Gun Park Damage reduction and limited dura neg addition

[KailynxY77]

Gun park Damage Reduction + Limited Dura neg addition

Summary


Gukja has damage reduction because his Forward stance is like gun, but why does gun not have the Same hax? He did literally the same stance against Warren (like the stance+Aura) and warren was shocked with his body. Hes also the master of yamazaki clan so he should have damage reduction imo. Besides gun is the leader of yamazaki clan and magamis father said he has a lot of interests in martial arts. He must have learn yamazaki style.

summary of limited dura neg

The ptj author said that gun can use ui Mode at 100% Performance and he mastered it, the manwha stated it Multiple times too and as I see vsb Accepted it.

Well now my point is, it is stated that ui Daniel can use all martial arts even though he didnt even see them and he uses them at 100% Performance since Jerry and Samuel said he mastered all of Them. The same Mode has gun and he mastered that mode so he should be able to use all of them technically too. Like systema for example. Thats why I think gun should have "limited durablity neg"

 

[ZetsuEarly0]

Agree

 

[Valeska24]

Seems logical, I agree.

 

[Memonto_Mori]

I agree

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Not sure if this is durability negation but rather power nullification.

 

[Valeska24]

Not sure if this is durability negation but rather power nullification.

I think there is a misunderstanding, what he is talking about here is something that is already accepted in vsb (systema users in the series already have limited dura neg) and he talked about why this should be processed in the gun profile.

 

[Memonto_Mori]

Not sure if this is durability negation but rather power nullification.

It is a scale approved in vsb and you come and reject it, I should point out that it is a crt opened to be added to the gun profile.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

It just says he can use martial arts without prior experience; not sure how that negates durability. Also "Limited durability negation" in most general cases was agreed to be reworded as "Durability Reduction" but there was never any project to get around to that.

Though if it's durability negation/reduction in the form of striking pressure points, that would be fine.

 

[Valeska24]

It just says he can use martial arts without prior experience; not sure how that negates durability. Also "Limited durability negation" in most general cases was agreed to be reworded as "Durability Reduction" but there was never any project to get around to that.

Though if it's durability negation/reduction in the form of striking pressure points, that would be fine.

Daniel Park

Daniel Park (박형석 Park Hyung-Seok) is the main protagonist in Lookism. He is a student in the fashion design department of J High School. He has a unique ability in which he has two bodies. If one were to fall asleep, he would end up on the other body. Changing from a worthless individual he...

vsbattles.fandom.com

For a more descriptive explanation, I will leave Daniel Park's profile, you can look at where the limited dura neg was taken from, and I will act on the point defended by the OP.

In his park ui form, Daniel is able to master martial arts that he could not use or master before. What we are talking about now is that this form is also available in Gun Park (this is already accepted in VSB and it is even stated that Gun has mastered the Ui form) It is already mentioned in the OP that Ui has mastered all martial arts, so we can assume that he knows it in Systema (like in Daniel)

https://imgur.io/a/4X4wnnG

and considering that systema users have limited dura neg we can do the same during the Gun

 

[DivineAura44]

I disagree with the dura neg. Gun specifically states that only 4 men have the ability to copy on site like that and he wasn't one of them (Daniel Park (Perfect Body), Daniel Park (original), Johan Seong, and Jinyoung Park.)
It's very possible that this form doesn't enable you to copy, but instead enhances your abilities which would include Daniel who was able to use moves he hasn't learned before (like the spinning back elbow he used against Vasco.) I don't think Gun should have it.
I agree with the Damage Reduction.

 

[KailynxY77]

I disagree with the dura neg. Gun specifically states that only 4 men have the ability to copy on site like that and he wasn't one of them (Daniel Park (Perfect Body), Daniel Park (original), Johan Seong, and Jinyoung Park.)
It's very possible that this form doesn't enable you to copy, but instead enhances your abilities which would include Daniel who was able to use moves he hasn't learned before (like the spinning back elbow he used against Vasco.) I don't think Gun should have it.
I agree with the Damage Reduction.

We didnt give "limited dura neg" because of the copy ablity, gun stated in the chapter "286" that Daniel can use ablities which he didnt use before. Which means he has systema because of ui. Gun mastered that Mode too so he should basically use those techniques.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Daniel Park

Daniel Park (박형석 Park Hyung-Seok) is the main protagonist in Lookism. He is a student in the fashion design department of J High School. He has a unique ability in which he has two bodies. If one were to fall asleep, he would end up on the other body. Changing from a worthless individual he...

vsbattles.fandom.com

For a more descriptive explanation, I will leave Daniel Park's profile, you can look at where the limited dura neg was taken from, and I will act on the point defended by the OP.

