Human-to-Pokemon Powerscaling (Weaponry in Pokemon World, more correct this time)

[User_A_98732165489]

[https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...ling_(Weaponry_in_Pokemon_World_calculations)]

Hello. I previously made a fairly long blog post, about direct powerscaling comparison between Humans and Pokemon, and between Human Weapons and Pokemon. It has multiple dozens of feats with links as proof. It's not accepted yet. So, could someone review it to determine if it's really correct, or i messed something up again?

 

[User_A_98732165489]

bump x1

 

[User_A_98732165489]

bump x2

 

[User_A_98732165489]

bump x3

 

[User_A_98732165489]

bump x4

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

This is an Onix upscale

 

[User_A_98732165489]

This is an Onix upscale

Normal Onix Has Small City durability (Low 7-B) according to his current profile - but in anime, he outright tanked 2 hits from rocket launcher. According to my considerably long list of feats, Humans and reasonably-sized Human Weapons consistently have "Large Mountain level+ to Island level Attack Potency (High 7-A+ to 6-C)" attacks/strikes/durability, which is orders of magnitude more.

As such, Anime's Onix is a lot stronger than Game's Onix. Profile split?

This is also upscale of nearly every Human in Pokemon universe. Which is a lot of them, as they scale off each-other. But also, this will definitely be useful in scaling Pokemon to one-another, by using upscaled Humans as reference point. Dunno which is more important.

 

[User_A_98732165489]

bump x5

 

[AyOgUyS]

Pokemon Origins File 2 / Marowak Incident​

Fine

The Case of the K-9 Caper / Colt M1911 Incident​

Disagree, I can be scared of something that won't actually harm me

Tentacool & Tentacruel / Whole Arsental Worth Of Guns​

Obvious disagree, Tentacool and Tentacruel were barely affected

Bye Bye Butterfree / Big Hammer​

Unsure

Dig Those Diglett! / Another Big Hammer​

Disagree

The Kangaskhan Kid / Tranquilizer Gun​

Disagree, we don't scale real tranquilizers to wall level

Princess vs. Princess / Mafioso Cosplay​

Disagree, this could have just been meaningless cosplay

To Master the Onixpected! / Rocket Mishap​

Fine ig

Bound for Trouble / Energy Cannon​

Disagree

Charizard Chills / Buzzsaw​

Disagree

Actually, I disagree with any of these with the reasoning of just "They attacked Pokemon with weapons meaning the weapons scale even if they don't do any damage"

 

[Eden_Warlock99]

Disagree, I can be scared of something that won't actually harm me

How exactly? Don't think I've ever seen someone have a disgust response to a Gun lol

 

[User_A_98732165489]

Tentacool & Tentacruel / Whole Arsental Worth Of Guns​

Obvious disagree, Tentacool and Tentacruel were barely affected

Misinterpreted that. I know that those precise Tentacool and Tentacruel weren't harmed since they were giant - but Nastina trying to shoot them regardless means that the regular (non-giant) Tentacool and Tentacruel could be damaged more likely than not.

Dig Those Diglett! / Another Big Hammer​

Disagree

Disagree why?

The Kangaskhan Kid / Tranquilizer Gun​

Disagree, we don't scale real tranquilizers to wall level

Em... It must piece or damage the skin, and Kangaskan's skin is absurdly tough.

Bound for Trouble / Energy Cannon​

Disagree

Disagree why?

Charizard Chills / Buzzsaw​

Disagree

Disagree why?

The Case of the K-9 Caper / Colt M1911 Incident​

Disagree, I can be scared of something that won't actually harm me

Pokemon act somewhat differently from Humans. For example, in Anime, there are cases of fully-evolved Pokemon simply pushing away non-evolved Pokemon at arm's or leg's reach while lower-evolved pokemon tries to push or wrestle; closest IRL Human equivalent of such reaction would be how brawny human in thick clothes reacts to angry, annoying, yet not particularly dangerous bird (e.g. goose, blackcock, rooster, etc). Pokemon actually start to taking their opponent seriously, if he's on same evolution - or at the very least, only 1 evolution behind; if they're scared of something, then that something is more-likely-than-not capable of damaging them - and at the very least, capable of damaging their pre-evolution.

Bye Bye Butterfree / Big Hammer​

Unsure

Unsure why? Starmie was damaged by that attack, and Misty had to heal it with water. Water in Pokemon universe is actually OK medicament, on level with proper potions.

