Yeah the verse is scaled pretty bad. Ayanokouji is one of the most analytical characters in fiction, he knows his own limits but for some reason they want him to be physically superior to every single character when that's not how he was written and the way the verse is now handicaps him and creates contradictions with his narrative and even the abilities he has and why he has them
Except lots of contradictions
All terms force, energy and pressure can be used to indicate damage, there's no demarcation between them at least in fictional terms.
I already said how authors aren't powerscalers. COTE by the way, isn't the only verse you can go against if you are trying to imply that there should be an "exact" usage of terms. And none of what this thread says somehow goes against your "want to get a character as high as possible based on misinterpreted terms", it in fact goes against canonical feats and tries to exploit absolutely NO PROBLEMS which COTE has as of now, all of the incoherences which were present in COTE have either been retconned with actual feats and showdowns between characters, or have been substantially explained enough to not be believable by the story itself.
Big Show and Roman Reigns are real people, and they don't have largely high differences between them to the point where they can "blitz" each other of massively stomp each other in AP. I already showed how COTE has characters who can blitz each other, so yes, none of this actually adds up.
You never proved me incorrect, I already remember like 3 times (the part where you thought a certain statement is said for Kiyotaka instead of Ryuuen when you can just get it correct if you read the ENTIRE page lmfao, the alleged "Nanase can blitz Kiyotaka" thing which is a standard incoherence in your response itself and means that Nanase is somehow too dumb to actually not be able to beat someone whom she can actually "blitz" - the scan never said that she can blitz him, and Albert durability thing which Albert HIMSELF DISAGREED with in Year 2 like a 10 volumes later).
One or two of those scans are from translations which are not official, so I don't blame him, I also pointed them out in my response if YOU DID "READ" IT.
I am not even going in circles, you are, lmfao. What you have said throughout the thread isn't the first time it has been talked about on the wiki.
Yeah, and you also use the interpretations from the same YT videos too, type something REAL and something which you yourself believe in.
He's a human with abnormal physiology, which has been proven more than just a single time in the verse. (And I also said it like thrice in my entire response to the OP if you did "read" it LMFAO.)
The "0.001 percent" exaggeration to make it seem bad... hmm? No, Kiyotaka ultimately blitzed and neg-diffed a character like Ichika who blitzed and neg-diffed both Suzune and Ibuki while being in a state where she canonically shouldn't even be able to walk properly and fought with both of them on the brink of collapse. Ichika also took attacks from Ibuki which didn't make her get immediate "concussion", and the OP uses an obvious plot deception statement where Kiyotaka mentions about him getting concussion from a single attack of Ibuki while all of what I typed earlier EXISTS.
. And yeah, the OP thinks that a character who was going to receive this kind of treatment (Ibuki) can oneshot Kiyotaka LMFAO.Yeah, because they are popular and people have fortunately taken their times to read their series, unlike COTE where you can see a thread every 10 days with things you probably don't even know happened in the novels as a novel reader.
Thread so bad even Doggo had to respond. Hard agree (love you lots broo
).
This is not the place to debate this. I highly suggest you make a separate thread for this topic. This thread is for the actual gap between Ayanokoji and the other characters. You are discussing impact or kinetic energy, which has nothing to do with this thread.
I already said all of this. Deceleration is just acceleration in opposite direction. Fiction showing deformations in solids is an inelastic collision as some (or all) energy is lost in causing deformation.
Now of course, perfectly inelastic collision is an ideal situation, but in fiction, when powerscaling, we calculate the kinetic energy which caused deformation, of course, some of the initial kinetic energy may be lost as heat or other energy media, but that's not what we concern with.
I don't even know how to respond to this but here we go.
Yes, they have the same dimensional formulae, but they differ in units and by core, definition. It's like saying work done (J) is torque (Nm) because they have the same dimensional formulae. This is NOT TRUE. We do use J/cc values but they are based on actual research studies like listed on the calculations page, but THEY are not same values made by interchanging the units.You should have added works like "necessarily", but...
Actually bad, I have made way more arguments than just the "terminologies" thing.
First of all, Torque is a vector while energy is scalar.Practically... Fragmentation values (J/cc) aren't values of Tensile or Yield Strength (GPa or MPa) because fragmentation values work at the fracture point while the latter works in the cases measuring pure deformation, no fractures or breakages in objects. So, don't even mix both of them.
THIS IS SO BAD. J/cc values aren't based on MPa and GPa. They just have the same dimensions, and you can say that they have interchangeable units (I still don't recommend doing it). But same dimensions is not being the SAME PHYSICAL QUANTITY. OR the J/cc values don't become a "basis" for the MPa or GPa values.
