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Dragon Ball vs. Marvel/DC/Saint Seiya threads

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Me and ScarletFirefly consider allowing them to be a gamble that could breed hostility between our members and significantly increase the staff workload, due to having to constantly defuse threads that have gone out of control, but others think that we should allow them.

In any case, I am going to bed soon, so I will not be able to participate much.
 
I think its still a valid rule to enforce.

Even some of our oldest and most level-headed members can get overly passionate and produce ad nasuem agruments when it comes to these match-ups. The amount of one-upping is insulting and disgusting. I would hate to see these match-ups return, even with the amount of time we've had this "cool off" period, the fans have much more reason to get passionate with VS matches, since DBS and MCU are nearing their peak height in regard to popularity right now.
 
While true, it would add workload to the staff and be nothing more than a nuisance in the long run. Something I'm sure we'd all be happier without.
 
I agree with JSW. Look at the non-staff members who made good points.

Also, Sera Loveheart should be able to comment here since she's the OP of the previous thread.
 
Sera is an ex-staff member, so I think that she can comment here.

Anyway, I also agree with Hop.
 
Also, as a general request, can everybody please stop making highlighted policy revision threads that are open for all members to participate? They always spiral out of control into pure extremely time-consuming chaos, and it is up to the staff to decide such issues anyway.
 
I'm neutral on this.

While I really don't like the idea of unbanning them, I believe our members should be given a chance to prove that they aren't biases and don't know how to debate and not make stomp threads.

Just my thoughts on this.
 
Also, EliminatorVenom and Sera's points in the old should preferably not be brushed off and left alone. A simple "I agree" isn't sufficient when there are arguments to be addressed.
 
Antvasima said:
Also, as a general request, can everybody please stop making highlighted policy revision threads that are open for all members to participate? They always spiral out of control into pure extremely time-consuming chaos, and it is up to the staff to decide such issues anyway.
Click to expand...
@Ant I suggest you make a rule for this and add it to your staff advice page.
 
Well, there was a suggestion about trying to allow this during a trial period, and then see whether or not we should reinstate the rule afterwards.
 
Kepekley23 said:
Also, EliminatorVenom and Sera's points in the old should preferably not be brushed off and left alone. A simple "I agree" isn't sufficient when there are arguments to be addressed.
Click to expand...
Here.
 
Can you reiterate the arguments?
 
I meant posting the significant quotes.
 
"

I vote for lifting the ban. While understandable and I can see it happening, it is an ultimately unwise decision in my point of view. Even banning Goku and Superman matches is a bad idea, and I am heavily against it.

  • For starters, it just generalizes stuff. Because Goku V.S. Seiya, Goku V.S. Superman and similar frequently cause flame wars, then the entire verse must be banned to match against the other? What kind of logic is this? I mean, flame wars happen in any match, in any verse and any principle. Goku V.S. Superman is notably more blatant because they are a more symbolic kind of match, but still these kinds of matches happen every time. Hell, I've seen in multiple communities - and even here - Superman V.S. Goku debates going on smoothly. Much more than some others here. I've literally seen Superman V.S. Goku matches more reasonable than whole revision threads.
  • Banning character matches because of people causing flamewars is, imo, a bad idea. It is like banning a specific religion because fanatics of the same religion do bad stuff, banning political parties because some of their members vandalized something, and etc. (Won't get into more examples because they're really controversial) Characters are characters, people are people. The rule should be "no flamewars" and insta-closing threads that have gone awry, or insta-deleting flamewar-y responses.
  • Banning the matches only limits possible battles, and not only that, but one of the most well-known and symbolic to VS-Debating as a whole.
  • And lastly, banning such matches isn't solving the problem. It is avoiding it. The problem is immature, frustrated and/or trollish people. Banning the match helps little to adress the problem, I could link several dozens of matches where flamewars occurred, sometimes with the same character."
"No need to outright ban specific matchups if hax stomps are banned to begin with. This isn't thermonuclear astrophysics. It's very simple."

"That's literally the case with any AP stomp and/or hax stomp.

The verses do not matter."

https://gyazo.com/d4ecf6cb6c07c8f9b8ae64f5f8bde986
 
All fair points. I'm okay with allowing the matches on a trial basis.
 
Most of the people who want to lift the ban weren't around when these match ups caused enough of a headache to be banned in the first place.
 
That is a fair point.

And really. 90% of 4-B vs 4-B DC / DBZ matches will be stomps. 3-A is even worse.

Same with Saint Seiya. 3-A Goku vs 3-A Seiya would just be a sad stomp? And Seiya is one of the least haxed guys in SS.
 
Don't wanna have to deal with goku vs seiya again, already went through vs matches with both characters down to their weakest forms and goku still lost.

Db vs marvel and dc for 4-B matches will just be stomps in the comics favor, not saying it can't be fair, but the majority of it won't be.

I am however willing to try to give users the benefit of the doubt, and have a trial run where the matches aren't banned, although i think it will just be stomps.
 
My point is that banning something outright because it is A. A hax stomp or B. An AP stomp, is redundant when all AP stomps and hax stomps are banned/closed anyway. My Supergirl vs. Kefla thread wasn't either of the two, yet everyone kept spamming "DC vs DB is banned" and they cried "potential flamewar" when I cleary stated in the OP that I like both characters. I was curious as to who would win.

When I first joined, I stayed away from vs threads solely because of the gross over-generalization and slipperly slope arguments used. There are tons of stomps outside DC vs. DB or Marvel vs. DB. Pokemon has a hax advantage yet Pokemon vs DB isn't banned. It boils down to not wanting an "anime vs comics" fan war, which as I said in the previous thread, people with that kind of mentality, who just want to bash one medium in favor of another, shouldn't be here.
 
Db and marvel and dc are extremely popular franchises so while there are plenty of other vs matches that occur on here that aren't banned, the frequency of the matches which turn out to be stomps is more than mildly annoying, someone can make a match up with a character i like like Diablo and put him against saiyan saga goku, and while it's an obvious hax stomp in diablo's favor, the match has no possibly of going anywhere and leading to anything, why? Because almost no one besides me cares about diablo, if it's a dc character vs a db character though, it could potentially spiral out of control.

And the frequency with which popular franchises like db and dc with matches against each other that would have to be closed due to stomps, will be higher than if it's db vs some other verse which little to no one cares about. Albeit it's the same issue with fairy tale and one piece, against some random other verse a flame war happening is unlikely, against each other, it has happened multiple times.

It all comes down to the people who support popular verses honestly, they're passionate about the verses, which leads to supporters of different verses colliding with one another. It's a bit hypocritical to ban certain vs matches while other stuff like one piece vs fairy tail which have caused just as much problems aren't banned. Don't think we can just ban every popular verse that cause these issues, that would be stupid, in this case only thing i think we can do, is banning/warning the users that cause the issues, so they don't repeat the behavior.
 
I agree with lifting the ban, if only to test the waters and see if the fear that some have over the matchups is valid.
 
@Sara

What they mentioned by "potential flame war" is that you may like both characters and wouldn't start a flame war but that doesn't mean others wouldn't.

Like I said tho, I'm neutral and do think a people deserve a chance. Also, the problem is out of all my time here I've seen only the same redundant fights of said verses. Sara's Supergirl vs Kefla was the first (different) vs match I've seen made and hopefully they'll be different ones in the future.
 
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