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Death Revisions (Puss In Boots: The Last Wish)

Jackythejack

They/Them
20,008
1,717
"Social Influencing & Fear Manipulation (Menaced Puss so much to the point where it nearly drove him into an early retirement. The sheer fact of Death stalking him gave him severe anxiety)"

No. No no no no no no no.

This isn't right. This isn't it chief. Whatever it is you want to say, this is not that. Death does not have this magical fear manipulation or social manipulation or illusion creation like his profile says he does.

Listen, I get it you want to make him cool but this ignores the context of the story. Puss was scared into an early retirement because he was on his last life. The whole point of the movie is he is on his last life and is deathly terrified of dying, and not living up to what he once was.

Puss fears Death, he fears the wolf, because he can hurt him. Puss is cocky and confident, but when he's on his last life and faced with an opponent that he knows he cannot beat, he was terrified, he was fearing for his damn life because Puss didn't want to die. He was afraid of death not because of some supernatural fear manipulation; he was just scared.

Getting severe anxiety because a man who wants to kill you who could easily kill you and preys off your fear of death does not mean that man has supernatural fear manipulation. Puss just had an honest to god panic attack. This isn't supernatural it's just a part of the psyche of a person, especially since Puss, in the panic attack scene, was just in a battle that had him almost die like two different times in a short time frame. Seeing the wolf in other things is literally shown to just be Puss hallucinating or having visions given his anxiety. He sees the wolf in the tree branches or a pile of rocks because they just so happen to have that vague shape.

Look I don't mean to come off as rude but to just say that Death has supernatural fear manipulation and illusion creation both belittles the message of the movie which is overcoming your fears, and also just belittles one of the greatest scenes in the movie. Please remove the fear, social influencing and illusion creation. He doesn't have them. This is especially evident when Puss just isn't scared of him in the finale.

Just because someone is scary doesn't mean they have fear manipulation.
 
This looks good, I agree with the removals, it didn't really make sense
 
I agree with the removal of Fear Manipulation and Social influencing, however I don't agree with the removal of Illusion creation.

I believe its fair to not give death Fear Manip since his fear manip doesn't seem supernatural in nature; It just seems as if puss is afraid of him. A good example is how puss wasn't afraid the first time they met, but the fear of death was just instilled into him due to the way the plot unfolds.
 
I feel like the illusion creation should go if the fear manipulation goes, though, since the profile claims it is a byproduct of his fear manipulation which would then not exist.

Besides, again, Puss is just suffering hallucinations during his panic attack brought on by his own fear, and it's not something the wolf is doing, and we know this because the wolf just straight up never uses it against him, it seems.
 
I agree with the removal of Fear Manipulation and Social influencing, however I don't agree with the removal of Illusion creation.
Illusion creation is literally just Puss being in a panic attack. If you want to argue he has Illusion creation find something else.

Speaking of that something else... replace this "Crystal Manipulation (As he chased Puss, he changed the color of and projected his face on several crystal-like walls)" with Illusion creation, because it sure as shit ain't Death manipulating the crystals.

And since I'm here, besides my Sandbox for Death which obviously needs the PnA I'm not contesting

Death should be outright Subsonic, he blitzed Puss in their first fight which means he scales to his reactions, remember, Death was casual throughout the movie

Immortality is an assumption, and a pretty big one at that, he shouldn't have it due to no evidence.

"Vibration Manipulation (Shattered a large crystal" Death hit or pushed over each crystal he broke so...

"likely Abstract Existence (Type 1; due to being literally the physical embodiment of the concept of death. Puss noting that he cannot defeat Death also hints at this)" This is, A: type 2 AE, and B: Puss saying he can't beat Death is likely stats, not AE.

Enhanced senses should have wolf shit.

If Shrek is Class 10 for overpowering Puss with one arm, Death sure as shit is too.

Stamina should be unknown cause we literally have now way to know what limits there are.

Outside of that, what's on the sandbox are the revisions I'd make to Death.
 
Illusion creation is literally just Puss being in a panic attack. If you want to argue he has Illusion creation find something else.

Speaking of that something else... replace this "Crystal Manipulation (As he chased Puss, he changed the color of and projected his face on several crystal-like walls)" with Illusion creation, because it sure as shit ain't Death manipulating the crystals.

And since I'm here, besides my Sandbox for Death which obviously needs the PnA I'm not contesting

Death should be outright Subsonic, he blitzed Puss in their first fight which means he scales to his reactions, remember, Death was casual throughout the movie

Immortality is an assumption, and a pretty big one at that, he shouldn't have it due to no evidence.

"Vibration Manipulation (Shattered a large crystal" Death hit or pushed over each crystal he broke so...

