Nah, it's okay if you disagree. I'm just tired rn.
Those four shades are literally the projections/avatars of Phanes himself, like they almost not a different person. They only had different authorities to govern.
Are not like you said.
Yeah, i think.
Well, the opposition only thinks it's just Law Manipulation and nothing else.
We're talking about the boundaries of them (Life, Death, Time and Space), which indeed did not exist prior to their rule. And of course, including the concept of fate which is the Constellations/Stella Fortuna.
The core of my argument is actually in this my point, where initially these concepts were not differentiated because there were no boundaries that separated them, it was the heavenly gods who defined these concepts so that boundaries were created and the current reality is very different from ancient times, the current reality is standing on concepts that have changed because they have been defined or simply the current reality is in a position above the differentiated concepts.
But they’re not.
We're talking about the boundaries of them (Life, Death, Time and Space), which indeed did not exist prior to their rule. And of course, including the concept of fate which is the Constellations/Stella Fortuna.
For example, Life and Death: A “boundary” between Life and Death is not a wall or energy field something like that, it’s a conceptual distinction that determines what counts as "alive" or "dead" in the first place. Because to the Moon Sisters, "Life" and "Death" are not different whatsoever just as Sandrone said before.
That’s a hallmark of conceptual-level manipulation, by affecting reality at the level of its underlying definitions, by defining what is A and what is B and makes the distinction between them.
Furina has given good example regarding it.
Four Shades Boundary/Conceptual Manipulation
Could you reply to where you addressed it? Nah, it's okay if you disagree. I'm just tired rn. But the authorities were created by phanes so if anything i could only see phanes having it Those four shades are literally the projections/avatars of Phanes himself, like they almost not a...vsbattles.com
So, using this logic, a character who can make everything become one (Fusionism) and someone with Fissionism (i.e., the ability to differentiate things that were once one into separate entities) would get CM, which isn’t the case, Since, in this context, it seems to be referring to the things themselves rather than some underlying governing concept.
That's kinda false, and it seems like you just focus on this splitting things. They are explicitly establishing the abstract governing distinctions and boundaries ot Life, Death, Time, Space that define reality itself, which is manipulation of the underlying concepts not just their physical manifestations.
I hope.
has nothing to do at all with fusionism
I mean, your argument mostly focuses on that. As far as I can see, all the other mentions of “concept” are pretty vague, more like everyday uses of the term.
Yeah, it isn’t physical, “boundaries” here refer to rules and laws that limit how things work, if you read the scan more properly. So there’s no conceptual manipulation there.
True, it was just an example. With Fusionism, I can destroy the boundaries of life and death, space and time by making them become one. Therefore, by that logic, I would have conceptual destruction.
The page on fusionism mentions that concepts can be fused, but the point here is that what the Heavenly Principles did is neither fusionism nor fissionism. Here, ‘limits’ refers to structuring the functioning of aspects of the world.
So law manipulation?
| The ability to manipulate "laws" that automatically apply themselves upon reality, referring to rules, mandates and even fundamental logical principles/truths/facts that are the way in which a reality may function |
I mean.. not really? The game itself have already said that the concept of time is one of the rules of the world. Those are explicitly primordial laws, reality-defining distinctions whose prior nonexistence and subsequent imposition demonstrate governance over the underlying structure of existence itself.
As AsterReal said above. Those laws define how fundamental aspects of reality (Life, Death, Time, Space) can exist and interact, so establishing them from a prior state of nonexistence is the imposition of the very concepts that govern reality, not just passive regulation.
It is important to understand the context presented by the OP. this discussion has no relation to fusionism or any concept of unification. Fundamental concepts such as life, death, space, and time have existed since the very beginning. However, in their initial state, these concepts were not yet differentiated, they had no clear boundaries and could not be distinguished from one another.
