Dragon Ball Super 59: Road to 60 and Blanco is Canon Now...

[ZERO7772]

I just noticed this replay

When was that again? heck XV2 seems to imply SSJ4 is above SSB and maybe GoD level, not saying we should take the game seriously but this is opposite to what you said

Beerus saying the SSJ4 Vegeta may have chance of defeating him this time and Whiss telling SSJ4 Goku he will make Great GoD with this power

 

[ZERO7772]

I'd say ssj4 is <= ssg in XV as a whole in order to keep the rage.... what i mean is to not give the fandom another excuse that blue or any other god form is superior to ssj4 because we all know this debate is still going no matter how much evidence we have saying such

Well the main argument for SSJ4 is that GT happen after Super so SSJ4 would be miles stronger than SSB, of course at this point GT is considered nearly non-canon this argument isn't very strong

Super have much better feats than GT

 

[Zenkaibattery1]

Anyway

MUI Goku>FW(Xv2. Pre Fu amp)

FW(XV2. With Fu amp)=MUI Goku=>Jiren>Gods of Destruction.

Kek. The Future warrior struggled with Base Goku

Edit: I was right about SSJ1 Goku>Future Warrior all that time ago lmao. Told you so

Nah.
That doesn't explain how he could defeat Amped real Jiren (or at least fight him) and still be up and running unless of course SSJ1 Goku > Jiren.

Or FW2's power being stated to "might have surpassed the gods themselves" and Base Goku definitely isn't GoD tier, not even current.

And if we use the whole "Parallel quests are canon to the story" then FW1 >>> RoF SSJB Goku and Vegeta or FW2 > SSJB Black Arc Goku, which would out them higher than SSJ1 Goku.

Also im pretty sure he fought SSJ1 Goku and Vegeta in the beggining if Infinite History.

MUI Goku => FW2 => Amped Jiren > Jiren >> GoD's. The Fu Amp is almost irrelevant with scaling alone.

Which then doesn't explain how he could barley tie Base Goku. In the PQ, clone amped Jiren is weaker than Jiren.

Whis also has said that both Vegeta and Goku working together can beat Beerus. Yet Beerus>Vegito.

How is FW2>SSJB Black Arc Goku? Because he fought merged Zamasu alone? Goku also momentarily did that in the Goku Black arc, and it is very likely he did that in Xenoverse before the FW came in. That and i'm talking about the RoF saga. I agree that he probably caught up to SSJB by the time of the Goku Black Arc. FW (RoF) needed SSJB Goku's help, and Goku flicked away an attack the kais believed would kill the FW

And....?

FW needed Fu's amp, there is nothing that can contradict that.

Xenoverse has many inconcsistenties.... much harder to scale than Heroes lol

 

[Darkmon_cns]

Just don't take the PQs as canon.

 

[Golden_Void]

Well there also is the fact that Goku is stronger after every UI transformation.

His base after he went UI is vastly stronger to his base before it, his base after going UI twice is vastly stronger than the previous two, etc.

 

[Super_Saiyan_God_Julian]

@Zenkaibattery1

Again, only happens in PQ's, which even if they are canon, contradict the fact that FW2 fought the real deal in the story. Probably inconsitency.

That's a movie only quote, which has been retconned extensively.

SSJB Goku fought regular Fusion Zamasu. FW2 fought an Amped Corrupted Purple Arm Zamasu, who was the one who fought SSJB Vegito. Post-Game he is easily on par with RoF SSJB, since he defeated and overthrew RoF Golden Frieza who is => SSJB Goku.

I though you where talking about current FW2, which is why I responded saying he had already fought and defeated SSJ1 Goku.

Problem is that FW2 is already around that level via feats and scaling. And besides he already fought SSJB Goku without any implied amp.

I agree tought. Xenoverse has tons of inconsistencies, especially if we try to reconcile what happens on PQ's with the story. Even Heroes is easier.

 

[Ovrhide]

FW, Jiren, UI goku, and Fu should be in the same tier.

 

[Super_Saiyan_God_Julian]

FW, Jiren, UI goku, and Fu should be in the same tier.

Technically they would all be 2-B. Although a very high end of 2-B, since even Base BoG Goku can hold one of Demigra's 2-B attacks.

 

[TheRustyOne]

I want to point out that when I fought the Jiren with Black and Zamasu Hit said that Jiren wasn't as strong as he remembered.

Quote: "...Jiren. I never thought I'd have to fight him here. But the Jiren I know is much more powerful than that... Well, it doesn't matter who gets in our way. We're here to do a job.

You get this if you talk to Hit after you beat Jiren and Return to The Time Nest.

