Bleach- PTS Speed Downgrade

[SilentBob34]

@Damage, I apologize for bringing up more Ichigo related stuff instead of everyone but I’ll talk about them too. But if we’re waiting for the final volume to be released, for the time being I think we should also focus on Ichigo blitzing Candice and the other girls when he arrived in seireitei. I feel it’s only fair to include that feat with everything.

 

[Damage3245]

We can't focus on every single feat. Let's try to keep as much of the scaling intact where possible while we're updating the ratings. We already said we'd have a new thread to discuss new feats.

 

[Tyri456]

Here's the justifications from a few Novel characters:

Grimmjow: (Dodged a Getsuga Tenshō from Ginjo at point-blank, dodged a Gran Rey Cero from Luppi by a hair's breadth by changing its trajectory with his own Cero), higher with Resurrección

Ginjo: (Dodged multiple attacks from Candice, kept up with Grimmjow and Tokinada, evaded Luppi’s Gran Rey Cero), higher with Bankai

Luppi: (Kept up with Grimmjow)

Does this seem a bit circular to anyone else? Grimmjow is getting his scaling from Ginjo and Luppi and Ginjo and Luppi are either partially or fully getting their scaling from Grimmjow.

Grimmjow scale to base Urahara

 

[Damage3245]

Grimmjow scale to base Urahara

How so?

 

[Tyri456]

Urahara get Blitzed by Grimmjow. He could not see Grimmjow killing Quilge, and could not see him approaching him.
Also, Askin doesnt get speed boost in his Vollstanding form. We do not assume speed boost unless it is shown or stated, neither it is a bankai or resurreccion.

 

[Damage3245]

Urahara get Blitzed by Grimmjow. He could not see Grimmjow killing Quilge, and could not see him approaching him.

Nowhere is Urahara shown to be blitzed by him. He wasn't in a fighting condition anyway, and the reason for him not seeing Grimmjow could be due to Grimmjow's attack concealing him.

Also, Askin doesnt get speed boost in his Vollstanding form. We do not assume speed boost unless it is shown or stated, that's actually what we apply for every charachters.

If he's shown to have more impressive speed in his Vollstandig form, which he does via feats.

AND PLEASE, let's try and get the novel characters over and done with, yeah?

 

[Tyri456]

Nowhere is Urahara shown to be blitzed by him. He wasn't in a fighting condition anyway, and the reason for him not seeing Grimmjow could be due to Grimmjow's attack concealing him.

what does that even mean? he could not see him, and he didnt saw him 2 times in a row.
At least they scale to be relative to each other

 

[Damage3245]

You can bring up brand new feats for scaling in the next thread. Let's concentrate on making sure the ratings are right for now.

 

[Tyri456]

We can not fix grimmjow but we can fix ichigo? I think that if we are going to not discuss the scaling than we should leave the scaling as it is and update just the ratings.

Either way the scaling is:

quilge < base grimmjow = urahara (should be added) = ginjo = luppi < res grimmjow = base hikone

if that is what you wanted

 

[Damage3245]

I think we should keep the scaling for now as:

Candice = Ginjo = Grimmjow = Luppi

And work from there.

 

[Tyri456]

can you put the value for mhs and mhs+? It should be easier to understand

 

[Damage3245]

For now, until we can possibly calc some feats or go through them in greater detail, I'm suggesting we scale Ginjo to Mach 1294 (MHS+) via Candice's lightning.

Assuming the same for Grimmjow, we'd then get Res Grimmjow to be Mach 6470 (MHS+) which scales to Hikone.

Hikone would then end up as Mach 32350 (Sub-Rel), possibly Mach 161750 (Rel) through his two multipliers.

 

[Tyri456]

Grimmjow should safely scale to mach 1852 instead of mach 1294.

 

[Damage3245]

Grimmjow should safely scale to mach 1852 instead of mach 1294.

Okay. Let's scale him to that then. Ratings that I mentioned up above get upped a tier except Hikone's last multiplier which is still Rel.

 

[Cyberblader90]

For now, until we can possibly calc some feats or go through them in greater detail, I'm suggesting we scale Ginjo to Mach 1294 (MHS+) via Candice's lightning.

Assuming the same for Grimmjow, we'd then get Res Grimmjow to be Mach 6470 (MHS+) which scales to Hikone.

Hikone would then end up as Mach 32350 (Sub-Rel), possibly Mach 161750 (Rel) through his two multipliers.

that works very nicely if the godspeed thing gets accepted. should note hikone's godspeed doesnt have to be baseline lightspeed. It can be high end rel+ and the scene still works

 

[SilentBob34]

@Damage, who’s left to discuss?

 

[Damage3245]

@Damage, who’s left to discuss?

I think these updates just need to be applied to Ginjo/Grimmjow/Luppi/Hikone and that's pretty much it.