Obviously, because once you collide, it results in impact force regardless of whether you were accelerating or not. Force = Δp / Δt. Extreme deceleration means low duration. Moving on constant speed or not, it barely changes anything.
That doesn't mean anything, nor does it justify dismissing some of the terms just because you think they're inaccurate.
This is NOT the PLACE for THIS.
It had to do something with invalid arguments which I "tried" to point out. I wasn't trying to start an argument as much as I was trying to point out some of the invalid points that were used (because it ends up in pointless stacking of arguments which barely help the situation instead of pointing out more direct flaws in the suggested changes).
Bro. The OP is talking about the scaling chain. The calcs have NOTHING to do with this
The funny thing is that I just chose to give an example regarding how authors shouldn't be strictly put under skepticism for their terminology usage and used the example of how they use the term "force" to describe an attack through which we calculate AP and then he went on like some responses to explain to me about how every "attack" is a "result" of force so it's ok to use the term "force" for an attack and then went into a debate of physics with me.
Half of this is just punching the wall and the other half of this is just stuff repeated, give actual links from the internet because seeing your physics sentences make your claims seem extraordinary.
I don't disagree but this doesn't support your proposition in the slightest...
Albert himself disagreed with the fact that Kiyotaka was giving it his all, and I did see you repeating that argument.
All yappy statements from a dude infamous for being an unreliable narrator in the light novel community
An excerpt from Y1 VOL7
Actually I haven't been on the site in days and I already said I wasn't about to argue the same points 30 times because even now you proved my points for the 10th time
His hand was never broken, you can't break your hand from being stabbed, the nerves and tendens can be damaged but a broken hand comes from the knuckles breaking, and you once again prove my point that the only thing he is superior physically is lifting strength. You keep sending all of these insults but literally prove my points every single time to the point you guys even sent my scans while claiming the ones I sent were fan made
You are once again proving my point . PHYSICALLY no one stands above the rest besides Albert. Nobody can one shot Albert yet because of the statements being African American, Ayanokouji stated as well as him punching him full power doing nothing, while everyone else can be one shot by different characters due to them being Japanese and similar
You are once again having an experience conversation. She is PHYSICALLY inferior which was stated. To argue source material is disingenuous and incorrect, and calling it fan translation to cover it makes it even worse.
Ryuuen is a teenager in school. Tsukishiro and Shiba are the adults, and btw Koji said they hit harder than him, which I clearly put in the scaling chain under the ATTACK POTENCY section, further making my point again. So Again this is just a layer of my scaling chain being proven again
Notice you specified physically. You prove my point by the own story. Albert is physically superior yet works under Ryuuen because overall he is inferior. Which is exactly what Ryuuen said about Ayanokouji when Albert said Housen could beat Ayanokouji. Which is also in my debunk above, somehow everything your saying is making my point. Because my points are consistent with every character, yours are based around Ayanokouji.
The scans are right there, why do you keep asking why I'm mentioning these people when they are specifically being mentioned in context with what I'm saying, it's like you're responding without even looking at the scans because you know it proves my points
This is literally my point its a circular chain because NO ONE scales above the other physically and the difference comes in with how well they are TRAINED. The biggest separation comes in LIFTING STRENGTH, EXPERIENCES and STAMINA. So once again for the 12th time you are proving my point man lol
You do realize you haven't rebuttalled a single thing I said I actually said and just keep repeating the same things? Like you still haven't addressed the facts Y'all called my scans fan translations while also sending the exact same scans with the exact statements I posted in them, proving I never sent fan translations, and was a blatant lie to purposely spread misinformation
No. Logic would be to admit Ayanokouji isnt physically superior he is simply smarter and more skilled which was the point of the white room. They didn't create super soldiers.
His words align with what happens in my scaling chain so I can't ignore detailed information. That would be disingenuous and misinforming people about how this verse works
He is equal OVERALL in terms comparing them as STUDENTS. Both were student council presidents that doesn't mean they have the same AP and durability, Manabu becomes inferior when you include the training experience. Manabu is a black belt, Nagumo is not. Which is why he would not be Manabus equal in a fight, only in status as the president of student council. This is not a martial arts light novel, you guys think those statements mean they are talking about physical fighting stats and they are talking about school life, which is 75% if the story. Combat is secondary which is why you keep confusing these statements
No this would not be the scaling chain. Manabu was never stated he punches harder than Koji, he simply has higher AP than Koji's durability and less AP than Alberts Durability, which scales above EVERYONE due to Koji's statements.