In his park ui form, Daniel is able to master martial arts that he could not use or master before. What we are talking about now is that this form is also available in Gun Park (this is already accepted in VSB and it is even stated that Gun has mastered the Ui form) It is already mentioned in the OP that Ui has mastered all martial arts, so we can assume that he knows it in Systema (like in Daniel)

https://imgur.io/a/4X4wnnG

and considering that systema users have limited dura neg we can do the same during the Gun

Looking at his profile, it appears to be Pain Manipulation.

 

[DivineAura44]

We didnt give "limited dura neg" because of the copy ablity, gun stated in the chapter "286" that Daniel can use ablities which he didnt use before. Which means he has systema because of ui. Gun mastered that Mode too so he should basically use those techniques.

I just explained why that logic is wrong. It's much more likely that UI is an enhancement of abilities. Daniel already had the ability to use moves he hadn't seen prior like in his fight against Vasco. It's possible (and much more logically congruent) that UI just enhanced that ability.
You'll just have to provide Gun doing anything similar to that (which despite having UI the whole time, hasn't been portrayed by the author.)

 

[DivineAura44]

Looking at his profile, it appears to be Pain Manipulation.

I do agree that it fits Pain Manipulation more but that'd take a separate CRT as Dura Neg is what's currently accepted. As for right now you have to make your argument under the pretense that this is durability negation.

 

[Valeska24]

Looking at his profile, it appears to be Pain Manipulation.

There is already a pain manipulation in his profile. The reason why limited dura neg was taken is that Jae cannot exceed Logan's endurance because a layer of fat covers his muscles and punches cannot pass this fat layer (you can see it in the imgur link I posted) but then he can make this possible with systema

 

[KailynxY77]

I do agree that it fits Pain Manipulation more but that'd take a separate CRT as Dura Neg is what's currently accepted. As for right now you have to make your argument under the pretense that this is durability negation.

Well first of all a normal elbow strike cannot be equated with a martial art since its harder to master Martial arts, and why does daniel copy others if he already has those abilities?

+Gun stated it because of ui form, since gun has a big knowledge about ui form he should be a reliable narrator. He said in chapter "286" he can use Martial arts which he didnt See. Which means its because of ui.

 

[DivineAura44]

Well first of all a normal elbow strike cannot be equated with a martial art since its harder to master Martial arts, and why does daniel copy others if he already has those abilities?

1. It doesn't. That's why I said it was enhanced.
2. He doesn't have those abilities? He only used it once in an accidental scenario.

He said in chapter "286" he can use Martial arts which he didnt See. Which means its because of ui.

This part is non-sequitur.

 

[KailynxY77]

1. It doesn't. That's why I said it was enhanced
2. He doesn't have those abilities? He only used it once in an accidental scenario.

This part is non-sequitur

Well thx for your reply and now i want to say my Arguments:

We know lil Daniel was bullied by Logan Lee most of the time. And after what he sees from him, he uses this techniques in perfect body against Zack Lee. So we cant directly say he didnt know anything about fighting. He only used a few basic martial techniques against Vasco. So its wrong to think that Daniel has all the techniques and there is not enough evidence imo. If you're asking why he said "how i did thus", it's because he moves so fast with his new body that he's surprised, he couldn't even hit a punching bag with his old body while he is super fast with the new one. So it might be surprising for him to do something like this so quickly with his new body.


About gun now, as you can see Gun sees Daniel fighting unconsciously and states that he is maximizing himself for to fight, then states that he can use techniques he has never learned/Seen before. The thing here is that Gun stated these Statement's after seeing Daniel's ui Mode. Since he has ui too, he should be right.

 

[DivineAura44]

Well thx for your reply and now i want to say my Arguments:

We know lil Daniel was bullied by Logan Lee most of the time. And after what he sees from him, he uses this techniques in perfect body against Zack Lee. So we cant directly say he didnt know anything about fighting. He only used a few basic martial techniques against Vasco. So its wrong to think that Daniel has all the techniques and there is not enough evidence imo. If you're asking why he said "how i did thus", it's because he moves so fast with his new body that he's surprised, he couldn't even hit a punching bag with his old body while he is super fast with the new one. So it might be surprising for him to do something like this so quickly with his new body.

1. Logan Lee is proficient in BJJ, not Muay Thai. And even if he was, assuming that he's done that in front of Daniel is headcanon.
2. I'm not saying he has all the abilities. It more seems like in moments of need, he can pull out moves he doesn't know. The UI then accelerates that ability and allows him to master it.

