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UI Daniel vs Yu (Lookism vs The Boxer)
- Thread starter StorytellingDemonKing
- Start date
DivineAura44
He/Him- 4,736
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Just wanna say I'm pretty sure reactions aren't equalized even in a speed equalized bout. I just don't see how Yu doesn't get bodied. Anything that Yu can do, Daniel should be able to copy including his reactions. The reactions thing seems more like a mindset and technique than stats meaning Daniel should be to copy. Even if it is a stats thing, Daniel has been shown to be able to copy that as well. Daniel also has experience against boxers like Johan Seong and Zack Lee. Meanwhile we've only seen Yu in a street fight at the beginning of the series. He's never faced Judo, Taekwondo, Systema, Karate, etc etc. so he'd be at a great disadvantage against a fighter who can pull out just about anything. However all of these advantages pale in comparison to Daniel's biggest advantage, LS. Even if we scaled Yu's LS to Viktor's, (who scales to a bear) Daniel would just have to grab him once to crush his bones through pure grip strength (an actual technique in the series).
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Ehhh. Johan copied a transformation of a perfect body. Daniel having better power copy than him makes sense, especially in UI mode. But I don't think he can copy Yu's reactions. If you want to argue about that, focus on just how far Yu's reactions scale.
Yu's kinda a maximum genius kinda guy. Jean is on Zack's level (Pre Heat and Path to Mastery) who are geniuses that can frankly smack anyone, and only get smacked by someone superior to themselves. I'm 100% sure Yu is fine with dealing with new martial arts and may even copy them. But I don't think he can use them any better though.
Don't think we can scale LS.
Yu's not gonna get bodied. But he's gonna struggle a lot
I'm so proud of you son
But fr tho focus on studying. I'm not gonna bother you with this match
Yu's kinda a maximum genius kinda guy. Jean is on Zack's level (Pre Heat and Path to Mastery) who are geniuses that can frankly smack anyone, and only get smacked by someone superior to themselves. I'm 100% sure Yu is fine with dealing with new martial arts and may even copy them. But I don't think he can use them any better though.
Don't think we can scale LS.
Yu's not gonna get bodied. But he's gonna struggle a lot
But fr tho focus on studying. I'm not gonna bother you with this match
azontr
He/Him- 39,510
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What do you mean being depressed and getting superpowers out of it isn't a technique.
It's not a technique.
DivineAura44
He/Him- 4,736
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When Daniel is getting bodied and speedblitzed by characters, only to come back dodging and blocking that means his reaction speed has increased. It's clear he can copy or at least improve reaction speed.
It's kinda hard to scale these characters skill (Jean and Zack) to each other.
I know, I'm saying in a hypothetical situation where we gave him the benefit of the doubt.
DivineAura44
He/Him- 4,736
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He does it all the time...I can agree that Daniel has way better copying then Yu but saying that he can copy Yu's reactions is some bullshit
I don't really care about the match but I just wanna clear that up.
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Well that one's fair actually.
But it's a case that Yu's reactions are higher than his speed so technically Daniel would only be able to copy his speed alone if he got any faster. But he has accelerated development anyway if he's pushed to the limit so he doesn't really need to copy
azontr
He/Him- 39,510
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No, it's not.
Improving one's speed through a form of accelerated development(something Yu can also do BTW), isn't skill copying.
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Nah I'm not agreeing he can copy Yu's reactions.
I'm agreeing on the fact that Daniel did speed Amp everything when he faced faster enemies before. But they're not Yu who has time dilated reflexes
azontr
He/Him- 39,510
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Honestly, the amount of misinformation being spread in this thread is really starting to irk me.
HOW does Daniel win this fight when Yu has dura neg, comparable accelerated development, and an initial far higher reaction speed that will allow him to dodge Daniel's attacks REGARDLESS of what Martial Arts he decides to pull out of his ass? One hit to the head is all Yu needs to destroy Daniel's brain.
HOW does Daniel win this fight when Yu has dura neg, comparable accelerated development, and an initial far higher reaction speed that will allow him to dodge Daniel's attacks REGARDLESS of what Martial Arts he decides to pull out of his ass? One hit to the head is all Yu needs to destroy Daniel's brain.
DivineAura44
He/Him- 4,736
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I'm not arguing he get time dilated reflexes. I'm arguing his reaction speed through copying would improve to the point of his reaction speed being near if not straight up equal.
azontr
He/Him- 39,510
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So would Yu's???
DivineAura44
He/Him- 4,736
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So your admitting they'd be equal in reaction speed???
azontr
He/Him- 39,510
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Don't misinterpret what I mean.
I'm saying that if Daniel's reactions grow to match Yu's, which they won't initially because Daniel's Accelerated Development isn't passive, Yu's will also grow. Yu has the initial advantage, which is all he needs because he has dura neg.
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Welp. Gotta fight now. Dangit.
Anyway.
