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Big beerus revision
- Thread starter CryptonBestDbFan
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Exactly, it doesn't get any better than that.
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I didn't say it wasn't canon, but like with the rejected Dr Slump CRT trying to make the DB Earth 4 billion kilometers in circumference, it seems we're scaling Beerus to a one off gag feat from multiple decades ago just for the sake of an upgrade.
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I agree with this sentiment.
DivineAura44
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Can you show me where this was accepted? Hakai energy and ki are 2 different things so that doesn't make sense as far as I know.
Excellence616
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Except you wanna upgrade The Angels, G.O.D and Hakai users to 5D since Hax=AP. I suggest this be a gag for Beerus or an outlier.
DivineAura44
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Who exactly is this statement aimed at?
Excellence616
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The OP
DivineAura44
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They didn't make proposals for who scales other than Beerus afaik.
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I understand what you're saying, but if we accept that the crossover is canon, then dismissing it as a 'gag' doesn't seem like a strong counter argument to me because it's a scene directly introduced to us in Dragon Ball Super.
Please don't send multiple messages to the thread without even forming a more coherent argument. I don't want to sound rude, but I think you're overdoing it a bit now.
No, there is no such situation in Dragon Ball. Can you provide a relevant title that has been accepted regarding this?
Excellence616
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What affect Beerus will affect most DB Characters because of DB UES rule
Excellence616
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Special Ki Manipulation (Dragon Ball)
Ki (気 "Ki", lit. "Spirit"), also known as Chi/Qi, Yōki (妖気) or simply Energy (エネルギー 'enerugī'), is a famous and central power in the Dragon Ball franchise. In the Dragon Ball Heroes multiverse, Ki is expanded into many more unique, special types of Ki, used by different beings, races which is...
vsbattles.fandom.com
Try reading the Rules and Regulations of what ever verse you are defending.
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That's especially a outlier in terms of power hierarchy since the Omni King is massively above beerus and has a 5D feat.
DivineAura44
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That's for Ki. Ki and Hakai energy are 2 different energies. Regardless only Belmod, Goku, Jiren, Broly, the Angels. Still I think Beerus and Beerus alone should scale if this hypothetical went through.
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Plus, there's still that hyperbole about Jiren being superior to all the Gods of Destruction combined.
Making Jiren, Goku and company low 1-C
Excellence616
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Power of Destruction (破壊の力 Hakai no Chikara) is an incredibly powerful, specialized godly power, utilized by Gods of Destruction and those trained in their ways
Special Ki Manipulation (Dragon Ball)
Ki (気 "Ki", lit. "Spirit"), also known as Chi/Qi, Yōki (妖気) or simply Energy (エネルギー 'enerugī'), is a famous and central power in the Dragon Ball franchise. In the Dragon Ball Heroes multiverse, Ki is expanded into many more unique, special types of Ki, used by different beings, races which is...
vsbattles.fandom.com
Killerdrone123
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It is in special ki manipulation page for heroes also in general discussion thread it was told to me it is a ues
DivineAura44
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It's likely that it just meant Jiren > over the G.o.Ds.
Vietthai96
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i don't care about this thread, but they both UES
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Special Ki Manipulation (Dragon Ball)
Ki (気 "Ki", lit. "Spirit"), also known as Chi/Qi, Yōki (妖気) or simply Energy (エネルギー 'enerugī'), is a famous and central power in the Dragon Ball franchise. In the Dragon Ball Heroes multiverse, Ki is expanded into many more unique, special types of Ki, used by different beings, races which is...
Try reading the Rules and Regulations of what ever verse you are defending.
bro..
DivineAura44
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Aren't they different energy systems though?
Nullflowerblush
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Vietthai96
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funny enough, while on the surface they are different, in manga Goku without possessing Hakai energy can perform hakai in SSB and UI, Vegeta transform into Ultra Ego boosted his power and allow him to have access to hakai, which implied Hakai is tied with Ki, or at least God Ki, which still Ki anyway
DivineAura44
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It's a type of energy for sure but it certainly isn't Ki and has no proof of the power of said energies to even be correlated afaik. For all we know, Giin could be weaker than Beerus but have stronger destructive energy.
DivineAura44
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Do we have proof neither of them had destructive energy?
Vietthai96
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how i gonna prove thing that isn't there to begin with??, if anything what need to be proved is Goku has hakai energy or not, vegeta got it later after training with Beerus in manga
DivineAura44
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Like a statement which says they don't have it? If you are gonna provide them not having destructive energy as evidence then you have to substantiate your claim.
Vietthai96
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like what???, literally throughout the series nothing stated Goku has hakai energy, i can't prove thing that not exist, if anything, you need to prove the opposite, your argument is exactly like you need something stated character A can't destroy planet to prove he can't destroy the planet
DivineAura44
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You clearly are confused so let me explain.
I stated that Hakai Energy and Ki aren't the same energy and there is no proof that their levels in power are correlated.
You then state that Goku & Vegeta don't have destructive energy but still have Hakai, there (These are manga only occurrences because only Gods have Hakai energy in the anime where the feat occured but I let them slide for the sake of argument.)
From this point, if you are gonna make the claim that Goku and Vegeta don't have destructive energy therefore Hakai is tied to God energy, you must prove that Goku & Vegeta have destructive energy. This can be through a statement where Goku and Vegeta are stated to not have it or any other forms of evidence (I can't think of any off the top of my head). Until then, the burden of proof doesn't fall on me.
Vietthai96
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there is nothing proved or stated that Goku has Hakai energy yet he still pulled out Hakai in god form, Vegeta has it after Beerus specifically train him Hakai
Heroes Goku also pulled out Hakai like his manga counterpart, but it is game verse so not really relevant anyway
DivineAura44
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You are going circular. Once again, if you are making the claim that Goku doesn't have Hakai energy, you need to prove it beyond a shadow of a doubt.
Vietthai96
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i don't going circular, literally they are the evidences, it time for you to prove the opposite
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What exactly is the contradiction here? Outlier is probably the most overused & unhelpful term know to man. Is there no other explanations that can have this feat exist other than calling it a contradiction?
& wouldn't worst case scenario be they have that power but shitty range? If the hakai = power is in effect? Idek if that's accepted for canon. But I'm more inclined to just say hakai hax & the Toon Force resistance would be 5D.
Plus assuming it is contradicted in canon. Couldn't it still work for heroes?
& wouldn't worst case scenario be they have that power but shitty range? If the hakai = power is in effect? Idek if that's accepted for canon. But I'm more inclined to just say hakai hax & the Toon Force resistance would be 5D.
Plus assuming it is contradicted in canon. Couldn't it still work for heroes?
DivineAura44
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Ignoring the rest but I'll respond to this.
1. No one wants that, even if that is the worst case. 5D is kinda crazy regardless of bad range or not. Plus characters with attacks equal in strength but longer with length will benefit.
2. Heroes depends on the main canon so if it is contradicted in the main canon, it doesn't apply in Heroes.
DivineAura44
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You are, you are repeating the exact same argument that I need to prove it. It's your claim, so it's your burden.
GarrixianXD
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I wouldn't even consider it as an outlier since all of this lore came from a gag manga. The physics wouldn't even be matching.
Vietthai96
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your demand is just nitpicking that i need to show statement that Goku do not possesses hakai energy, i already gave the evidences of him do not have it, so this is just pointless back and forth and not really matter in this thread
Anyway i need to sleep now
DivineAura44
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Shouldn't we just make Dr. Slump not have the same cosmology then?
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