Albert is only equal in physical lifting strength which was stated in my OP and all the times it was stated. Albert is superior in AP as Housen has the same AP as Ayanokouji based on Alberts own words and Albert punch caused Ayanokouji pain after he blocked it, which hasn't happened no other times he caught a punch, meaning he punches harder. This also applies to Tuskishiro and Shiba who Ayanokouji said has more punch power than him which is also in my OP. My points are consistent that's why I can keep repeating them easily without getting confused. Everything I said is listed above already.
You keep confusing equals as students as equals as fighters. Nagumo has never even got in an actual fight to even be scaled. He only got punched and KO which likely means he has similar physicals as the others Koji one shot, or Koji himself too because Manabu can do it. That's my entire point. NO ONE stands out physically besides Albert in terms of AP and durability. All of this was already explained in full detail .
This proves Ayanokouji has superior Lifting Strength to the verse if he started back his white room regime. Current Koji is relative to Housen and Koenji, making past Koji LS STRONGER than his current self and the characters I mentioned, which was also mentioned in my scaling chain. Notice nothing in saying has to be edited into my OP Post, because it's the actual consistent scaling chain.
No, we listen to his unreliable narration when he tells us it's unreliable and inconsistent. He isn't unreliable in serious situations because he himself doesn't like to lose and will tell you once he is getting serious and still is struggling with something, calling it unreliable once more after he explicitly tells you to now listen to him defeats the purpose of him even specifying it.
How does Ichika beating 2 non White room people and being heavily injured from It contradict it when it actually proves the point even more? The current narrative is White room is superior to the point they shouldn't even be touched by normal students and at most low diff them like Koji dif, yet kushida could hurt her, and Ibuki and Horkita beat her down with simple teamwork. And I thought white room students had insane stamina? Doesn't this prove even more the narrative is bad and their over scaled? That actually proves Ryuuen gang is superior because
Horikita nor Ibuki have high stats to begin with in terms of speed so that really isn't saying much. Koji blitzing her and Koji having abnormal reactions is better justification
Or we listen to the hundreds of other statements that further contextualize everything and not just reading at face value. The problem is you guys are confusing these words
Sorry, what?
Wow, how does Kiyotaka's "limited" (and not "infinite") prove your points?
I deadass did the Higuruma pose when he still continued btw
It's literally in my OP. This is how I know you guys are just disagreeing regardless of what is said to protect a headcannon narrative, because I established this in the first opening of my post and here it is again: Ayanokouji and Tsukishiro agree that there are Non white room people as talented as white room members. Tsukishiro even says there is talent the white room cant even produceSorry, what?
When was this ever established?
Once again please stop saying stuff is reconned when it isn't. Where the story is currently is a continuation of where it started. This is once again another attempt at spreading misinformation to protect a narrative which is actually against the rules I believe. Also human limitations is not "unreliable narration" it's him telling you his LIMITS which he does routinely you simply are not comprehending which I already proven when you didn't understand the difference between physical strength and physical capabilities. The narrative is only "unreliable" because you guys keep making up your own narrative of him and dismissing the CANON narrative he is telling you which forces the confusion.
You notice how you have to focus on one statement that is likely not what you said based on how much you guys have spread misinformation here and there to make a poiny while I have nearly 100 scans to prove mine, to the point I can organize them in order and it validates the other statements above and beneath them? This is because you are not comprehending what's being said properly and creating a false narrative that doesn't stay consistent with him or the other characters. You cannot say "White room students are massively stronger than ANHS " when multiple statements prove the opposite, and then you just call it "unreliable". No, that would make your explanation unreliable.
It does when that was literally the context provided for why Ayanokouji used it and went further to even say no Japanese person can be that durable because of his specific genetics. He punched him full power and said he dealt shallow damage, then attacked weak points to bypass it. Calling it anything else than what's stated is headcannon.
Yet has never done this. He punched Nagumo in the chest. Not a pressure point. He slammed Ibuki head on the ground. Not a pressure point. However, someone with 1 of 1 genetics at his school he used pressure points and explains to us why he did it. Anything else is a headcanons.
Again, he explains explicitly why he used pressure points. Lack of damage when using conventional punches. Anything else is headcannon.
He said he had to take "Emergency evasive action" while in mid thought. Meaning while he was watching her and in his thoughts he had to stop to focus because she nearly caught him off guard with her speed which was twice as fast as before. None of what you are arguing can be argued because it's literally stated. Saying "oh well year 1 was reconned" because you don't agree doesn't work here.Not to mention that a chief point of your thread is Nanase BEING ABLE TO BLITZ Kiyotaka. Just don't.