Yu has never displayed improved accelerated development actively in combat. I don't know where that Aaron's tide is much faster than Yu is, but him adapting to dodge Aaron's punches was less him getting faster and him using techniques
Daniel's dura neg is immediate. Yu needs to hit something repeatedly on the same spot while Daniel can hit in any part.
One grab is all Daniel needs to catch Yu and after that he's kinda ******.
Also Daniel the moment he pushed to the limit activates. Any time someone pushes him to his limit he will adapt.
Anyway.
Yu has never displayed improved accelerated development actively in combat. I don't know where that Aaron's tide is much faster than Yu is, but him adapting to dodge Aaron's punches was less him getting faster and him using techniques
Daniel's dura neg is immediate. Yu needs to hit something repeatedly on the same spot while Daniel can hit in any part.
One grab is all Daniel needs to catch Yu and after that he's kinda ******.
Also Daniel the moment he pushed to the limit activates. Any time someone pushes him to his limit he will adapt.
azontr
He/Him- 39,510
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No, it wasn't.
No, he doesn't.
He can't, Yu has the initial speed advantage.
He'd be dead before then.
DivineAura44
He/Him- 4,736
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Both of them have dura neg actually. Matter of fact even if he didn't it doesn't take much for Daniel to counter a well placed gut shot my man. He's also dealt with people who've had Dura Neg before including an intense sparring sension with someone who uses it.
azontr
He/Him- 39,510
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Daniel's dura neg doesn't destroy organs. And even if he's "dealt" with them, it doesn't help against someone whose seeing him in slow motion who has superior dura neg.
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It was one quote from K that says "Aaron's attacks are impossible to dodge" and Yu has to have a similar degree of speed in order to match them.
Against enemies tankier than him yes.
Why speed advantage when speed equalized? Yu starts off with higher reactions. Btw I need you to display an actual ratio of how much faster Yu's reactions are compared to his attacks.
He needs time to activate accelerated development in his previous keys. UI Daniel is starting immediately with it.
He literally went for the liver on his weaker forms. Not to mention that's for all attacks, not repeated attacks.
Edit - Saw that I missed the second part. Yu has no active feats of him out accelerating the growth of enemies. He's always been holding back in times like with Jean and Yuto. If he really was adapting to Aaron he wouldn't need to deflect all his attacks in the first place and would just get faster and faster. Unless you want to argue that Aaron also has the same ability where neither was referenced
azontr
He/Him- 39,510
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Yu literally had to use incredibly precise attack redirection to avoid death.
Daniel's not tankier than Yu, in fact, Yu has an AP advantage.
I meant reaction speed advantage.
I made a post on it in another thread, let me find it.
It activates upon him being attacked by opponents faster than himself.
azontr
He/Him- 39,510
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That's called a Liver Shot. Yu's attacks bypass muscles/durability all-together and hit the organs directly.
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A degree of being close to the enemy's speed is needed in order to react to it. Even if he could which is already pushing it, Daniel still has a more consistent accelerated growth.
Tell me the scaling chain again? The current scaling chain for this feat is Vasco performs casually < Vasco's strongest attacks < Daniel Heat Mode < UI Daniel
Then that's fair. However Daniel will grow faster.
Take your time.
Alongside the fact that if he's pushed to the very limits and activates Heat Mode. (IE with Zack, Hudson, Samuel, Gun,)
Fair enough but it's more Systema I'm talking about that can bypass Logan's defenses repeatedly. Same way that Yu does honestly if not superior for not needing that.
Yu needed repeated attacks in order to bypass someone stronger than him on the very same point. Also that's not entirely ignoring durability but him having to repeatedly attack the same spot again and again. Any other person he oneshots by being stronger.
Daniel however will adapt. Instinctive reaction and all. Not to mention it's a horrible idea to attack again and again on a spot when KPopGarou would just grab Yu and again. Yu has no answer for LS.
Hope you're happy.
Popted2
He/Him- 8,550
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yeah and for example he can use it to hit the heart directly like he did on Aaron, so it doesnt require multiple shots nor its only for the liver
to respond to COB
azontr
He/Him- 39,510
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If your opponent moves so fast that you literally can't dodge it, and have to narrowly deflect their fist with your own with such precision that if you mess up even once your fist would explode, you were blitzed. It's not that hard.
It says even more when you consider that Yu's reaction speed wasn't enough to simply cleanly dodge Aaron's attack, and he got blitzed through even that, and still adapted to surpass Aaron barely an attack or two later.
0.013 tons <= Victor <<< Yu.
He has to actually survive to grow faster, something that's not gonna happen when Yu has an immense initial reaction speed advantage and better dura neg.
Yu is capable of cleanly dodging punches from professional boxers despite said punches being said to be impossible to dodge so easily for normal people, doing so blatantly effortlessly, even stating that it was akin to him already knowing the fist was coming when it was mere inches away from his face, and coming from someone who could've splattered his head.
States he sees things at such a speed that he can actually get bored waiting for attacks a very short distance away from himself to hit him. (He was letting himself be attacked here).