There's also the Quincy girls, but their speed feats listed on their profiles for the novel are just "reaction" feats against a character who is apparently superior to them.

 

[Tyri456]

You should add the profiles in the sandbox firstly with those rating (mach 1852)

We continue tommorow Damage, I have to go to sleep

 

[Tyri456]

The scaling should be Res Hikone (mach 231.500)

Then Bankai kenpachi (mach 1.157.500) = TS Ichigo

Then the TB Ichigo at x5

And the scaling should be pretty much done

 

[SilentBob34]

@Tyri456 i do agree with that scaling, I’m just not sure if true shikai Ichigo would scale to Mach 231500 or to Bankai Kenpachi’s Mach 1,157,500

 

[Damage3245]

He wouldn't be scaling to Bankai Kenpachi.

 

[Ovy7]

What's the accepted difference between TYBW Kenny and CFYOW Kenny? Because after reading a bit into his fight with Hikone, Kenpachi was still keeping up with Res Hikone while still in his base, and considered it a waste to go into Shikai (even tho Hikone was continuously trying to provoke him to enter Shikai).

 

[Axxtentacle]

CFYOW Kenny is stated to be one of the few people that can handle Res Hikone, along with Aizen and Ichigo. I think there was another name thrown in there but i'm not sure.

Don't know how that messes with the scaling, but there you go.

 

[Ovy7]

The narrator also said that Ginjo could have maybe been able too, if he wasn't occupied at the time. And the narrator also mentioned Urahara and Mayuri, but not in a physical fight but with their intelligence, drugs, and shiet.

 

[Damage3245]

That makes the speed scaling a whole lot more questionable.

 

[Ovy7]

Which part?

 

[Damage3245]

Which part?

Ginjo is apparently on par with Grimmjow, but apparently he might also be able to fight Res Hikone who is 125x faster than base Grimmjow? And if characters can fight Hikone without needing to be equal in speed with him (like Urahara and Mayuri) then True Shikai Ichigo needing to best as fast as Hikone becomes questionable.

But the discussion for whether or not that scaling should remain can be handled at a later date, when the third novel is released.

 

[Ovy7]

Base Ginjo was on par with Grimmjow, and he has his Shikai and Bankai on top of that. Plus, the narrator only says a "maybe", like, it's questionable if he can do it.

In the case of Mayuri and Urahara, the narrator mentioned that they could maybe fight him using their tech and intelligence, not in an actual physical fight ala Kenpachi or Ichigo. Like, the narrator specifically mentions that only Kenpachi, Ichigo, and Aizen are the ones that could fight and beat Hikone in a physical brawl.

But the discussion for whether or not that scaling should remain can be handled at a later date, when the third novel is released.

Sound fair.

 

[Dangai_Ichigo]

Also the True Shikai Ichigo most of everybody present there knows is the one who's holding back because almost everybody present during this wasn't present when Ichigo went all out against Yhwach

 

[Tyri456]

That base ginjo lol, and he has shikai and bankai, and its a possibility given the fact ginjo has multiple races and can become stronger easily, lets not assuming things without knowing the context.

Is the sandbox updated?

 

[AnonymousBlank]

Does Base Ginjo refer to Scaffold, Badge or Ichigo Fullbring?

 

[Damage3245]

That base ginjo lol, and he has shikai and bankai, and its a possibility given the fact ginjo has multiple races and can become stronger easily, lets not assuming things without knowing the context.

Is the sandbox updated?

Not yet, need to find some time. But you can update the sandbox if you want.

 

[Tyri456]

I will update it without the scaling with kenpachi, so at least we can end this thread for the time being.

 

[Ovy7]

Does Base Ginjo refer to Scaffold, Badge or Ichigo Fullbring?

This Ginjo.

 

[Tyri456]

I mostly fixed it,

There is only one problem which is the scaling between Yourichi and Urahara, which is not taken into account in the sandbox but it is on the profiles,
but I believe it should not change the finals results except some people reaching sub-rel from mhs+ and the values. The speed range should be the same.

I will come back in a couple of hours.

 

[Dangai_Ichigo]

This Ginjo.

I see nothing

 

[AnonymousBlank]

What Dangai said

 

[Ovy7]

Why the hell aren't fandom pics working here?!

Does this work?

 

[AppleLord]

I see nothing

 

[Damage3245]

I mostly fixed it,

There is only one problem which is the scaling between Yourichi and Urahara, which is not taken into account in the sandbox but it is on the profiles,
but I believe it should not change the finals results except some people reaching sub-rel from mhs+ and the values. The speed range should be the same.

I will come back in a couple of hours.

I'll update Yoruichi there, since I had forgotten she scaled to Sub-Rel in the Pre-Timeskip.