About gun now, as you can see Gun sees Daniel fighting unconsciously and states that he is maximizing himself for to fight, then states that he can use techniques he has never learned/Seen before. The thing here is that Gun stated these Statement's after seeing Daniel's ui Mode. Since he has ui too, he should be right.

Ok, that makes more sense. My counter from above still stands though.

 

[Valeska24]

1. Logan Lee is proficient in BJJ, not Muay Thai. And even if he was, assuming that he's done that in front of Daniel is headcanon.
2. I'm not saying he has all the abilities. It more seems like in moments of need, he can pull out moves he doesn't know. The UI then accelerates that ability and allows him to master it.

Ok, that makes more sense. My counter from above still stands though.

Bro, are you serious? Here he clearly claims that Daniel fought by remembering Zack in his fight with Vasco and Logan in his fight with Zack. What you say does not refute anything.

Also, even though Ui said that Gun used techniques that he did not know or saw, you still insist on these, will you provide any evidence now? Or will you continue to argue just for the sake of arguin
g?

 

[DivineAura44]

I'm NGL, those images didn't load for me earlier . You can mark me as agree I guess.

 

[XxZetsuxX]

i Agree with the OP

 

[Valeska24]

Looking at his profile, it appears to be Pain Manipulation.

So what are your thoughts on the op right now?

 

[Lonkitt]

Looking at his profile, it appears to be Pain Manipulation.

I agree with that as well

 

[Valeska24]

I agree with that as well

We are discussing here whether an accepted scale should be added to the profile or not. I would like to point out that if you think it is wrong, you can discuss it in another CRT (with the people who added limited dura negi to the profile).

Also, you still haven't expressed your views on damage reduction.

 

[KailynxY77]

I agree with that as well

I think there's a still a misunderstanding, our main topic here is an addition for gun Park. VSB already accepted that systema has "limited dura neg". If you are against it you can discuss it with Systema's CRT owners. Our topic here is to add an already accepted scaling for Park Gun....

 

[DarkGrath]

To be clear on the case for dura neg - the argument is that UI Daniel has mastered "all martial arts", and 'Systema' is a martial art in this series, so UI Daniel has mastered Systema. Therefore, UI Daniel should have the abilities of Systema users, which includes Limited Durability Negation. Therefore, Daniel has Limited Durability Negation.

Assuming all of these statements are literal, this is a valid deduction. However, I am concerned that the scans seem to interchangeably use "All martial arts" and "All kinds of martial arts", which makes me question whether we are meant to take that statement as "UI Daniel has actually mastered every martial art to exist" or just "UI Daniel has mastered a lot of martial arts". There is also the issue raised earlier about whether Systema users have durability negation in the first place, but I can't really comment on that without deeper knowledge of the series. Overall, I'm neutral on this, and willing to hear out new information.

Damage Reduction seems perfectly fine.

 

[KailynxY77]

To be clear on the case for dura neg - the argument is that UI Daniel has mastered "all martial arts", and 'Systema' is a martial art in this series, so UI Daniel has mastered Systema. Therefore, UI Daniel should have the abilities of Systema users, which includes Limited Durability Negation. Therefore, Daniel has Limited Durability Negation.

Assuming all of these statements are literal, this is a valid deduction. However, I am concerned that the scans seem to interchangeably use "All martial arts" and "All kinds of martial arts", which makes me question whether we are meant to take that statement as "UI Daniel has actually mastered every martial art to exist" or just "UI Daniel has mastered a lot of martial arts". There is also the issue raised earlier about whether Systema users have durability negation in the first place, but I can't really comment on that without deeper knowledge of the series. Overall, I'm neutral on this, and willing to hear out new information.

Damage Reduction seems perfectly fine.

First of all thank you for your support and I will show few more Panels for "all Martial arts" discussion:


As you can see that Mua Thai ablity what Daniel uses is forbidden. And the person who found this only taught this to the character named Vasco. But strangely can Daniel use it, who actually has never seen a forbidden mua thai technique before. He can use it because of the Ultra instinct ability. So it would make more sense to say that Daniel can use all Martial arts.

​

UI DANIEL:​

VASCO:​

 

[DarkGrath]

As you can see that Mua Thai ablity what Daniel uses is forbidden. And the person who found this only taught this to the character named Vasco. But strangely can Daniel use it, who actually has never seen a forbidden mua thai technique before. He can use it because of the Ultra instinct ability. So it would make more sense to say that Daniel can use all Martial arts.

