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One Punch Man Revision

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Matthew_Schroeder

Matthew_Schroeder

VS Battles
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During Chapter 81 and 82 of the Webcomic, Ogon Seishi / Golden Sperm had a brief fight with Monster Garou, the two even exchanging some blows before the later killed him.

MG1
MG2
MG3
MG4
MG5

Currently, Golden Sperm is ranked at High 6-C, though Garou is At least High 6-A. In order for their fight to be anything but a brutal, quick one-shot, GS should be at least somewhat comparable to him. The Outskirtsbattledomewiki, for instance, has Garou at Continent level+ (Which is basically Multi-Continent for us), and GS at Continent level.

In my opinion, a ranking of "Unknown, possibly Continent level", which the justification of "Held a brief fight against, and exchanged blows with Monster Garou" would seem legitimate.

If this is accepted, it would also scale to Tatsumaki, as WoG states that she'd beat him if at 100%.

Thoughts?
 
Theres also the fact that technivally a single one of his trillion form managed to injure Atomic Samurai do I dont think multi continent is unbelievable enough to not put on multi continent. Supporting.
 
Yes, Golden Sperm is made up of 10,000,000,000,000 Black Sperms, though it doesn't fully control said power.
 
CrossverseCrisis said:
Wasn't this like turned down before a while back one time?
Click to expand...
Yes. Mainly because Monster Garou goes through two other transformations after this. With the higher forms being the ones that scale to Boros.
 
Zat so? It's the literal combination of each one so I doubt it's too different from a flat value multiplication on statsand considering how he kept up with Garou it doesnt seem too farfetched
 
@COB This form IIRC did considerably increase Garou's powers and according to the OPM Wiki he was enhanced by this as well.

There's also the issue that Garou is "At least Multi-Continent level," possibly "Planet level." We can't just make these other characters 6-A. If we're somewhat scaling them their ratings have to match somewhat. "

There is also that right before Garou transforms he did manage to cause harm to GS's face and hit him back. It makes no sense for this weaker form getting hurt by Garou and then he's now somewhat trading blows with the possibly 5-B forms of his. And GS/Tatsumaki scaling to Boros does not seem right, and comes off more as PIS, if this even is the form that scales to Boros.
 
We can't be sure. Didn't no matter what he did he was getting beat up around by Saitama? Oneshotting him? Now I don't usually rely on move callin since Saitama is unreliable on it, but maybe perhaps it's just Garou being pushed to his upper limits?

Err the highly like scenario is that he's just continental and not planetary since he was after all beaten up by Garou. Just like Garou he was still getting used to his old form and kinda used up all his strength and speed against Garou. GS was only superior to basically everyone that isn't Garou, Boros, Saitama, and 100% Tatsumaki. It's only the speed that's questionable

I don't wdesire 5-B forms for these two, but Continental seems to make some sort of sense considering their level of power and Garou could just be taking it easy on the other characters. But I do see your point.
 
Yes, but he was still fighting against Saitama in his weakest Monster Form, and it's dishonest to say only the absolute strongest of which scales to Boros. In fact, second and third form Monster Garou are 100% featless, both being one shot by Saitama.
 
How is it dishonest to say only the absolute strongest scales to Boros? If it's said that when Garou becomes the "perfect monster" he'd give Boros one hell of a fight, then why not when he's in his strongest form and when he says he's reached his perfection as a monster?

And what does it matter if the third form of Garou is featless when it is explicitly stated to be more powerful? And Saitama obviously is going to be able to one shot any of these forms regardless.

There's also how GS got injured and blitzed by Garou prior to the transformation, then gets stomped right after the transformation. The scaling even if accurate wouldn't make any sense. And we've gone over this before and concluded this topic in this thread. With most of the point Ala brough up.
 
Actually ONE was just vague on that. He just says Boros vs Garou would be close to a tie, with Garou edging on close combat. And judging from why Garou is so skilled at close combat it's probably because of his earlier forms.

Isn't it only getting strength for speed? The only reasoning that it's powerful is because Garou claims he became even stronger. But in comparison he was getting beat up faster than before.

Injured by a sucker punch to be fair. I'll check the thread tomorrow and continue the debate, I need to stay off to focus on exams.
 
First Form Monster Garou was performing better against Saitama than Meteoric Burst Boros, if you analyse both fights on Webcomic Form. Saitama was actually fighting back, and the two were exchanging blows, and many times Saitama was surprised at Garou's strength and capabilty to keep going.
 
@Core ONE does say after he "had become the perfect monster" which likely indicates he's talking about Garou's final form where he says he transforms into the best monster form. Plus it wouldn't make sense for Garou to already be able to fight on par with Boros in his weaker forms, then even when undergoing much more powerful forms, Boros is still able to give him difficulty.