 

[Zenkaibattery1]

@Julian

I agree. It's probably an inconsistency. Not much with Jiren happened so it's very vague. It's hard to believe pre-amp can fight Jiren when he needed amp to fight MUI who according to DBH, as far as we know, is equal to Jiren

It's in Super as well, and likely applies to the games as well. Since the story mode in Xenoverse follows everything normally until the time breakers jump in

XD. The mentor quests are just as inconsistent. He beat and is stronger than Golden Frieza ROF (While in base?) yet he is equal to SSJB Vegeta who scaling off Goku should be equal to Frieza Golden? And again, SSJB pushed back an attack suppressed that would kill an on guard FW. As for Fusion Zamasu,

ok

Not neccessarliy. Yet again, the inconsistenties really make that hard to quantify.

Although in Heroes, it is arguable if DBS DBH MUI is actually stronger than Xeno Goku. Considering they are just treated as seperate timelines, and as far as we know all Beerus' are equal to each other. And MUI Goku>Beerus but Beerus>Xeno Goku>Majority of the Demon Gods

 

[Super_Saiyan_God_Julian]

@Zenkaibattery1

Alright. I understand your points. Xenoverse is definitely filled with inconsistencies especially the PQ's which are all over the place.

MUI Goku is likely stronger than Xeno Goku for now.

Also wouldn't Fuu (Timeline Amped) be solid MUI level? Considering that a bunch of his energy (not ALL of it, since he still had some to spare) made FW2 equal to MUI Goku?

 

[Darkmon_cns]

I really don't think ANY THING but the main story should be canon...

 

[Ovrhide]

Just going post something fun. Power levels for db wafer cards. Not to be taken too literal, they are meant to be cute.

https://ibb.co/bxwTtH https://ibb.co/hy38tH https://ibb.co/iEfA7c https://ibb.co/bXfotH https://ibb.co/i4Qcnc https://ibb.co/mtKsLx https://ibb.co/eAXCLx https://ibb.co/gadV7c https://ibb.co/bSxOSc https://ibb.co/ePeEYH https://ibb.co/dqHOSc https://ibb.co/fFaotH https://ibb.co/eg8K0x


Zeno: Infinite, Jiren: 9500, SSB Vegito: 9300, SS4 Gogeta: 9200, UI Omen Goku: 9000, SSB Goku and Vegeta: 9000, Merged Zamasu: 9000, Spirit Bomb GT Goku: 8900, SSB Kaioken Goku: 8800, Omega Shenron: 8700, SSB Goku: 8500, SS4 Goku: 8300, SS4 Vegeta: 8300, Hit: 8200, Nova Shenron: 8000, SSB Vegeta: 8000, SS Rose Goku Black: 8000, SS Rage Future Trunks: 8000, Frost and Freeza: 7800, Berserker Kale: 7000, LSS Broly: 7000, Ultimate Gohan: 6800, SS2 Caulifla: 6500, Freeza: 6400, Android 17: 6200, Majuub: 6100, Trio De Danger: 6000, SS2 Goku: 5800, Majin Buu: 5500, Piccolo: 5000, Roshi and Tien: 4000, Rebrianne: 3800, Caulifla: 3500, Chichi and Goku: 3000, Kale: 2800, Goten, Trunks, and Bra: 2500, Bulma: 800 or 300 (too blurry),

Hakaishins And Angels: ????, Smoke Shenron: ????, Great Priest: ????, Mastered UI Goku: ????

 

[TheRustyOne]

I want to point out that when I fought the Jiren with Black and Zamasu Hit said that Jiren wasn't as strong as he remembered.
Quote: "...Jiren. I never thought I'd have to fight him here. But the Jiren I know is much more powerful than that... Well, it doesn't matter who gets in our way. We're here to do a job.

You get this if you talk to Hit after you beat Jiren and Return to The Time Nest.

This again

 

[Ovrhide]

This again

Isn't that a clue tho? That's isnt a PQ quote, it's about story jiren

 

[Zenkaibattery1]

Oh really? That makes more sense then. If you can find a youtube clip about Hit saying that, then it would be much appreciated

 

[Super_Saiyan_God_Julian]

I agree. If that's true it would fix a lot of issues.

 

[Ovrhide]

IMA or through the story with another character, so I can screen cap the conversation with hit after the jiren fight in story mode

 

[Golden_Void]

If we're going by the canon, Hit wouldn't even know Jiren's full power since he was erased.

 

[TISSG7Redgrave]

https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/1431410 cause i feel this is getting a bit full

 

[Ovrhide]

So what are you saying? That the possessed jiren is weaker than the suppressed jiren who is Above G.o.D level? I mean, that's too far fetch. Maybe the writer of that dialog wanted to expressed that the non possessed jiren is stronger than the possessed one I general.