His limitation is peak human, while the current narrative is he has superhuman stamina. Never mentioned anything about infinite stamina, he just doesn't qualify for superhuman. He can't even take blows to the head with weapons from Ibuki or Suzune, which goes into why he fights so evasive to avoid damage accumulation. See how my earlier points still apply here? It's because my scaling chain is consistent with the story and his abilities and tactics.
He very much is not the most superior physically. Just the most skilled and comparable in LS to guys larger than him.
What I'm noticing is these guys are a "team" and they just cosign each other and disagree with anyone who attempts to debunk the verse. Ngl I still haven't have a single person show me "official" scans to prove mine were "fan translations" which makes me believe these guys are purposely lying in this thread, and is against the rules.
I am a cote supporter. Doesn't mean I will purposely spread misinformation and lie to protect a character I support when someone is providing proof that the verse needs cleaning, even if the character is my favorite. You told me I was posting fan translations and then posted the same scans. That was an attack on my character and was unprovoked.Bro clearly does not know what supporters are
The OP showcases unfamiliarity with the verse in question by using gag scenes to scale characters
A stabbed hand is obviously gonna be weaker than a healthy hand
???? I never said Manabu said that, I said you claimed Manabu can one-shot Koji via a statement Koji made.
What statements say Albert is equal in lifting strength or is above Hosen in AP? The series never makes a distinction between the two, so every time it is said someone is stronger or equal in strength, we just assume both because the series never specifies which strength they really meant.
What? This does NOT contradict what I said and has nothing to do with what I'm trying to say
???? Manabu is repeatedly hyped to be above everyone in Y1, including Albert. So Koji one-shotting Manabu's equal, who should be above Albert too, quite literally makes you point nonsense
??? Idk with you, but Koji saying Ryuen's gang is physically superior to her....when an exhausted Ichika was outwrestling Ibuki...who is part of Ryuen's gang...along with Horikita...someone confident with beating Sudo....who is equal to Ryuen.....um lowkey shats on what you said.
You don't understand the analogy
Show me that statement
????
"Koji claims Manabu could one-shot him."
Said school life includes physical exams. Nagumo had also wanted to race against Manabu, but Koji took that spot. It's clear they are physical equals
What? I'm clearly using Current Koji in that scaling chain. Read again:
Brother, MF does not even make us know if he is lying. So everything he says is inherently unreliable lmao.
WHen you have "supporters" who have an invested agenda in keeping a certain narrative they will argue to make sure it stays as such. I provided a lengthy explanation for every point I made only to get insulted, and lied on multiple times to the point someone said I used "fan translations" then used the same scans I used when they responded, which tells me it's a investment for them to keep the verse this way.
Classroom of the elite is not a gag light novel, also you guys want commenters to also believe the anime only scenes is more reliable than source material from the light novel. If the feat proves Ayanokouji limits you call it "unreliable narration" but if you can misinterpret a statement to make the verse upscale, you will use it. That's a concentrated effort to create a false narrative about the verse when the entire context shows the opposite, and instead of admitting you're wrong, you say it got "reconned" and this is why the thread is so long. It's the same 4 guysThe OP showcases unfamiliarity with the verse in question by using gag scenes to scale characters
Dont lie. I was keeping track of you. You were online. I even made the 30 minute ago remark.
This just pissed me.
Bro....they accused for using a gag scene not that verse is a gag series. The series does have gag momments due to comedy. You completely missed the point
Ok.
Already replied to countless times, talent =/= current abilities.
I don't think I even need to provide an analytical proof on the fact that the author has retconned or made stuff clearer, it's not something needing an analysis but is simply a raw scan to break everything you said.
Y2V10 completely retcons it, I am never re-iterating. Either you actually try to reply to my first response with actual arguments or just give up.
LMFAO, so he punched Nagumo in the chest and not a pressure point? Let's take a look:
I never disagreed. I only disagreed with the fact that he was giving it his all. Maybe with normal physiology, he was giving it his all, but his true power which originates with an abnormal source was never exerted in the scene.
Yeah, but she still never "blitzed" him like you mentioned. And him needing to take an emergency evasive action doesn't prove crap. Not only does it only prove that all she did was make him a little more serious, but the later fight just makes it clear that he was still just playing around.
His superhuman stamina is NOT DUE TO NARRATIVES (I am crying
). Narratives only make like 20% of it, his superhuman stamina rating is due to HIS ACTUAL feats. 
He is the most superior physically, and no diffs the rest of the cast.
Trust me, I've asked every mod imaginable to review and conclude this thread simply because they wouldn't stop insulting me and accusing me of stuff that's not true. They even said I used fan translations just to use the same scans in the response. All of this is in the thread and @Robo432343 and @UnstoppableObject we're here to see it happen.
Just for context I sent this yesterday to avoid what unfolded today