Actually, I disagree with any of these with the reasoning of just "They attacked Pokemon with weapons meaning the weapons scale even if they don't do any damage"

People usually don't try to attack something with weapon, if said weapon is 100% incapable of dealing damage to target. E.G. when people shoot at tank or wall, they think that their gun is feasibly large to damage it. As such, it may count as feat.

Quite a lot of them seem to not have arguments - just Yes/No/Maybe.

 

[User_A_98732165489]

Also, what you think about Durability feats? There's even more of them. And we didn't even consider all Attack feats yet.

 

[GrayCraft_Dragon]

I don't mind the scaling here, but most of the Pokemon you mentioned here are 6-C; the pages for some reason aren't updated with the scaling.

 

[User_A_98732165489]

I don't mind the scaling here, but most of the Pokemon you mentioned here are 6-C; the pages for some reason aren't updated with the scaling.

Hm... If we update pages of corresponding Pokemon, many of them will become 6-C. And as such, all feats of them attacking someone will also be 6-C. As such, many "lesser" feats would also turn into 6-C.

Like, Snorlax shouldn't be weaker than Cubone - his stats are higher, he's a lot bigger, etc. And that's just one example of non-updated profile.

As such, Humans in Pokemon universe would most likely be 6-C Tier overall.

 

[AyOgUyS]

I'll respond later

 

[Hypertornado099]

I feel like these are more anti feats, I get the Pokemon world has futuristic tech but that doesn't make every single weapon stronger

 

[User_A_98732165489]

I feel like these are more anti feats, I get the Pokemon world has futuristic tech but that doesn't make every single weapon stronger

Feat=Able, Anti-Feat=Unable. I have few anti-feats - that is, cases of Humans being unable to do something. But much is actually feats - such as Humans being able to survive Pokemon attacks, or even remain standing after that; or Humans being able to damage Pokemon.

"Fainting/Blasting Off after being hit by Pokemon but not going splat" is still a Feat; anti-feat would be if Human gets maimed or killed by Pokemon attack.

Human weapons scale to one-another just like Humans do currently. Additionally, Human Weapons scale to Humans since most Human Weapons are compatible or superior to unarmed/melee Human attacks. In fact, even primitive weapons (e.g. batons, hammers, etc) are tremendously strong in Pokemon universe, and futuristic weapons should be comparable or superior.

 

[AyOgUyS]

About The Kangaskhan Kid / Tranquilizer Gun:

"For example, if a character withstands an explosion as their primary durability justification than the energy of the explosion that they tanked has hit them over a large surface area of their body. However if all of that energy were focused in an extremely narrow area of effect such as the width of a blade or the point of a needle - then the energy would more than likely pass through the character's body much easier. Even a weaker attack than the aforementioned explosion could do more visible damage by being concentrated.
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Durability#Surface_Area
Extremely fine attacks such as with monomolecular wire or extremely sharp blades may effortlessly slice or pierce a character without much energy being applied so additional context should be investigated when rating the AP of somebody who primarily attacks via this method.
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Durability#Surface_Area
This can also be an issue with giant-sized characters being harmed by somebody much smaller than them. A bee can inflict pain on a human without possessing attack potency anywhere comparable to a human's durability."

Dig Those Diglett! / Another Big Hammer​

The Diglett retreating doesn't mean the hammer scales. Realistically they have no way of knowing how strong it actually is until it hits them so like any normal animal, they decided to not take the risk.

Charizard Chills / Buzzsaw​

Did it actually hurt Charizard?

Viva Las Lapras / Cannon​

Did it actually hurt Lapras?

Pillars of Friendship! / Capital ship​

I highly doubt the Regis were anything more than annoyed

Pokémon: Mega Evolution Special III / Missile Submarine​

Giga outlier

Diancie and the Cocoon of Destruction / Second Capital Airship​

Elaborate on the "small damage"

 

[User_A_98732165489]

Pillars of Friendship! / Capital ship​

I highly doubt the Regis were anything more than annoyed
Giga outlier
Elaborate on the "small damage"

We have at least 3 categories: Capital Ships, Mechs and Other. And each has it's own scaling. Just because a large capital ship can damage Legendaries, doesn't mean that mechs or Humans can. If capital ship damages a Legendary, that's OK since they have their own scaling and are supposed to be strong; if Human damages Legendary, it's Outlier.

