Why Pikkon isn't 4-A, Janemba probably isn't, and I'm pretty sure neither is Super Gogeta.

[Pokémon_Trainer_Jacob]

Pikkon isn't 4-A, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ir21pC1jxKM Pikkon could do nothing against Kid Buu. You know how Kid Buu is 4-B and Pikkon should me billions of times stronger than him? Exactly. Pikkon isn't MSS since he can't stop Kid Buu and was actually afraid of him. Pikkon was blown back by Kid Buu and wasn't fast enough to react to him at all. Buu dodged every hit Pikkon threw at him.

Multi-Solar System level MFTL Pikkon? No.

He is 4-B and FTL+

Janemba should also be considered 4-B considering that (If I am correct) Potara is a more potent method of fusion than the Fusion Dance, and Vegito is only 4-B. (If I'm correct) Vegito should be stronger than Gogeta who is stonger than Janemba who stomped SSJ3 Goku who beat Fat Janemba.

Pikkon, Super Gogeta, and Janemba should all be nerfed to 4-B based on this alone.

Pikkon was only able to damage Janemba because he called him "A disgusting freak", and Janemba is weak to critisism.

These aren't 4-A characters, these are 4-B characters.

Oh and Hirudegarn while I'm at it, sir you were killed by SSJ3 Goku who is SS level, time to put you in your place (which is 4-B).

 

[SomebodyData]

You.... do know that Pikkon, Gogeta, Hirudegarn, and Janemba is based off non-canon feats? (Since they are non-canon)

Non-canon has MFTL+ and 4-A feats whereas canon Z (not Super) doesn't.

 

[Pokémon_Trainer_Jacob]

You.... do know that Pikkon,Gogeta, and Janemba is based of non-canon feats? (Since he is non canon)
Non-canon has MFTL+ and 4-A feats whereas canon Z (not Super) doesn't.

Well even then, Pikkon still lost to a pre Buu Saga Goku, who was only SS, so at least he deserves the nerf stick.

 

[SomebodyData]

Pre-Buu Saga Goku had fought Broly who had a 4-A feat and that Goku was at least on par with his Namek self (Other MFTL+ feat) and Bojack (Other MFTL+ feat)....

 

[Pokémon_Trainer_Jacob]

Pre-Buu Saga Goku had fought Broly who had a 4-A feat and that Goku was at least on par with his Namek self (Other MFTL+ feat) and Bojack (Other MFTL+ feat)....

Broly only "allegedly" destroyed parts of that Galaxy, so we can't be so sure if he is really 4-A, it's only an assumption, even if he is 4-A, Goku only won by PIS considering that he used the energy of incredibly weakened warriors in order to become that strong (somehow).

 

[Ryukama]

Pikkon, Super Gogeta, and Janemba should all be nerfed to 4-B based on this alone.

Yes Pikkon did do rather poorly against Janemba. But this is simply not true.

He harmed Janemba in the beginning of the fight with a kick and did not insult him while doing so.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_bgM6mcTjo

 

[Pokémon_Trainer_Jacob]

Pikkon, Super Gogeta, and Janemba should all be nerfed to 4-B based on this alone.

Yes Pikkon did do rather poorly against Janemba. But this is simply not true.
He harmed Janemba in the beginning of the fight with a kick and did not insult him while doing so.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_bgM6mcTjo

Clearly an outlier feat considering losing to a pre Buu Saga Goku who was only SSJ1, was stronger than Cell but not stronger than Buu, and SSJ3 Goku couldn't do anything against Janemba despite being superior to Pikkon who (somehow) harmed him with a kick.

Pikkon doing any damage to Janemba would easily be an outlier.

 

[Pokémon_Trainer_Jacob]

Also, we will have to continue this discussion tomorrow because I have to go to 6th hour right now and I have work immediately after school. I'll get you guys tomorrow to discuss this more.

 

[ZeoParadox]

They get scaled from 4-A anime Kid Buu...

 

[SomebodyData]

How could it be an outlier?

Mind you he casually two shotted SPC while massively restricted

 

[Jesterofgames]

Clearly an outlier feat considering losing to a pre Buu Saga Goku who was only SSJ1, was stronger than Cell but not stronger than Buu, and SSJ3 Goku couldn't do anything against Janemba despite being superior to Pikkon who (somehow) harmed him with a kick.

Pikkon doing any damage to Janemba would easily be an outlier.[/I]

UM You do realize that Pikkon Goku And The like NEVER STOP Training right

So saying

"OH he lost to Pre Buu saga Goku* Is kinda invalid because He's been training ever since them to get stronger and Fusion reborn Takes place at some point during the Buu saga

oh and like Data pointed out They Screwed up SPC a person who is solar system level

Heavily restricted

And SSJ goku Had to use a dangoures techniqe to match pikkon When he used SSJ Kio-ken (SSJ's strength and the Kio Ken multiplier which if you believe the SSJ multiples for some reason should average out at SSJ 2's power level)

heck if anything SSJ Goku beating Pikkon is an outlier Considering Goku was struggling against Cell And outright admitted Cell was stronger than him

Though Goku did beat Pikkon Because Of a Ring out And because Of tactic's

 

[Pokémon_Trainer_Jacob]

[snip]

Pikkon was still beat by Goku, and when they fought again in Fusion Reborn, BASE Goku was holding his own against Restricted Pikkon. Goku in Base in Buu Saga was Star Level iirc, there was no way he should've been able to hold his own against Pikkon if Pikkon was MSS, but here's why Pikkon isn't MSS, SSJ3 Goku is SS level, SSJ3 Goku is above Pikkon yet still couldn't beat Janemba. SSJ3 Goku (4-B) > Pikkon (who should be 4-B because of that alone).

 

[Jesterofgames]

First off

Still Casually decimated cell who was Solar system level

Second off Restricted pikkon matching base goku means absolutely nothing Because he wasn't going all Out If it was full pikkon going against all out goku then you might have had a point But judging pikkon while he's restricted isn't fair and doesn't give a clear indication of his full strength

 

[RadicalMrR]

I think we scale them from GT not Z.

 

[Ryukama]

I believe Z anime, movies and GT are considered the same "Toeiverse" timeline.

 

[Ryukama]

Also @DBfan I fixed the quoting.

 

[SomebodyData]

Again @Pkmn Trainer, you keep on scaling from canon Dragon Ball Z instead of Toeiverse (non-canon) which has different feats.

 

[Pokémon_Trainer_Jacob]

First off

Still Casually decimated cell who was Solar system level

Second off Restricted pikkon matching base goku means absolutely nothing Because he wasn't going all Out If it was full pikkon going against all out goku then you might have had a point But judging pikkon while he's restricted isn't fair and doesn't give a clear indication of his full strength

Even if he's restricted, he shouldn't become billions of times more powerful just because he took some clothes off. High End Solar System is billions of times stronger than Low End Solar System, Pikkon should still be 4-B.

 

[Pokémon_Trainer_Jacob]

Again @Pkmn Trainer, you keep on scaling from canon Dragon Ball Z instead of Toeiverse (non-canon) which has different feats.

So Non-Canon doesn't scale off of Canon?

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

No

 

[SomebodyData]

I'm pretty sure I've been repeating that for a while...

 

[Pokémon_Trainer_Jacob]

I'm pretty sure I've been repeating that for a while...

Well that's weird, but makes sense.

Let's just have someone close this out, I have to go to work.