get that, but I don't know what the argument is. Just his final conclusion on it.

 

[Antvasima]

What are we supposed to be evaluating?

@ByAsura's suggestions apparently. Maybe he can explain further?

I get that, but I don't know what the argument is. Just his final conclusion on it.

@ByAsura

Would you be willing to clarify further please?

 

[ByAsura]

Zamasu is arguing that Asura scales to the explosion here, I'm arguing that it's clearly a secondary explosion for various reasons.

 

[Antvasima]

Zamasu is arguing that Asura scales to the explosion here, I'm arguing that it's clearly a secondary explosion for various reasons.

@Qawsedf234

 

[Qawsedf234]

Just watching the video, unless there's some weird interaction I'm missing, it looks like Asura punched him a bunch and the guy exploded from that after a bit.

The thing I would have issue with is that it took Asura dozens of hits to actually preform the feat, not one, so he wouldn't scale to the full value.

 

[ByAsura]

It was one rage amped punch.

 

[Qawsedf234]

It was one rage amped punch.

He hit him dozens of times till the arms broken and then the final punch caused the explosion.

Unless you mean all of the previous punches contributed nothing to the final outcome.

 

[ByAsura]

Yeah, it was only the final punch that seems to have any non-superficial effect, though each did raise the temperature of that spot.

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Bump.

 

[Antvasima]

@Qawsedf234 @ByAsura

 

[Qawsedf234]

Yeah, it was only the final punch that seems to have any non-superficial effect, though each did raise the temperature of that spot.

If that's the case then I think he should scale then. The explosion is weird but it clearly was generated from Asura in my view.

 

[ByAsura]

I still strongly disagree with the feat/counters presented, but I’ll concede given the amount of people that disagree and so the thread can progress.

Idk, maybe someone could also fork over the guide book page for absolute confirmation if they want to.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you both for helping out.

Does anybody here have the relevant guide book page available?

 

[XSOULOFCINDERX]

Bump.

 

[Antvasima]

So should the consensus/conclusions here be applied then?

 

[Zamasu_Chan]

So should the consensus/conclusions here be applied then?

Good question. Does that mean everything including 3-A?

 

[Antvasima]

I do not remember well. It just seems like ByAsura conceded to the majority here.

 

[AKM sama]

Everything except 3-A. There are still contentions on it.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you for helping out, AKM. That is probably fine then.