About The Kangaskhan Kid / Tranquilizer Gun:

"For example, if a character withstands an explosion as their primary durability justification than the energy of the explosion that they tanked has hit them over a large surface area of their body. However if all of that energy were focused in an extremely narrow area of effect such as the width of a blade or the point of a needle - then the energy would more than likely pass through the character's body much easier. Even a weaker attack than the aforementioned explosion could do more visible damage by being concentrated.
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Durability#Surface_Area
Extremely fine attacks such as with monomolecular wire or extremely sharp blades may effortlessly slice or pierce a character without much energy being applied so additional context should be investigated when rating the AP of somebody who primarily attacks via this method.
https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/Durability#Surface_Area
This can also be an issue with giant-sized characters being harmed by somebody much smaller than them. A bee can inflict pain on a human without possessing attack potency anywhere comparable to a human's durability."

Maybe something along the lines of "Unknown normally, Large Mountain level+ with Piercing"?

Charizard Chills / Buzzsaw​

Did it actually hurt Charizard?

It didn't hit Charizard, as he dodged and landed on his back - so we only have to guess whether or not it could have damaged Charizard if it did hit.

Viva Las Lapras / Cannon​

Did it actually hurt Lapras?

It didn't hit Lapras, as he dodged until pirates ran out of cannonballs - so we only have to guess whether or not it could have damaged Lapras if it did hit.

Dig Those Diglett! / Another Big Hammer​

The Diglett retreating doesn't mean the hammer scales. Realistically they have no way of knowing how strong it actually is until it hits them so like any normal animal, they decided to not take the risk.

Again, we have to guess whether or not it could have damaged Diglett.

Cases of perfectly good feats being worsened because someone missed or dodged are really common, but we have to use what we have. "Having to resort to less clear Feats and argue about them" is just as irritating for me as it is for you.

 

[User_A_98732165489]

bump x6

 

[AyOgUyS]

We have at least 3 categories: Capital Ships, Mechs and Other. And each has it's own scaling. Just because a large capital ship can damage Legendaries, doesn't mean that mechs or Humans can. If capital ship damages a Legendary, that's OK since they have their own scaling and are supposed to be strong; if Human damages Legendary, it's Outlier.

not an argument at all

Maybe something along the lines of "Unknown normally, Large Mountain level+ with Piercing"?

No because piercing a tiny amount of skin would require less energy, it wouldn't be Large Mountain+

It didn't hit Charizard, as he dodged and landed on his back - so we only have to guess whether or not it could have damaged Charizard if it did hit.

It didn't hit Lapras, as he dodged until pirates ran out of cannonballs - so we only have to guess whether or not it could have damaged Lapras if it did hit.


Again, we have to guess whether or not it could have damaged Diglett.

Cases of perfectly good feats being worsened because someone missed or dodged are really common, but we have to use what we have. "Having to resort to less clear Feats and argue about them" is just as irritating for me as it is for you.

appeal to possibility. We have no actual evidence it would have done any damage

 

[User_A_98732165489]

Maybe something along the lines of "Unknown normally, Large Mountain level+ with Piercing"?

No because piercing a tiny amount of skin would require less energy, it wouldn't be Large Mountain+

Well, this means that Piercing damage exists in Pokemon universe. So if Humans can damage Pokemon with raw force (e.g. bludgeons), then any Human who used some sort of sharp weapon would have "Higher with Piercing" in his Attack Potency.

 

[AyOgUyS]

Well, this means that Piercing damage exists in Pokemon universe. So if Humans can damage Pokemon with raw force (e.g. bludgeons), then any Human who used some sort of sharp weapon would have "Higher with Piercing" in his Attack Potency.

sure

 

[User_A_98732165489]

bump x7

 

[User_A_98732165489]

Well, that was most of Attack Power feats. We could keep talking about them, but...

What you think about Durability feats? There's even more of them, they're a lot more consistent, and most of them are not far-fetched. And keep in mind, Durability feats and Striking Power feats can double as each-other, since Durability scales off character's Striking Power and Striking Power may scale off Durability in some cases.

 

[AyOgUyS]

Well, that was most of Attack Power feats. We could keep talking about them, but...

What you think about Durability feats? There's even more of them, they're a lot more consistent, and most of them are not far-fetched. And keep in mind, Durability feats and Striking Power feats can double as each-other, since Durability scales off character's Striking Power and Striking Power may scale off Durability in some cases.

send me them

 

[User_A_98732165489]

Well, that was most of Attack Power feats. We could keep talking about them, but...

What you think about Durability feats? There's even more of them, they're a lot more consistent, and most of them are not far-fetched. And keep in mind, Durability feats and Striking Power feats can double as each-other, since Durability scales off character's Striking Power and Striking Power may scale off Durability in some cases.

send me them

[https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...y_feats_/_Humans_getting_hit_and_Blasting_Off]
There. My text has many parts; it's just that long.