The fact that it would "make more sense" is not very compelling. This is a particular example of Daniel's ability allowing him to learn an esoteric martial art - that doesn't mean it entailed learning every martial art that wasn't esoteric.

I would honestly normally say the phrase "A monster who's mastered all martial arts" would be enough to pass this; it's just the fact that the ability was previously referred to with the phrase "He knows all kinds of martial arts" that's throwing me off. The latter implies it doesn't just inherently grant the user mastery of every martial art. If there's any way to explain this discrepancy in the phrasing, that would help clear the confusion.

 

[Valeska24]

I would honestly normally say the phrase "A monster who's mastered all martial arts" would be enough to pass this; it's just the fact that the ability was previously referred to with the phrase "He knows all kinds of martial arts" that's throwing me off. The latter implies it doesn't just inherently grant the user mastery of every martial art. If there's any way to explain this discrepancy in the phrasing, that would help clear the confusion.

Frankly, I don't think this will cause a problem because there are many techniques that the characters have developed specifically for themselves in the series, in a way, their special martial arts are special to them (for example, Kwak's use of his hands as a sword, Brekdak's 10 forbidden techniques and the defense developed by Zack Lee's teacher techniques) these are personal martial arts, they are not the general martial arts that everyone knows in the series (aikido, karate, taekwondo, systema, etc.). It would not be wrong to say that Daniel has mastered the general martial arts in the series with the evidence given above, there are also characters who constantly express this Considering these (Gun, Samuel, Jerry can be given as examples), we can say that Ui has mastered all the general martial arts in the series, and I do not think there is an anti-argument against this, so yes, we can confirm that Gun can also use systema.

 

[KailynxY77]

The fact that it would "make more sense" is not very compelling. This is a particular example of Daniel's ability allowing him to learn an esoteric martial art - that doesn't mean it entailed learning every martial art that wasn't esoteric.

A monster who's mastered all martial arts" would be enough to pass this; it's just the fact that the ability was previously referred to with the phrase "He knows all kinds of martial arts" that's throwing me off. The latter implies it doesn't just inherently grant the user mastery of every martial art. If there's any way to explain this discrepancy in the phrasing, that would help clear the confusion.

I see your Point and lets say ui just allows him to use all kind of Martial arts, basically a lot of Martial arts. Daniel already used Systema when he entered in ui Form and he proved that he uses Systema. It would maybe unknown if we only used Statement's, but we showed feats too. When Daniel enters in ui Mode, Systema was one of his abilities. So i still didnt understand the anti-argument so far......

 

[DarkGrath]

When Daniel enters in ui Mode, Systema was one of his abilities.

Daniel is explicitly shown to know Systema specifically while in UI form? If so, then that's perfectly fine - the outstanding question of whether Systema has durability negation remains, but to reiterate, I don't know enough about the series to comment on that.

 

[DivineAura44]

Daniel is explicitly shown to know Systema specifically while in UI form? If so, then that's perfectly fine - the outstanding question of whether Systema has durability negation remains, but to reiterate, I don't know enough about the series to comment on that.

He knows it in his base but at the time he shows it in UI, he hadn't learned it.

 

[KailynxY77]

Daniel is explicitly shown to know Systema specifically while in UI form? If so, then that's perfectly fine - the outstanding question of whether Systema has durability negation remains, but to reiterate, I don't know enough about the series to comment on that.

Here used daniel systema in Ui mode

 

[KailynxY77]

He knows it in his base but at the time he shows it in UI, he hadn't learned it.

If you are talking about your arguments from few days ago, we already debunked them. He cant use systema in base.. So i would be glad if you explain your point better.

 

[DivineAura44]

He cant use systema in base.. So i would be glad if you explain your point better.

I think that's quite literally what I just said

 

[Seriall001]

I think it seems logical, I agree.

 

[KailynxY77]

I think that's quite literally what I just said

Sorry my bad

 

[KailynxY77]

Daniel is explicitly shown to know Systema specifically while in UI form? If so, then that's perfectly fine - the outstanding question of whether Systema has durability negation remains, but to reiterate, I don't know enough about the series to comment on that.

Sorry for bothering you but what will happen to our CRT now? If the limited dura neg is still a Problem, i think the mods can add at least Pain manip+Damage reduction with the scale i shared

 

[DivineAura44]

Sorry for bothering you but what will happen to our CRT now? If the limited dura neg is still a Problem, i think the mods can add at least Pain manip+Damage reduction with the scale i shared

Once again, if you do it based on scaling to another's abilities, you have to add the ability they have. It's always possible to make another CRT when this is done.