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Transdualism in WoD

Sera EX said:
That makes no sense. Transduality (which only should have one type btw) is not "only for 1-As". I feel like we're so "proud" of this tier that we assign powers or types of powers to it and only it.
No verse should ever become 1-A based off transdualism, plantonism, or any combination thereof. We're talking about attack potency here, and neither of the above grant anything AP-related.
Click to expand...
Wait , but if you transcend all dualities conceptually, you'd transcend the Duality between the concepts of Time and Space, making you 1-A.

You'd transcend many dualities which would put you into 1-A range.
 
I mean, Ultima himself made the tranduality revisions. I personally thought that the old transduality page was fine too, but im no expert on this topic
 
I do know. I was constantly pestered about it in the past on Discord while I was on hiatus. I also, clearly don't agree with it, as I don't with the current states of Concept Manipulation and Abstract Existence.
 
@Andy

I never approved of the current Transduality page. I wasn't even here when it happened. I was on hiatus dealing with personal issues.

@Udl

There's no duality between space and time. They aren't opposites or opposing factors.
 
@Sera I'm talking about approving type 3 in this thread despite type 3 currently requiring characters to be 1-A, which is the case regardless of if you personally disagree with current standards for transduality
 
EmperorRorepme said:
Does that mean revisions based on the terms of the pages are put on hold because you disagree? I mean iirc multiple staff agreed with it.
Click to expand...
No. I didn't say that.
 
So then by the current standards (which have not changed but may change in the future) this should be fine to apply, no? Because it's only your opinion which can make this go through now going off what Ant is saying.
 
@Sera

Would you be willing to help out the wiki by initiating improvement revisions to the instruction/policy pages in question? I would appreciate it.
 
The ones for transduality, conceptual manipulation, and abstract existence.
 
The problem here is it's hard for me to give a non-contradictory response (as Andy pointed out) when I find something fundamentally weong with the community's interpretations of the system. There's not much I can do about it. I'm asked to reply on these threads, and because I actially do want to help I'm not going to be a punk and just shrug off people's requests like that.

I don't have the energy to lead some crusade against the current standards, the future standards, or the interpretations of those standards - especially when the resistance is going to be strong on both sides. That doesn't mean I'm going to sit here and lie and support something I clearly don't agree with.
 
@HI3

I didn't say it was wrong. I'm just not going to lie. I literally don't have a card to play here.

If the majority (staff or otherwise) agree with the changes, then make the changes. I just was making it clear that as I said, I mostly agreed with Ultima (as I usually do about most stuff) but not 100%.

@Ant

I will eventually.
 
Then just be neutral? The changes were agreed to by staff, several staff at that, including Admins and at least 2 Bureaucrats.
 
So, it seems Sera's issue is that Type 3 isn't 1-A, however, this isn't an issue with WoD, but with the system, so for now, I believe everything is in order and we can get this over with.
 
@Sera

Thank you. Your help would be appreciated.

@Udlmaster

Well, I would prefer if there exists other more straightforward evidence for 1-A than the basis on a flawed explanation page.
 
Ant, you do realize that basically everyone who matters, sans Sera of course, agreed to the revisions to Transduality, including you if i remember correctly?
 
Well, is there any other proof for 1-A than transduality?
 
I am not sure of that. However, the fact that type 3 transduality was agreed to by several people who you generally trust and one of said people did the transduality revision, i'd say that 1-A via transduality is reasonable.
 
Hmm. It is a very extreme tier though. I am uncomfortable with assigning it based on flawed premises in our information pages.
 
Threat not all, there is another argument I have which is also agreed for 1-A as well.

The Supernal argument:

The Supernal contains all truths within it as Platonic Truths, and obviously, containing the Platonic concept of Time and Space within it, and thus, The Supernal is a 1-A realm, containing the Platonic concepts of Time and space and all other true things.
 
Well, I suppose that we will have to apply this then, but I am still rather uncertain if we are making a mistake.
 
Well from what I've read of the verse, WoD is just going to be downgraded when Ultima's revisions pass anyway.
 
It isn't a mistake, Ant. The overwhelming majority of people including mods who care to vote agree. A few are neutral. Whilst one mod disagrees with this and another disagrees with the standards themselves rather than this applying with the current standards.
 
Just because the majority of people agree with something, doesn't make it right. Udlmaster himself even said that's a fallacy. The majority have been wrong before, including myself, which has lead to mistakes in the past (especially regarding a particular group of people). Just making that clarification, I'm still fine with these being applied.
 
I agree, Majority shouldn't mean right, sadly, the upgrade system doesn't allow for debate, only for majority rule.
 
Ok that's true but a "voting system" it's how huge changes are applied with mods involved. Even you agree by the current standards the changes are fine. So we'll just have to wait if the standards change to see how that fairs against WoD.
 
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