 

[AyOgUyS]

[https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...y_feats_/_Humans_getting_hit_and_Blasting_Off]
There. My text has many parts; it's just that long.

most of it should be fine

 

[User_A_98732165489]

Well, 2 fine AP feats, 1 unsure-to-fine AP feat, a grab bag of fine Durability feats and grab bag of disagreed AP feats.

Now, it seems that Humans in Pokemon world would indeed be 6-C, since even after filtering out "incorrect" feats there's still overwhelmingly much feats suggesting 6-C.

However, Humans be even higher, or not? There is feat of being hugged by Team Rocket's Bewear and feat of being directly attacked by Legendary Pokemon in "Pokémon Legends: Arceus", both can be higher than 6-C. Those are Outliers or are fine?

Also, what about "petting hazardous Pokemon without getting hurt" feats? Like, petting Magcargo (10000 celsius) with only negligible burns would likely be Fire/Heat/Magma Resistance?

 

[User_A_98732165489]

bump x8

 

[AyOgUyS]

Also, what about "petting hazardous Pokemon without getting hurt" feats? Like, petting Magcargo (10000 celsius) with only negligible burns would likely be Fire/Heat/Magma Resistance?

yes

However, Humans be even higher, or not? There is feat of being hugged by Team Rocket's Bewear and feat of being directly attacked by Legendary Pokemon in "Pokémon Legends: Arceus", both can be higher than 6-C. Those are Outliers or are fine?

Team Rocket and Ash unironically have very consistent scaling to legendaries and arguably even the Creation Trio, I don't know about the Legends Arceus player but then again I'm 99% sure they do beat Giratina so...

 

[User_A_98732165489]

However, Humans be even higher, or not? There is feat of being hugged by Team Rocket's Bewear and feat of being directly attacked by Legendary Pokemon in "Pokémon Legends: Arceus", both can be higher than 6-C. Those are Outliers or are fine?

Team Rocket and Ash unironically have very consistent scaling to legendaries and arguably even the Creation Trio, I don't know about the Legends Arceus player but then again I'm 99% sure they do beat Giratina so...

Does that mean that Team Rocket/Ash and "Average Humans" would have different stats? Or everyone scale off Team Rocket/Ash, since they're not considered to be abnormally strong by universe's standarts, and other Humans are stronger still?

 

[AyOgUyS]

Does that mean that Team Rocket/Ash and "Average Humans" would have different stats? Or everyone scale off Team Rocket/Ash, since they're not considered to be abnormally strong by universe's standarts, and other Humans are stronger still?

only team rocket, Ash, Cynthia, and any other trainers who scale to them get big boy scaling

 

[User_A_98732165489]

Does that mean that Team Rocket/Ash and "Average Humans" would have different stats? Or everyone scale off Team Rocket/Ash, since they're not considered to be abnormally strong by universe's standarts, and other Humans are stronger still?

only team rocket, Ash, Cynthia, and any other trainers who scale to them get big boy scaling

So unless we forgot something, it looks somewhat like this:

Normal Human of Pokemon world have:

• Island level Attack Power and Striking Power (scaling off Island level Pokemon they damaged)
• Island level Durability (scaling off Island level Pokemon attacks of whom they survived; scaling off their own Attack Potency)
• FTL overall Speed (scaling off FTL-speed Pokemon they landed hits on and/or reacted to)
• Resistances on "petting hazardous Pokemon" cases. Such as Resistance to Fire/Heat/Magma due to petting Magcargo, Resistance to Electricity due to petting high-voltage Electric types, resistance to Poison due to petting Muk, some sort of resistances for petting Ghost Types with "haunting effect", etc.
• "Higher with Piercing" prefix if they have any sort of sharp weapon (e.g. knife, gun, axe, spear, sword, missile launcher, etc).

Team Rocket Trio, Ash, Cynthia, certain high-level martial arts/psionics/magic/Aura users, and other strong Humans have everything Normal Humans have, plus:

• Attack Power and Striking Power of, at the very least, Galaxy to High Universe level (scaling off Team Rocket's Bewear and many Legendary Pokemon). Likely Multiverse to Multiverse+ level (scaling off Creation Trio: Dialga, Palkia and Giratina).
• Durability of at the very least, Galaxy to High Universe level (scaling off Team Rocket's Bewear and many Legendary Pokemon; scaling off their own Attack Potency). Likely Multiverse to Multiverse+ level (scaling off Creation Trio: Dialga, Palkia and Giratina; scaling off their own Attack Potency).
• At least Massively FTL+, likely Infinite speed (comparable to Team Rocket's Bewear and Legendary Pokemon).

