Yan Sen Plot Manipulation Removal (Self-Evident)

[SweetDao]

Here's the Plot Manipulation justification on his profile for his standard key:

Plot Manipulation (Yan Sen says that he controls and organises everything in this world, which he drew on a scroll and sees as fiction. Yan Sen says that the fact that his disciples became the Demon King and the Ghost King was actually set by him, and that everything, including the abilities they used, was set by him. This means that Yan Sen controlled the story in this world from the beginning.)

Basically, Yan Sen sent two of his disciples in a world he created (he drew it, but that's beside the point), so the whole conflict, the factions, the weapons, people, skills,... Everything was set up by him. That's not Plot Manipulation, at most it's Creation and/or Pocket Reality Creation (even if said Pocket Reality is like more than galaxy-sized) and him creating an environment for his disciples to grow.

As said in the title, quite self-evident.

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Agree : KingNanaya, BestMGQScalerEver, Ruphas_Mafahl123, Reiner04, Dark_Soul20189, Quibster (fine with Text Manip), ashen (Fine with Text Manip), DarkDragonMedeus, TheGreatJedi13, Quintessence_PE


Disagree :

Neutral :

 

[KingNanaya]

I agree

 

[FriendOfTheTeaParty]

definitely not enough context for plot manip. nothing about an underlying narrative

 

[Reiner04]

Looks ok

 

[Livinmeme]

We have gone through this shit like 3 times, it is conceptual creation and manipulation, ******* hell, you weren't able to explain why there can't be conceptual creation other than "because I said so".

 

[Dark_Soul20189]

Yeah, this is an easy agreement from me.

 

[Wonder_of_Fantasy]

so the whole conflict, the factions, the weapons, people, skills,... Everything was set up by him. That's not Plot Manipulation,

This seem reasonable to me.

at most it's Creation and/or Pocket Reality Creation (even if said Pocket Reality is like more than galaxy-sized) and him creating an environment for his disciples to grow.

Creation is debatable in my eyes.

I feel as though the scope of things mentioned would safely land the aforementioned created things in Conceptual Manipulation. Being able to influence the conception of skills, people, and events of all things is abstract in and of itself - and I doubt Creation properly covers this alone. I don't share Livinmeme's exact sentiments. However, I can see where he's coming from with this being Conceptual Creation, etc.

That said, is there anymore material to go off of? Or is this it?

 

[SweetDao]

We have gone through this shit like 3 times, it is conceptual creation and manipulation, ******* hell, you weren't able to explain why there can't be conceptual creation other than "because I said so".

I don't even remember arguing with you... But well if we at least agree that it ISN'T plot, then that's good.

But well I think the whole conceptual manipulation is taken out of proportion. Yan Sen or heck, even you, yes you, could make the same events happen within the pocket world without the need to have "concept manipulation."

Could it be CM? Ig. Is it the privileged option? I don't think so.

 

[SweetDao]

That said, is there anymore material to go off of? Or is this it?

That's about it yeah. I could get the better translation for this scene if necessary though, not sure it will change anything though.

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

Will this affect the plot manip is his later keys? Since iirc has some narrative talk when fighting henry

 

[SweetDao]

Will this affect the plot manip is his later keys? Since iirc has some narrative talk when fighting henry

Nah, that much is fine (and I will defend it until my last breath)

 

[Ruphas_Mafahl123]

I agree. Altho didnt expect you to make the crt this fast

 

[ashen]

Here's the Plot Manipulation justification on his profile for his standard key:


Basically, Yan Sen sent two of his disciples in a world he created (he drew it, but that's beside the point), so the whole conflict, the factions, the weapons, people, skills,... Everything was set up by him. That's not Plot Manipulation, at most it's Creation and/or Pocket Reality Creation (even if said Pocket Reality is like more than galaxy-sized) and him creating an environment for his disciples to grow.

As said in the title, quite self-evident.

---
Agree : KingNanaya, BestMGQScalerEver


Disagree :

Neutral :

Agree with the fact that it isn’t plot manipulation there isn’t any elaboration on some sort of meta-fictional aspect governing reality, at least not in the used scan.

This seem reasonable to me.


Creation is debatable in my eyes.

I feel as though the scope of things mentioned would safely land the aforementioned created things in Conceptual Manipulation. Being able to influence the conception of skills, people, and events of all things is abstract in and of itself - and I doubt Creation properly covers this alone. I don't share Livinmeme's exact sentiments. However, I can see where he's coming from with this being Conceptual Creation, etc.

That said, is there anymore material to go off of? Or is this it?

well as long as it isn’t directly mentioned that he has manipulated concept or the character he created possess some sort of conceptual power tied to the world he created, it is not necessarily conceptual manipulation.

such a feat is achievable via other means such as many abilities of text manipulation that I see nice fitting the context (furthermore it is said to be his drawing and the scan show him performing some sort of « calligraphy » to illustrate his feat) :

• The materialization of the characters - the revival in the real world heroes to write a novel or foreign works.
• The materialization of the event - the ability to translate into reality the events recorded in text form.
• Create/modify the reality in the writing of books - translated into the reality of all the events recorded in the book (while accompanied by the creation of the new world), or the manipulation of the characters and events of the real world, comparable with that as a regular writer can manipulate the characters of his novel.

Those are mere proposals, pocket reality could be fine too

Basically his power is pocket reality and creation with a drawing skin, wich does fit well some applications text manipulation imo.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Looks alright

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

I agree as well

 

[Wonder_of_Fantasy]

well as long as it isn’t directly mentioned that he has manipulated concept or the character he created possess some sort of conceptual power tied to the world he created, it is not necessarily conceptual manipulation.

Yeah that makes sense I suppose.

such a feat is achievable via other means such as many abilities of text manipulation that I see nice fitting the context (furthermore it is said to be his drawing and the scan show him performing some sort of « calligraphy » to illustrate his feat) :

Those are mere proposals, pocket reality could be fine too

Basically his power is pocket reality and creation with a drawing skin, wich does fit well some applications text manipulation imo.

I agree. Text Manipulation makes more sense to me.

Edit: Pocket Reality seems fine too.

 

[Quintessence_PE]

looks good

 

[SweetDao]

bump

 

[Quintessence_PE]

bump

For a simple crt like this, 2 votes are enough

 

[SweetDao]

For a simple crt like this, 2 votes are enough

Since it's a high tier hax (Plot manip) and that you typically need 3 staff members to implement it, there's no harm into waiting for an additional staff. It's not like I'm in rush or anything.

 

[SweetDao]

Bump

 

[SweetDao]

sure

 

[SweetDao]

bump

 

[SweetDao]

bump

 

[Ikhvagracia]

Here's the Plot Manipulation justification on his profile for his standard key:


Basically, Yan Sen sent two of his disciples in a world he created (he drew it, but that's beside the point), so the whole conflict, the factions, the weapons, people, skills,... Everything was set up by him. That's not Plot Manipulation, at most it's Creation and/or Pocket Reality Creation (even if said Pocket Reality is like more than galaxy-sized) and him creating an environment for his disciples to grow.

As said in the title, quite self-evident.

---
Agree : KingNanaya, BestMGQScalerEver, Ruphas_Mafahl123, Reiner04, Dark_Soul20189, Quibster (fine with Text Manip), ashen (Fine with Text Manip), DarkDragonMedeus, TheGreatJedi13, Quintessence_PE


Disagree :

Neutral :

fine then

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Agree

 

[ZERGESS]

Reasonable enough

 

[Viott]

I agree