"likely Abstract Existence (Type 1; due to being literally the physical embodiment of the concept of death. Puss noting that he cannot defeat Death also hints at this)" This is, A: type 2 AE, and B: Puss saying he can't beat Death is likely stats, not AE.

Enhanced senses should have wolf shit.

If Shrek is Class 10 for overpowering Puss with one arm, Death sure as shit is too.

Stamina should be unknown cause we literally have now way to know what limits there are.

Outside of that, what's on the sandbox are the revisions I'd make to Death.
On the sandbox, and in general, Do we really think it's perception manipulation that allows puss to see death and not just invisibility. Maybe they can be paired or maybe not, but I feel like Perception manipulation is alot less easier to conclude than invisibility.

If we're giving it perception manipulation because it's paired with the whistle, I think invisibility would be paired with that no?
 
On the sandbox, and in general, Do we really think it's perception manipulation that allows puss to see death and not just invisibility. Maybe they can be paired or maybe not, but I feel like Perception manipulation is alot less easier to conclude than invisibility.

If we're giving it perception manipulation because it's paired with the whistle, I think invisibility would be paired with that no?
I mean, wouldn't Perception Manipulation make sense since Puss was able to see him and hear him whistle while everyone else couldn't? Invisibility is just being unable to be seen while Perception Manipulation affects other senses too
 
Seems good, not sure why it hasn't been changed yet.

While we're here, can I ask why Death doesn't just have type 1 immortality? He is literally death and that's mentioned on the profile. He'd only theoretically die of "natural causes" if all other life ceased to exist. If life exists, death exists. Not giving him other immortality types is already conservative enough if I'm being honest, him not having type 1 is just silly. Tbh I'm half tempted to also make an argument for "possibly Nigh-Omnipresent".

Also, if no one is gonna mention it, the last link for Puss' speed section goes to a **** site...
 
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At the very least his teleportation should also be changed to a possibly or likely. He never visibly teleports on-screen and we know he is a master of stealth. To say it's definitely teleportation would be an assumption.

Realistically speaking these scenes are meant to portray that Death is always following you, always watching, and always waiting. Honestly I feel like it could be argued as grounds for a Possibly Nigh-Omnipresent. But obviously there's no concrete evidence for it.
 
Seems good, not sure why it hasn't been changed yet.

While we're here, can I ask why Death doesn't just have type 1 immortality? He is literally death and that's mentioned on the profile. He'd only theoretically die of "natural causes" if all other life ceased to exist. If life exists, death exists. Not giving him other immortality types is already conservative enough if I'm being honest, him not having type 1 is just silly. Tbh I'm half tempted to also make an argument for "possibly Nigh-Omnipresent".

Also, if no one is gonna mention it, the last link for Puss' speed section goes to a **** site...
That is Reliant Immortality, as he relies on the existence of life/death it self.
 
That is Reliant Immortality, as he relies on the existence of life/death it self.
Well that's still kinda theoretical. Unless it's explicitly mentioned that he relies on the existence of the cycle of life and death to exist at all, it can't be said for certain that he really does, it just means he would no longer have meaning at that point. In the same sense. there would be no point in the flow of time if space and matter didn't exist, but that doesn't necessarily mean time as a concept would cease to exist. Most incarnations of the concept of death in fiction don't have that on their profiles, it has to be straight-up said.

Type 1 is the most realistic addition as there is no need for additional evidence, his nature is sufficient evidence alone.
 
Seems good, not sure why it hasn't been changed yet.

While we're here, can I ask why Death doesn't just have type 1 immortality? He is literally death and that's mentioned on the profile. He'd only theoretically die of "natural causes" if all other life ceased to exist. If life exists, death exists. Not giving him other immortality types is already conservative enough if I'm being honest, him not having type 1 is just silly. Tbh I'm half tempted to also make an argument for "possibly Nigh-Omnipresent".

Also, if no one is gonna mention it, the last link for Puss' speed section goes to a **** site...
Mind giving some actual proof that Death here is immortal? Y'know, beyond obvious assumptions?
 
Mind giving some actual proof that Death here is immortal? Y'know, beyond obvious assumptions?
That isn't an assumption, it is a byproduct of his nature. To deny that is to deny him being death, which you can't because he is and we already know that. This is a silly argument.

His nature also means he's existed however long life has existed in the overall Shrek universe.

The thing I don't get is that you're acting as if he isn't what he is. He is quite literally the embodiment of the concept of death. That, by default, makes him immortal at least in the sense of eternal life. You're treating him as a purely physical living being just named Death and not literally the idea of death made manifest, which he is.
 
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