 

[User_A_98732165489]

bump x9

 

[AyOgUyS]

So unless we forgot something, it looks somewhat like this:

Normal Human of Pokemon world have:

• Island level Attack Power and Striking Power (scaling off Island level Pokemon they damaged)
• Island level Durability (scaling off Island level Pokemon attacks of whom they survived; scaling off their own Attack Potency)
• FTL overall Speed (scaling off FTL-speed Pokemon they landed hits on and/or reacted to)
• Resistances on "petting hazardous Pokemon" cases. Such as Resistance to Fire/Heat/Magma due to petting Magcargo, Resistance to Electricity due to petting high-voltage Electric types, resistance to Poison due to petting Muk, some sort of resistances for petting Ghost Types with "haunting effect", etc.
• "Higher with Piercing" prefix if they have any sort of sharp weapon (e.g. knife, gun, axe, spear, sword, missile launcher, etc).

Team Rocket Trio, Ash, Cynthia, certain high-level martial arts/psionics/magic/Aura users, and other strong Humans have everything Normal Humans have, plus:

• Attack Power and Striking Power of, at the very least, Galaxy to High Universe level (scaling off Team Rocket's Bewear and many Legendary Pokemon). Likely Multiverse to Multiverse+ level (scaling off Creation Trio: Dialga, Palkia and Giratina).
• Durability of at the very least, Galaxy to High Universe level (scaling off Team Rocket's Bewear and many Legendary Pokemon; scaling off their own Attack Potency). Likely Multiverse to Multiverse+ level (scaling off Creation Trio: Dialga, Palkia and Giratina; scaling off their own Attack Potency).
• At least Massively FTL+, likely Infinite speed (comparable to Team Rocket's Bewear and Legendary Pokemon).

it would vary depending on each individual character's feats

 

[User_A_98732165489]

So unless we forgot something, it looks somewhat like this:

Normal Human of Pokemon world have:

• Island level Attack Power and Striking Power (scaling off Island level Pokemon they damaged)
• Island level Durability (scaling off Island level Pokemon attacks of whom they survived; scaling off their own Attack Potency)
• FTL overall Speed (scaling off FTL-speed Pokemon they landed hits on and/or reacted to)
• Resistances on "petting hazardous Pokemon" cases. Such as Resistance to Fire/Heat/Magma due to petting Magcargo, Resistance to Electricity due to petting high-voltage Electric types, resistance to Poison due to petting Muk, some sort of resistances for petting Ghost Types with "haunting effect", etc.
• "Higher with Piercing" prefix if they have any sort of sharp weapon (e.g. knife, gun, axe, spear, sword, missile launcher, etc).

Team Rocket Trio, Ash, Cynthia, certain high-level martial arts/psionics/magic/Aura users, and other strong Humans have everything Normal Humans have, plus:

• Attack Power and Striking Power of, at the very least, Galaxy to High Universe level (scaling off Team Rocket's Bewear and many Legendary Pokemon). Likely Multiverse to Multiverse+ level (scaling off Creation Trio: Dialga, Palkia and Giratina).
• Durability of at the very least, Galaxy to High Universe level (scaling off Team Rocket's Bewear and many Legendary Pokemon; scaling off their own Attack Potency). Likely Multiverse to Multiverse+ level (scaling off Creation Trio: Dialga, Palkia and Giratina; scaling off their own Attack Potency).
• At least Massively FTL+, likely Infinite speed (comparable to Team Rocket's Bewear and Legendary Pokemon).

Click to expand...

it would vary depending on each individual character's feats

Well, currently, most Humans in Pokemon world power-scale from each-other, having almost identical stats by themselves. After update it would stop being a thing or not?

In other words: each Human would require his own feats, or Human feats would apply to every or nearly-every Human simultaneously?

In yet another words: to what degree Humans power-scale from each-other? E.G. Pokemon of same species usually powerscale from each-other unless noted otherwise, and Humans are members of same species - so logically Humans power-scale from Humans.

 

[AyOgUyS]

E.G. Pokemon of same species usually powerscale from each-other unless noted otherwise

I heavily disagree with how we scale Pokemon to each other on this site but unfortunately I don't have the actual power to do much (yet)

 

[User_A_98732165489]

bump x10

 

[Hypertornado099]

[https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...y_feats_/_Humans_getting_hit_and_Blasting_Off]
There. My text has many parts; it's just that long.

Team Rocket survives attacks from Pokemon all the time because that's their gimmick, Jessie and James are consistently hurt or threatened by much weaker things like falls