And Saitama is going to curbstomp any Garou in any way. I don't think that means Saitama necessarily uses the same level of strength throughout all of Garou forms. If anything it's likely that similar to his fight with Boros Saitama is holding back less and less gradually, resulting in Garou getting fodderized quicker.

There's still also the issue that we can't simply give someone plain 6-A scaling to someone who is "possibly Planet" and the high liklihood of PIS/inconsistency considering GS was even getting overpowered by Garou's supposedly vastly inferior form. Also people like Tatsumaki and GS in all likelyhood should not be scaling to people like the Dragon level+s who are portrayed as being far above other Dragons and S-Classes. Basically like the points Ala was bringing up within that thread I brought up.
 
ONE: Garou vs Boros, who would win, you ask? Before (pre-monster Garou), it was quite obvious Boros was ways above him. But now that Garou has basically become the perfect monster, it is hard to tell who would win, it would've been one hell of a battle. I do believe that Garou is stronger in close combat, where he would simply dodge all punches and kicks

Pre-monster means when he was human. I doubt he still considered that form when he fought GS as still human. But yeah just saying.
 
"But now that Garou has basically become the perfect monster, it is hard to tell who would win"

This absolutely does not imply any reference exclusive to his last form. Instead, it refers to Garou's nature as a monster in general.
 
@COB Yeah pre-monster likely means when he's human. But also Garou was not "the perfect monster" when he fought GS. He had to evolve further throughout the fight in order to reach the peak of his state.

And also we know Saitama is drastically holding back in all of these bouts. Boros also managed to block/evade attacks from Saitama and get hits on him. But then the instant Boros starts getting considerably stronger Saitama one shots him with a "serious" hit. It could very well likely be the same case with Garou, that in the fights he is holding back less.

Plus again there's still the issue of scaling 6-A to someone who's either High 6-A or 5-B, GS getting beaten up by Garou prior to getting stomped by his higher form and that these characters are generally portrayed as being far below the likes of Boros.
 
Matthew Schroeder said:
"But now that Garou has basically become the perfect monster, it is hard to tell who would win"
This absolutely does not imply any reference exclusive to his last form. Instead, it refers to Garou's nature as a monster in general.
Click to expand...
Yes it somewhat does. Since Garou when he fought GS was not "the perfect monster." He has an entirely dialouge during his fight with Saitama that he's not good enough. That he needs to become an "unfair being" and reach "absolute evil" by evolving further into his monster forms. Then right after talking about how much greater his final form is. The first form is not " the perfect monster" and Garou describes his last transformation as being that.
 
And? His first Monster Form still performed better than Boros against Saitama going by Webcomic portrayals.
 
ONE directly states that Garou fights on par with Boros when he becomes "the perfect monster." With his transformations and dialouge his first form is clearly not that. And again Saitama is giving no effort into either of these guys. It can't really be judged how well one is doing based on how they fare against Saitama, since Saitama is stomping both of them and pretty much letting them get as far as he wants them to. He's likely holding back less and less over time with Garou as he gets stronger like Saitama did with Boros. Which is supported by it being implied that it wasn't until his stronger form that he scales to Boros.

And once more there are other issues with this scaling in general such as 6-A to a possibly 5-B, the fact GS was getting overpowered by the form that's supposedly vastly inferior to this Garou and that these characters are protrayed as being far inferior to the Dragon+s like Boros. So even if it was the possibly 5-B Garou GS fought, it's likely PIS.
 
It's like if WoG said "Before Bob was far stronger, but once Cell became the perfect life form, he is on par with him."

Base Cell has practically a whole chapter dedicated about how he's not good enough. How every facet of him as a life form is inadequate and he'll have to undergo a new evolution to reach his ultimate goal. He then transforms and right after it's stated he's reached "absolute perfection" and that this new form was "the being he was always yearning for."

Then we claim that it's the much weaker base form is "the perfect life form." And that Bob would've somehow fought on par with Cell despite him having a form far greater than one that could already match Bob. Also that Cell is as strong as Bob cause he did as well against Whis, even though Whis was effortlessly toying around with both Cell and Bob, put no amount of strain into either of them, could've effortlessly ended them instantly at anytime he wanted and simply pretended to be fighting back.

Also the way that the events are played out puts to question what really happened.

Everything I listed happened in order. I did not misplace anything. Perhaps one may've interpreted this differently than me but these are exactly the order some of these key events occur.

This sequence seems to indicate that Golden Sperm fought Human Garou as he was beginning to transform into Monster, then right as he transforms GS got fodderized. I mean we see GS fighting with Garou's previous form the entire time before, then the second we now see this new form (which is shown to us after that clash) Golden Sperm is instantly downed next panel.

But again even if we're saying GS fought that monster form and that monster form is the one that scales to Boros, it makes no sense for GS to be suddenly able to fight him immediately after he was getting beaten around by a supposedly vastly inferior fighter. It can likely be chalked off as PIS.

