Existed Before Concepts

[The_Causality]

Exist Before Concept give you a resistance to Conceptual Manipulation? Because Nil existed before Concept of Time and "Something"

Touhou gods like Junko have a resistance to conceptual stuff due to precede concepts so i guess Other characters who precede concept should have a resistance

 

[The_Causality]

bump

 

[The_Causality]

bip

 

[Antvasima]

I am not sure. Sorry. You can ask Sera EX and some other knowledgeable staff members to comment here if you wish. They might be able to help.

 

[ZacharyGrossman273]

Depends

Arceus would if it does

 

[Kaltias]

About Nil specifically, no. Predating a type 3 concept in general doesn't mean much except predating its manifestations, given that both are born at the same time.

Predating a type 2 concept, idk, because "predating a concept" isn't really a thing in Platonism

 

[The_Causality]

About Nil specifically, no. Predating a type 3 concept in general doesn't mean much except predating its manifestations, given that both are born at the same time.

Can you explain the "predating its manifestation"? and what is the difference between predating a type 2/3 Concept since they didn't exist at first?

 

[Kaltias]

Sure.

Take the concept of "human".

The type 1 version is the abstract idea beyond dimensions. Completely unbound by anything that happens in existence. Destroying mankind does nothing to this concept.

Type 2 is pretty much the same, but works only up to a certain dimensional level. This is not affected by the destruction of mankind either. Both this and the type 1 concept predate mankind.

The type 3 concept was born alongside the first human. It wasn't a thing before that, because the Aristotelian concept of "human" is bound to the existence of mankind, while the type 1/2 variants are not.

The type 4 concept is essentially what people perceive as a human. As it based on perception, obviously this is bound to the existence of someone perceiving the object, and as such, this concept can't predate the object.

For example, take the dinosaurs. They predated the type 3/4 concepts of "human", because they predated mankind. Doesn't mean that they transcend concepts or anything, they are simply old.

 

[The_Causality]

Oh~~ a pretty good explanation

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[Antvasima]

Thank you for the help Kaltias.

 

[Wokistan]

I'd agree with Kal. In general, existing before a concept would not necessarily mean you're free of its influence once it is introduced.

 

[DMB_1]

The type 3 concept was born alongside the first human. It wasn't a thing before that, because the Aristotelian concept of "human" is bound to the existence of mankind, while the type 1/2 variants are not.

Wait, really? I thought that even type 3 existed as long as the existence of humans was possible.

 

[Kaltias]

Not quite. The type 3 concept of "human" is bound to the existence of humanity, because in Aristotle's philosophy, concepts define the object, but are also defined by it, it's a mutual thing.

Essentially, both sustain the existence of the other, while in Plato's philosophy, the concept is independent from the object it represents.