Stated once again to perceive the world's time at a speed far slower than normal, and was dodging attacks that blatantly came from all directions against an opponent that was stated to also be capable of splattering his head. While this feat is done in his last key, as noted on the profile, his reactions gimmick and skills do not fluctuate throughout the series, so it is very much applicable to earlier keys.
Stated to perceive the world in a different dimension of time.
States he sees things at such a speed that he can actually get bored waiting for attacks a very short distance away from himself to hit him. (He was letting himself be attacked here).
Stated once again to perceive the world's time at a speed far slower than normal, and was dodging attacks that blatantly came from all directions against an opponent that was stated to also be capable of splattering his head. While this feat is done in his last key, as noted on the profile, his reactions gimmick and skills do not fluctuate throughout the series, so it is very much applicable to earlier keys.
Stated to perceive the world in a different dimension of time.
Taken from another thread. (NOTE: Don't take me saying his reactions gimmick doesn't fluctuate as "he doesn't get faster", that was just me saying feats from later keys are applicable to his earlier keys, as is noted on the profile itself).
He hit Aaron in the chest once and ruptured his heart, to the point doctors were barely able to save him, putting the man in a coma that doctors didn't know if he'd ever wake up from.
It doesn't require multiple hits to vital areas. Yu was just never hitting Aaron in those areas until the end of the fight.
Read above.
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He was chipping at his entire left body the entire time. His heart being on the left side is fine.
If Yu could've just oneshot him from the start by attacking the heart it wouldn't make sense. That said if you want to argue that's the trigger for his accelerated development which was never referenced to work in a match, it still takes more time to activate than Daniel's that activates within moments on previous keys.
Whoops missed an edit there.
It says even more when you consider that Yu's reaction speed wasn't enough to simply cleanly dodge Aaron's attack, and he got blitzed through even that, and still adapted to surpass Aaron barely an attack or two later.
To call it a blitz is a bit too much. Yu the entire time was able to react to it. The one who said it was impossible to react was K but can we say with certainty that K was right when Yu literally proves him wrong? Yu's done that before too. Like back when K questions Yu on his fight with Yuto where "he's running out of steam" before he proceeds to just **** up ma boi Yuto.
K says this in response to a monster like Aaron finally going all out. Yeah no normal boxer or even genius boxer can deal with that. But just because it's impossible for them doesn't mean it's impossible for Yu who's said to treat time slowly with his reflexes.
Higher durability + instinct + damage reduction (I'd say attack reflection but it's better to rely on reduction). Yu would have to tag Daniel. There's also nothing stopping from Daniel taking the hit and grabbing Yu the moment it happens. Yu still has to hit Daniel with his fists in order to deal damage.
Gotcha thanks for the chain. Daniel's scaling is off of 0.038 tons however
This is solid and good. However. We do not have an exact metric here. It would be better if even at a certain point time stopped for him. But he's already faster than almost every enemy he ever faced.
Yu was hitting Aaron the entire time on his left side. The narrative (Chapter 89) had to emphasize that the match was coming to a close the more and more damage both fighters accumulated. Yu had to actively wear down Aaron. Frankly if Yu oneshot him from the very start I'd also find it questionable why he had the whole "First hit on Aaron was like hitting a wall"
There is a big nail to this coffin though.
Yu has to hit Daniel in order to harm him.
But what is he going to do if Daniel just grabs his fist the moment he makes contact? It doesn't matter what reactions you have. If their speed is the same from the start, and if Daniel just speed amps anyway, he's going to grab him. This is a very frequent thing he'd do to any enemies. And if Yu gets grabbed things are bad.
Daniel can also just use the same exact durability negating attack against him, though to be honest he already doesn't need that.
Also Yu looks like he needs high pain tolerance to pull off what he did in his bout with Aaron. But FictionalSystema itself focuses on making you feel hurt regardless of the damage.
To be honest I'd settle with a tie to halt this thread if you want. You did say you rather study and tbh I need to work on a project too myself. Only reason why I debated was cause of Divine
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Video unavailable? That's one hell of a reaction I'd say
DivineAura44
He/Him- 4,736
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My problem with Yu's dura neg is that he needs a clean hit, something he only got against Aaron Tide because Aaron let him. Simply chipping at Daniel isn't gonna work against him.
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I'll be honest even knowing that I don't know what kind of a reaction that is lol, looking at the lyrics.
azontr
He/Him- 39,510
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DivineAura44
He/Him- 4,736
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I think Daniel has a far clearer path to victory with way more (plausible) wincons. Hate to be the bearer of bad news but I'm voting Daniel.
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Sick. Tie FR
azontr
He/Him- 39,510
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DivineAura44
He/Him- 4,736
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For reasons what? You need to put units
DivineAura44
He/Him- 4,736
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Because I have better things to do then argue who's dick is bigger my guy.You say this and left all the real debating to @CoreOfimBalance(COB)work on your smoke generation
azontr
He/Him- 39,510
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Yu's