So in closiing I don't agree with this because

1. More indicates that it's final form Garou that gets the scaling to Boros, not his older far inferior form.

2. It's possible that GS didn't even fight well against 1st Monster Garou, as we only see him fight Human Garou for a while (and losing) Then the instant Monster Garou is shown/introduced GS is dead next panel.

3. GS fighting on par with Planet level Garou is highly inconsistent with just panels ago when supposedly vastly inferior Garou was beating him around. Similar to Goku surviving a blast from Soul Zamasu the next episode after Merged was stomping him. It's likely PIS.

So this upgrade is based on the fact someone may or may not have fought someone, in a form assumed to scale to someone else via WoG even though context indicates that to most likely not be the case, despite that if this fight and scaling is legit most it's likely PIS as it directly contradicts previously established levels of his power.
 
I don't believe this is right. Garou had to transform in order to beat him. Somthing he only does when he's close to defeat. After that transformation he had already had the strength to tank blows from casual Saitama.
 
Actually prove that I took these scans out of context instead of just claiming that I had done so. All those things I showed were in the exact order that they occured and such. Perhaps you interpret them differently that I do. But I did not deliberately misplace any information.

But either way this has been discussed countless times. We're not going to upgrade them for now. At least, not until the manga clarifies things.
 
Also not to mention that GS Shrugged off weakened tatsumaki's ESP. Which an even weaker Tat's Completely imobilized Monster Garou.
 
That's just inconsistent scaling and PIS.

Weakened Tatsumaki cannot harm Ogon. Yet an even weaker version of her can harm Garou, who is much stronger than Ogon?
 
Ryukama said:
That's just inconsistent scaling and PIS.
Weakened Tatsumaki cannot harm Ogon. Yet an even weaker version of her can harm Garou, who is much stronger than Ogon?
Click to expand...
It isnt inconsistant. GS resisted it due to his will power. Garou didnt have that luxury til he adapted.
 
If Tatsumaki using her tk on Garou is a feat of strength, then it is an inconsistent feat of strength. As even in stronger states she cannot do this on people much weaker than Garou. If it's just a hax that can be resistent depending on will power, than it doesn't translate to AP.

And even if that wasn't Ogon, we still see Human Garou initially beating Ogon at first.
 
No, the point is she had enough gravitational force to restrain Monster Garou. That's a strength feat. Fullpower tats > GS > weakened tats


Also, human garou didnt beat Ogon. Where is that coming from?
 
No. She used the inner energy or chi/aura within someone's body and manipulates that around. That is more akin to a durability negating technique.

Even if we're to treat it as direct Attack Potency, it's an outlier since a stronger form of her still couldn't do this to someone much weaker than Garou.

And Human Garou didn't defeat Ogon, but as I showed, Human Garou (a vastly inferior character than Monster Garou) still managed to throw a punch he couldn't react to and was dealt damage by it.
 
"No. She used the inner energy or chi/aura within someone's body and manipulates that around. That is more akin to a durability negating technique."

There you go taking things out of context again. That is a specific technique she uses. Even stated in the scan to be a technique.

"Even if we're to treat it as direct Attack Potency, it's an outlier since a stronger form of her still couldn't do this to someone much weaker than Garou."

Who?

"And Human Garou didn't defeat Ogon, but as I showed, Human Garou (a vastly inferior character than Monster Garou) still managed to throw a punch he couldn't react to and was dealt damage by it."

That's first form Garou. The one who's limited got damaged, and eventually surpassed Darkshine. Upon leaving that fight he was no longer human garou, but was monster garou. He even had horns, and that was his first form. That was also a sucker punch. But the fact is Gs could still keep up with Monster Garou, and exchange blows with him for a short time period. Garou literally had to transform in order to beat him. This is also supported by the fact that if Garou was way stronger than GS he would have simply oneshotted him.


Fighting GS, and transforming is what got him to the strength level where he could keep up, and tank blows from a casual Saitama. He didnt need to transform again til the fight actually happened.
 
But my problems with Planet level Tornado and Ogon is

  • The dialouge seems to indicate that this form of Garou Ogon fought is not the "Perfect Monster" who scales to Boros.
  • Even taking the form as that, from the way we see Ogon and Human Garou lunge at each other, an unseen clash, then after that clash we see Monster Garou appear and Ogon immediately dead in literally the next panel. That seems to indicate that Ogon fought Garou as he was transforming, then got fodderized after he transformed.
  • Even taking it as Ogon fighting Monster Garou the whole time, it's an inconsistency since right before Ogon can get hit and take damage from a vastly inferior person.
  • The technique Tornado used on Garou is later described as a durability negating technique.
  • Even taking it as not a durability negating technique rather direct AP, it's still PIS since she couldn't do this on Ogon while stronger than when she did this on Garou, who is much stronger than Ogon.
You're free to think whatever you want. But that's all I have to say and I'm fine with letting the staff decide.
 
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